Quote:
Originally Posted by tirod
Here's the view of an older hot rodder - from the street level.
The point of the discussion is really which motor can the average guy build to get horsepower. Mod motors are factory motors, and it's the only choice the factory has to race with or make cars. That's based on 1) cost 2) emissions. It's what Ford decided it needed to work with going forward. These cam motors do well in factory hands, and yes, make a lot of horsepower - with a highly trained and degreed engineering staff behind it.
For the guy on the street - it's much different. He hears about his neighbor's truck spitting plugs out the block, the intake leaking antifreeze, the plastic manifold, and lord help the guy who flips off the cam chains - there's no index marks to time it back again, it's a $350 min machine shop charge locally. Those in the know still have to buy the $150 kit to clamp the cams down.
It Is Not User Friendly.
Look at the other side of the VS - a Dart block? We're talking aftermarket support so deep you can pick and choose non Ford blocks to whatever level of horsepower you need. All it takes is money, whether in cubic yards or a credit limit. What you can get is a 427 - from a 351W. It can be a crate block built for racing, with seriously cast and hand ported heads, plus all the allied parts specifically developed, and most of them waiting on the shelf.
Mod motors don't have that depth of parts or support on the market. In a large degree, it doesn't exist because the cars that debuted with them came at a time when severely restrictive emissions laws were in place, and very few could do much with them. But - the Windsor motors go back to the '60s, and so do the cars that had them. All those owners aren't moving up to mod motors. There's no reason to, unlike the pre 63 owners who largely dumped the Y block back then, and even lately, the FE's.
Mod motors are what you are forced to buy in a car to meet draconian emissions standards, Windsors are what somebody builds to have fun at the track, strip, cruising, at shows, etc. because HE can screw it together and not pay a mechanic or buy expensive tools.
I'm glad I'm not stuck with a mod motor or a car that's required to use it. |
Tirod makes some good points here. the engine has had more than it's share of whoopses along the development path - that's for sure and the bad news. The good news is all the guys who have gone before you have already noodled out the fixes for these problems including Ford. The engine as it stands today in factory supercharged trim is exceptional both in terms of components and in durability.
From an aftermarket block standpoint there are alternatives to the Ford offering - although the FGT versions are stunningly good blocks. World Products has made blocks for Sean Hyland who currently is the source for the block. They are reportedly good for 2000+ HP. They look like miniature Keith Black blocks but for Mod Motors. Ford does not ignore the engine either. They actually offer several performance versions available in both aluminum and a special high strength cast iron.
In the end however it is not a matter of what the guys before you did or even the factory,
it all comes down to what you want for your personal engine in your car - and no one is better qualified to make that determination than you. That means that what ever you choose to do is automatically right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rog246
The problem we have in Oz is that we can't register a Cobra replica as a 64-67 model car-the rego authorities here just won't allow it. That being said the engines we use MUST pass specific emission rules, which vary from state to state-hence people looking at alternative power sources-including those supplied by Govt. Motors !!-Bleah ! 
It now comes down to being expedient to get the mongrel registered. But as I previously said I'm more than happy to use a Mod motor, and 6 speed g'box and rear gears anything from low 3's to 4.6:1 to match what I'm doing at the time-and not run outta rev's 
Rog |
Rog, is suffering under the heavy hand of a Dept of Motor Vehicles misplaced nanny-state initiative that trys to protect us from things that can't hurt us. The amount of emissions that the Cobra replicas contribute to the air quality in Australia is a distinction without a difference. That said they are still the ones that make the rules so he is stuck in the uncomfortable position of having to comply with them.
Those nanny-state rules are the primary reason so many Chevrolet powered Cobras exist is OZ. Ford was slow on the draw with their "green" crate engines and the builders filled the vacuum with the only alternatives available to them - can't really blame them for that.
Today it is a different story because Ford finally caught on and got their keyster in gear. The current blown versions of the Mod Motor still need some after market loving but precious little. The complexity of working with the electronics has been substantially mitigated by aftermarket software that can manipulate the tuning variables to your heart's content and Ford even sells complete versions of the electronics stripped down to meet the demands of kit car builders. It is a different world than it once was.
In the final analysis though, the correct engine is whatever the builder wants for his personal ride. Always has been and hopefully always will be.
Ed