Does anyone make a rev kit for a 460?

[ac andy]

Hi guys, just wondering if anyone is using a rev kit in a 460 and if so, where did you get it from? i havent been able to find one in all of my searching, thanks in advance,

Andy.

[lovehamr]

If you're using CJ heads then you may find what you need here:

http://www.jonkaaseracingengines.com...tudgirdles.php

Steve

[ByronRACE]

What do you mean by rev?

6K?
7K?
8K?
9K?

What you need varies considerably depending on your intention and may touch everything from the oiling system to the valvetrain, rods, crank, bearings...you name it.

If you're talking purely valvetrain stability, Jomar makes girdles.

It would be better to outline your build and intention so I could speak more intelligently about what I'd do if it was mine.

B

[blykins]

I think he's talking about a rev kit, to keep the lifters down against the cam lobes.

[ac andy]

Hi guys, my engine builder wanted me to source a rev kit to keep the push rods from moving about. There are plenty available for chevs but a cant seem to find any for the 460. He now thinks that the platinum roller rockers that we are using with a girdle should be okay.

Combo is 460 block with Edelbrock alloy heads, retro hydraulic roller cam, eight throttle body fuel injection, ligtened, balanced crank etc, good for road and track. Probably about 600hp. Bullnose toploader and 9inch diff centre in independant rear end.

Andy.

[vector1]

go to the above link at jon kaase and ask that organization, they build a bunch of those motors. allied in st. charles had 5 or 6 460 blocks they were machining for a patented main cap install for him.

[ByronRACE]

There's other block mods you should probably consider if you're going to turn enough rpm where that's a problem, but since it's mostly valvetrain you're addressing, I'd recommend some steel rockers, a jomar girdle, and beefy push rods if you're going to push it. Nothing is going to move around with that stuff. I've had mine to 7500rpm without issue using the above. Solid roller.

Since you're hydraulic roller, you're limited to 6000-6200 rpm anyway, and the lobes are very tame. I question whether or not a girdle is going to be necessary in this application. There's a few hundred (if not thousand) guys that operate 385 series Fords in this RPM band without such things and without issues. Check out the engine build section of 460ford.com. I really don't think I'd spend the money there, but instead buy high quality rockers and beefy pushrods, and the best lifters money can buy...and leave it at that.

Additionally, you may want to ask the question regarding hydraulic retrofit rockers on that forum above. They are not terribly popular due to the resulting valvetrain geometry that causes wear and stability issues in the first place; perhaps that's why your builder is seeking a solution. However, the root of the problem is not that the valvetrain itself is inherently unstable; it's probably due to the geometry that results when you do the hydraulic retrofit. Most of these guys either run solid roller or solid flat, and have good reasons for it. It would be worth a conversation with a few of the guys that do this for a living; Kaase is a great resource if you can get a minute with him on the phone.

When I originally did my build, I was teetering between the hydraulic roller and solid roller, after reading a ton, and asking the question, and getting some very good arguments presented against hydraulic roller, I opted for solid. There are MANY more cam grinds available now for solid roller that have very tame lobe profiles due to the popularity of roller cams in street cars. You may want to consider that path...a very mild lobe and a solid roller lifter gives you RPM capability and will remain very stable only requiring a check/adjustment once a winter on a nice-day-driver type car. You really should be taking a look at the internals and springs once a year anyway...why not adjust the valvetrain while you're there.

[Tom Wells]

Andy,

Byron's giving good advice.

So I have to raise my hand on the other side of the room

I use a Crane hydraulic roller setup, #359351. It has more than 20,000 miles, combined street (mostly) and track. I like it a lot!

to keep the push rods from moving about

Did you mean what I would call pushrod guide plates like these perhaps?

429/460 Ford Guide Plates and Rocker Studs

I chose this URL for the photo - I use the 3/8" but not from Speedway. Much better to get them from Ford Racing parts or Jegs or Summit.

Ain't this fun?

Tom

[ByronRACE]

I just thought I'd ad that when we built my engine, I purchased several sets of guide plates for the push rods, none of which fit correctly and caused fit/rub problems. Eventually, after speaking with a few pro builders, I came to the conclusion that the right way to do this is to cut the guide plates in half, position them at the correct locations, then tig them back together when bolted in place. That's what I did, and apparently is pretty common.

I'm really glad to hear of such great success on a hydraulic roller setup. I'm very much in love with the 385 series Ford, and after having built my engine, I really rather would have gone hydraulic if it were not for the opinions offered by several of the folks on 460ford.com. I don't have much reason to rev beyond 6K...my eyes were bigger than my stomach in more ways than one during my build. I installed lifter bushings in all 16 locations on my engine to restrict top end oiling and now can no longer consider the hydraulic option; the oiling orifices are too small. I'll be upgrading to the new Isky solid lifters this winter (the ones without needle bearings), to eliminate that possible failure mode in my mostly street application. Having all the little needles fall out and go through the motor is a very not good mode.

The cush of a hydraulic setup, with the roller on the end to eliminate the worry about cam break-in or wiping a lobe with these new oil formulations is a great combo if you can get around the "apparent" geometry worries. Do your own research, I simply trusted the opinions of these guys...that doesn't necessarily mean that it can't be done. With 20K miles on the clock without incident or abnormal wear, I think it's pretty clear it can be done! If my engine lives 20K miles, I'll be ecstatic...so I consider that kind of success very significant indeed.

Byron

[CHANMADD]

A rev kit is a set of springs that sits on top of the lifters and presses against the bottom of the head to keep the lifter tightly against the cam, The push rod sits in the middle of the spring, and as such the "Rev Kit" has not much to do with the guide plates or rockers or stud girdles.The rev kit springs are only needed when you are going to turn high RPM's with a fairly agressive cam so the the heavier roller lifters stay in contact with the cam and don't start bouncing at high RPM.
John

[ac andy]

Thanks for the fantastic response guys. I did email Jon Kasse a couple of weeks ago but havent received a reply yet, thats ok, everything takes time for us big block owners in Oz. Chanmadd is spot on with the description of the rev kit, and i agree with Byron, if i am revving it over 6000 i may be also looking for a larger set of balls to sit in the seat with me!

Andy.