You seem to be pulling this from somewhere I believe the only commentary posted on the video (and not even here I might add) was on YouTube and it stated:
"Tony Martin driving a Backdraft TD car passing a Superformance GT40 for
the win, during The Mitty at Road Atlanta."
What part of this is misleading or inaccurate?
I dunno, maybe the YELLOW FLAG pass!!! Certainly Tony is a VERY fast driver (I am NOT) but the race was shortened one lap and the entrants were not told. The GT driver thought he had another lap. Could he have caught and passed Tony? I don't know, perhaps not.
All I am saying is this must be viewed in context. It was NOT as demonstration of one brands superiority over any other brand. It was an extra race with no points that many competitors chose not to enter thus saving wear and tear, tires etc. Did the BDR pass Mr. Olthoff at speed? (Note: Only this last question is meant to be "wise-ass", there is no hard feelings with me and as I offered in a previous thread, I would be pleased to buy you a drink at Carlisle)
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[quote=Cashburn;1049233]Perhaps Mr. Othoff should field a Cobra? I guess the bar you sit at is rather lonesome (there's my wise ass reply).
QUOTE]
Cashburn,
You are really tiring. You are a poor ambassador for your product. I wouldn't buy a thing from you. Why don't you start telling folks why Backdrafts are great. Leave out the snide remarks about other products. Running down everyone who doesn't own your product (potential future customers) is an interesting way to sell it.
By the way, I found a writeup of Saturday's race. Looks like the Superformance Cobra kicked your guy's butt. Olthoff in the GT40 was simply in another league. Different car. But Cobra vs. Cobra --- read it and weep...
The flag dropped and Dennis Olthoff in his Superformance GT took the lead. Going up the hill through the esses he spun out into the grass and got back on the track in fourth position. Within three laps he had regained the lead that he never relinquished. By the time it was over the Superformance GT40 driven by Dennis Olthoff showed the way to the finish line and his Superformance roadster finished in third place. The Backdraft cars finished 9th and 35th.
Jack,
Appreciate the info. I think other comments are skewing what I am sharing here. And please if you feel I am making snide remarks about another product then show me, until then my message is, and I will underline and bold it so it's not missed...
GREAT TO SEE 2 MANUFACTURERS FIELDING RACE EFFORTS.
This is the first time the BDR cars were welcomed to this event in the HSR series and it was under an exhibition nature. There was a tremendous effort put on by Backdraft to prep. the cars and get to the event in time and that deserves kudos.
Let me type it one more time... since this is a great thing for the future of both.
GREAT TO SEE 2 MANUFACTURERS FIELDING RACE EFFORTS.
Last time I checked SPF didn't offer a dedicated "ringer" of a track car that can't be licensed for the street driven by a professional driver. But the real problem, as I see it, it the constant press release BS about how anybody could simply buy a stock licensed for the street BDR and duplicate the results.
Good marketing approach though, win on Sunday, sell on Monday. But like NASCAR, don't expect all of us to buy into the hype of a "ringer" car and "ringer" driver and then go down to our local car dealer and buy the same car and get the same results.
Last time I checked SPF didn't offer a dedicated "ringer" of a track car that can't be licensed for the street driven by a professional driver. But the real problem, as I see it, it the constant press release BS about how anybody could simply buy a stock licensed for the street BDR and duplicate the results.
Good marketing approach though, win on Sunday, sell on Monday. But like NASCAR, don't expect all of us to buy into the hype of a "ringer" car and "ringer" driver and then go down to our local car dealer and buy the same car and get the same results.
Ex, you're not making any sense. There is no ringer car except in your mind. The TD car is what it is. You are thinking of an entirely different car (or cars) that are not even part of this discussion. The TD cars can be licensed for the street and have been.
Again, do the reading and perhaps go see the cars ... then you are totally entitled to call BS. Until then, enjoy the show.
As for a "ringer" driver I think you are skewing that as well. I suppose hiring a pro driver to come in and clean the field would be a ringer. I'd like to think it is a MAJOR positive for the company and product as a whole that the pro-driver happens to be the man in charge of the design and production of the product. Now that's marketing beyond winning on Sunday...
If I were in business and my model was to race, win and sell cars, I'd hire the best driver I could as well. And of course give him the best possible car with all the best options setup professionally with all the tricks. Naturally a dedicated race car that cannot be licensed for the street.
,,,makes perfect sense, for a marketing plan. Works pretty well for NASCAR and the dealers as well. Proven method!
Everyone is taking this BDR Cobra versus SPF GT40 thing too seriously. We all know my KMP would kick both their butts in a race. As long as I'm not driving it.
I think it is better marketing to have a competent driver perform extremely well in a product the customer can literally buy and through skill development and tuning perform better than most.
And beyond that to stay within most characteristics of the street model that 99% of customers would buy. You can say this about the BDR but not about the Ford running Daytona...
The whole concept of seeing all these Cobras on the track was something I did not expect when I went to Road Atlanta on Saturday. It was great. Previous Mitty's had the odd "real" Cobra on the track. That was great to see, but all the Backdraft and Superformance entries (Cobra and GT40) was spectacular. I am very appreciative of the factories for doing it.
Along with the factorys having displays in the infield and all the private cars showing up, this was a great, memorable event.
Where else in the country is will this show be seen?
The fact that I own a Superformance gave me a rooting interest to cheer about.
Hey, lets get some Factory Five's out there.
These cars sound great. A track full of this stuff would blow the old Trans-Am away.
By the way, I think I saw street license plates on the Backdrafts. I don't think anything would keep you from licensing any of these things for the street in lots of places. The Mitty is such a great event. You can see all the cars up close. Everybody it cool about it. Look as close as you like - don't touch.
Factory Five also sells a dedicated race car version of their street car. You could also license the race version FFR, but why would you? It would be rather silly to buy the stripped down version and then add all the stuff required to make it street legal. That is why by far the bulk of the sales of either company is not the race car, it's the STREET version, which comes ready to license. The race only version of any manufactured car is a very limited market. It's a good marketing ploy, but a bad business model if that is the only thing you offered.
FFR's approach is a low cost race car alternative primarily for a certain class. Shelby does the same thing, on a high dollar level, a specific race car version for a specific class.
JBL could be added to the mix. They never intended to sell very many of their cars, which are primarily "race cars" that are meant to be licensed for the street. But those cars are hardly JBL's bread and butter, it's just a side line for them. An interesting egineering achievment. Which no doubt, would kick any other Cobras butt on the track,,, in street trim, licensed, drive to the track, kick butt, take names, drive home. I can imagine an extreme light weight Kirkham with all the race goodies. Now THAT would be a race worth watching! Bring on the JBL's, the Shelby's, the FFR's and the BDR race prepped cars, ye haw!
On any given Sunday, it's all about the class, the driver, the preparation and the marketing BS when the smoke has cleared.
Last edited by Excaliber; 05-07-2010 at 11:11 AM..
FFR calls their version the"Challenge" car. At $14.9K it just about half the cost of a comparable race only BDR.
Quote:
Challenge cars have been dominant in racing classes across the country for more than 7 years. Ford Racing selected a Challenge car to serve as one of the 2006 Champ Car “Fast Laps” car. Challenge cars have earned top spots in local and national level SCCA and NASA roadracing series.
Strangely, you don't see FFR reps on Club Cobra much promoting their race car and it's impressive list of win's. Street cars are their bread and butter, their race record speaks for itself.
At a recent Auto Cross event here in Oregon I watched a licensed STREET FFR run against this custom V8 powered Lotus 7 like car: The V8 Lotus turned the fastest time of the day, 1.01. The FFR? 1.03!!! I was blown away that the FFR, in STREET TRIM was even able to challenge the V8 Lotus. A very impressive run. Both drivers were very experienced and very good. The FFR is an early Mark 1, typical street car, 351 with a carb, T5, DOT tires, license plate. It was NOT even a "Challenge" race car!!
Last edited by Excaliber; 05-07-2010 at 12:19 PM..
Cobra Make, Engine: Three Cobras, one 351W, one 427SO, one 527BB & one GT-40 427R
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I have an idea...
Emotions are running high and keyboards seem to magnify them. This will go no where fast, but, I have an idea.
The upcoming Run and Gun has always been the benchmark for replica competition and revered for the shining light they cast onto the replica car world, giving them the sort of validity many other venues might not project.
So my idea is to have a manufacturers class at the upcoming Run and Gun. I have talked with Dean Lampe on this, among other ideas and he liked what he heard, provided there is the participant interest to support it.
The Manufacturers class would entail any replica manufacturer to bring a stock off the shelf street production car and compete in a class just for that. The other competing manufacturers would have the opportunity to look over and inspect each other's car to ensure it was indeed a normally produced production car with no special gimmick or Smokey Yunik type modifications. The cars would be fitting with a standard street tire such as BFG Radial T/A's. The engines and drivers would be the choice of the manufactures since neither can be classified or effectively restricted other than maybe Big block or Small block versions. Then the cars would be set to the pace.
It still would not be the final word, but as close to it as you would get in this world.
Since the location of the Run and Gun is in Hastings, Nebraska, it is right smack dab in the middle of the country and equally spaced for both east and west coasters as well as north and southern border dwellers. In addition, for anyone who has NOT been to Hastings, it is an absolutely wonderful venue, incredible hospitality from the town, and the absolute most fantastic host in the track owner, Mr. George S. Anderson would could possibly find. The "S" stands for School Bus, and if you don't know why, there is no way you'd ever believe me. You will, after you leave though. Oh yes, you will.
I would suspect any manufacturer who truly believe in their product would accept a very fair, honest and more importantly, friendly challenge such as this. This may also be the historic moment to catch both C.burn and MK-4 at the bar shaking dice for the next round... or, someone ringing the bell ringside for the next round. Which ever, it would be well worth the trip in either case all by itself (and that's my humor for the day) :-)
In addition to all that, I wonder how a class for each of the brands would gain interest? An ERA class. A Shelby class. An FFR class maybe. Also, a class just for folks who have never been to a Run and Gun event. And why not a ladies class? Some of those gals are dying to run their hubby's cars but they never get the keys! I know I don;t give mine the keys and it's her car! lol.
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft #985 Custom Pro/ Street Race Car, full cage, dry sump 427W and G Force T-56 Fully Street Legal!!
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This an interesting thread, and I am little biased. I'm on my second BDR TD car. There do seem to be some misconceptions out there that I'd like to clarify, and then keep my mouth shut.
Firstly. The FFR Spec Racer does not hold a candle to the Backdraft TD car in handling or braking, and because to be "spec legal" at 225fwhp, with a solid axle, the "spec racers" simply do not have the lap times. I know with my limited driving ability at Sebring, I am running 18 secs faster in a BDR TD car than I did in a spec legal FFR. They are great cars, provided that you run in a spec class, with a level playing field.
Secondly. The price of $15K mentioned for the FFR car is a kit, a crate full of most of the parts.The Backdraft is totally finished, all that is needed is a drivetrain. Painted, wired, finished.
Thirdly. A street prepped FFR 9 times out of 10 will perform better than a spec racer. There are no limits on power, brakes or suspension.
Fourthly.The notion that a Backdraft TD car needs to have "all kinds of stuff added" to be street legal is ridiculous. We have three TD cars on the road here in Fl, registered legally with NO modifications. Granted that is Fl, and I have no idea on the rest of the States, and their requirements.
We are all talking apples and oranges, why not enjoy this sport for what it is, and enjoy the ride.
It's really good to see people out there spending a little money and having some good clean fun.
Cheers,
Richard
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Jack,
Appreciate the info. I think other comments are skewing what I am sharing here. And please if you feel I am making snide remarks about another product then show me, until then my message is, and I will underline and bold it so it's not missed...
GREAT TO SEE 2 MANUFACTURERS FIELDING RACE EFFORTS.
Cashburn,
I am sorry I got in your face about this. I think my comments were over the top and I apologize.
We are all very passionate about these cars. I am biased towards Superformance, but I have respect for all of the manufacturers still standing in this crummy economy.
I think my passion overflows a little too much sometimes.
Cobra Make, Engine: Backdraft#357, 392CI Ford Racing, 459hp, 455ft/lbs , TKO 500, 3.43 Gears, Ceramic Coated Headers, Victor Jr. 750cfm, 17in Halibrand wheels, Sterling Gray/Silver Stripes, Gray Leather, Nitto NT05
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SPF in 3rd?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayakjack
Cashburn,
I am sorry I got in your face about this. I think my comments were over the top and I apologize.
We are all very passionate about these cars. I am biased towards Superformance, but I have respect for all of the manufacturers still standing in this crummy economy.
I think my passion overflows a little too much sometimes.
Jack
Jack,
That was very classy. Congrats to the SPF roadster that came in 3rd - very impressive. I'm curious, was it "set up" or was it in "as-delivered" form from the dealer? What engine was it running?
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I believe the only commentary posted on the video (and not even here I might add) was on YouTube and it stated:
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