### Power Steering 460

[sspano01]

Hi Folks,

I've been wrestling with power steering on my cobra since nearly day 1.
I have 429/460 block in my cobra and started with the March brackets, saginaw power steering pump, and mustang ii rack.

The main issue was that the power steering pump, was too large and never fit right. The march brackets wanted to put the pump too low. And there was really no good way to mount the pump and be able to get tension.

I have a setup that worked for about 1500 miles or so, and then started throwing belts every 200-300 miles. Mostly due to tension, belt would slack a bit, start wobbling, and blow off.

Fast forward....I think I now have the final solution! (And no its not manual steering)

I looking around the web, I came across some info on Volvos.
The volvo S40/S60 uses an electro-hydraulic power steering pump. Basically, a standard power steering pump that runs with electricity. Varys from about 10 amps to 80 amps. 80 amps only at full lock if you crank the wheel all the to the right or left.

The pump has two connectors, power and ground for the main power.
Then an "on" signal from the ignition, and two CANBUS signals for the volvo ecm.
The pump starts up after 2 seconds, without canbus and runs at a constant rate.



Details from volvo thread

Volvo electro hydraulic power steering - Page 3 - DIY Electric Car Forums

volvo wiring harness for the main 2-pin power/ground input
volvo part# 30775461

the three pin connector is part of the main wiring harness, so you would need to take that out of a volvo. I am using a single crimp connector on pin #1 of the three pin connector for my ignition signal, until I get to a junkyard to see if I can find an exact connecto match.

the pump response feels great, not jittery or slugish when driving.

the pump provides that CANBUS interface for the volvo ecm....now
If anyone has access to some volvo engineering documents - it would be great to get the "command specification" for the pump. The ECM tells the pump to change its speed based on the speed of the car/etc so you can have dynamic control over the power steering response. I own an engineering company and we could easily make a little CANBUS controller to tell the pump what to do with itself. But we would need the protocol spec - or a volvo S40/S60 that I can put some engineering equipment on and reverse engineer the command set.

Even without CANBUS, the pump response is great and I love it.
And it doesn't use a belt
I could probably shut it off as well with a large relay and gain 5-10 horsepower as well :P

Pump cost $150 on ebay from nationwide auto parts.
Iteresting....it was listed for a VolvoS40/S60 - but it has FORD stampings on it !!


Here are installs pics from my Cobra. I made a little bracket to bolt to the water pump and the OEM bracket that has little rubber shock mounts that then holds up the pump.

IMG_0998 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
IMG_0999 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
IMG_1001 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
IMG_1002 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
IMG_0997 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

If anyone is having pump/fitment issues - maybe this could help you out?

[Jeff Frigo]

Simple solution, take it off.

[sspano01]

i'm spoiled - i like the ps/pb

[WardL]

I would like PS, but want the all-electric version. I don't know why I want the electric version because I don't know what I'm talking about... I do autocross and the club likes to try things. One weekend we set it up where we did 3 laps, back to back. After three laps I was exhausted and my arms felt like rubber. Ha, ha, ha... I know, I need to get in the gym more!

[xlr8tr]

Fast Freddie's Fabrications - Electro-Hydraulic Power Steering

[littlewave]

Manual steering in these cars is the best way to go. Car weighs nothing.
90" wheel base, and lots of HP. Power steering in one of these can get you in trouble real quick!

[xlr8tr]

my steering is crazy heavy. I would have real difficulty doing autocross. And I am NOT a wimp!

[Silverback51]

[littlewave]

:lol:

Originally Posted by silverback51

:lol:

[Xack]

Sirs:
a 460 with cast block and heads is not light. It's a far cry from weighing "nothing". If you have a BB Ford you need Power steering. If you have an aluminum block and aluminum heads, well, you may have it.

[sspano01]

that is why I want to get the canbus protocol for the volvo pump! It would be great to have it assisting at speeds < 30 mph and then have it start backing off the assist above 30 mph. At highway speed, 50+ I agree you dont need power steering. but in a parking lot, autocross/etc - it is great to have! I could put a power switch in-line so you could shut off the pump I suppose.

When I was using the saginaw pump provided by March for the original pully kit, the power steering had too much assist and you did have to be careful. I think the volvo pump is more in the 500-700psi range, and to me, it feels almost perfect.

i have a 460/521 with aluminum top end, it is alot of weight over the front wheels

[sspano01]

i can bicep curl 60 pounds too - LOL

[Don]

sspano01......an alternative is the PS pump used in NASCAR and other race series, I don't have the details on model numbers etc.

[sspano01]

Hi Don, i tried using a small pump with a remote tank for the fluid. It worked better than the large saignaw, but i still had issues keeping the belt tension - result still was throwing belts

[Silverback51]

Originally Posted by Xack

Sirs:
a 460 with cast block and heads is not light. It's a far cry from weighing "nothing". If you have a BB Ford you need Power steering. If you have an aluminum block and aluminum heads, well, you may have it.

Mine's a cast block with aluminum top end, and I don't have any problems with it at all. And that's with the sticky BB's or Avon tires.

And I forgot to mention that I'm closer to 61 than 60 also.

[sspano01]

i did get used to it for a while, but i would imagine the 460 in a manual steering cobra with the proper manual ratio rack would be better than a 460 with a non-powered-power-steering rack.