Winter will be here soon - starting to think oil cooler thermostats again

[dcdoug]

It gets cold in DC and I like to drive my car during the winter when it's dry. Too hard to park it for 4-5 months. I'd rather wear the right clothes and drive it.

Last winter I tried blocking off the oil cooler with plexiglass and while it looks nice, it's not enough. Oil temp would hardly come off the peg at 60c.

So I am now thinking of oil cooler thermostats. Here are my objectives (not necessarily in order):

1) I want to keep the oil cooler connected. Disconnecting it, bypassing it and having a "dummy" oil cooler is not something I am interested in.

2) I want something that is as innocuous as possible. I have a pretty period correct engine (427 SO) and I want to stay as close to that as possible. So Canton's thermostat, as pretty as it is, doesn't work for me. Way too much bling and annodized parts. The less you see it, the better in my opinion.

3) I obviously want something that works well, doesn't leak, opens reliably (it gets hot here in the summer, especially in traffic and I don't want to wrry about whether my oil thermostat is going to open...) etc.

4) I don't want to spend money foolishly, but I also will pay more for the right part for my application.

Here are my current candidates:

1) Earls: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EAR-502ERL/ (looks nice, good price, but seemed to have mixed reviews on other threads)

2) Mocal: http://www.batinc.net/thermos.htm (looks OK and I guess I could mount it out of the way somewhere, seemed to have mixed reviews on other threads)

3) http://www.beaumontmetalworks.com/oi...lve-final.html (pretty expensive, but looks nice and I like that I can manually adjust the flow - this would seem to be the choice if the cost was a bit more reasonable)

Thoughts? Advice?

[ERA Chas]

Doug,
I posted this last time you asked-NOTHING will keep temp in the oil below 50 degrees ambient at 60+ MPH-including NO oiler cooler. Ask how I know. If you want to give your precious NOS parts longevity, forget driving in those conditions. Period.
Also forget heaters, seat heaters, tops, hot vests and all the other junk for cold driving. No originals had them except tops-it's not what they were about. You say you don't want complexity and needless expense.
It's your money and your car. I will not join in after the torrent of nonsense that will follow.

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

Doug,
I posted this last time you asked-NOTHING will keep temp in the oil below 50 degrees ambient at 60+ MPH-including NO oiler cooler. Ask how I know. If you want to give your precious NOS parts longevity, forget driving in those conditions. Period.
Also forget heaters, seat heaters, tops, hot vests and all the other junk for cold driving. No originals had them except tops-it's not what they were about. You say you don't want complexity and needless expense.
It's your money and your car. I will not join in after the torrent of nonsense that will follow.

Yeah, maybe I was hoping for a better (different) answer this time. Kills me to park the car all winter.

As for heaters, seat heaters, blah, blah, blah, I don't subscribe to any of that. The only heat I get is from the 427. The rest is just clothes.

[Jim Kellogg]

Doug,
Last year I finally bit the bullet and purchased the complete adjustable remote filter setup from Beaumont Metal Works.
http://www.beaumontmetalworks.com/oi...lve-final.html

I had been blocking my cooler off (with cardboard) during the winter months the last several years. I still get just about the same effect now during the dead of winter (it's impossible to get the oil up to full temp after the outside temps drop below 40 or so). Forget about trying!

When I upgraded to the Beaumont unit, I also went from AN10 to AN12 lines for more flow, and changed the oil cooler to AN12. The Beaumont unit DOES make a big difference in the spring and fall, as I can adjust the flow to the oil cooler on the "cool" days to keep the oil temp up. For that, it is well worth it.

During the dead of winter, when temps drop below 20, I just run it a "little" easier, to minimize any damage from the colder oil temps.

It's a trade off. Do you want to "save" your Cobra replica for your kids/grandkids, or do you want to DRIVE it!

I choose to drive :-)

If you would like to see photos of my setup, let me know and I will post them for you.
Jim Kellogg
Breesport, NY

[DonC]

Take a look at the Canton unit. A little on the spendy side by a very good performer.
DonC

[Cobra 29]

Doug,

I recently ordered a sandwich-style thermostat adapter plate from BAT. The model is SP1T-HF. The "HF" refers to a high flow model. This unit is approximately 20% larger than their SP1T thermostat adapter plate. Susposedly, the oil shuttle valve has been improved over the SP1T design. For $129, it also comes with two male-to-male unions; your choice on AN sizes for the "hose" side of the unions.

I like the idea of the sandwich style thermostat plate because it eliminates the remote oil filter mount and shortens the lines. I will probably need to use a shorter filter (NAPA 1311 or 1085, FL300 or Mobil 1-109 (might be discontinued)).

How will will this work? I do not know. I have not installed it yet. I hate the idea of cutting the AN lines! I thought I would share mydirection since I have similar objectives.

Cobra 29

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by Jim Kellogg

If you would like to see photos of my setup, let me know and I will post them for you.
Jim Kellogg
Breesport, NY

I'd love to see some pics.

Doug

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by DonC

Take a look at the Canton unit. A little on the spendy side by a very good performer.
DonC

Too much bling in the Canton products for me.

[bobcowan]

A couple of tid bits about oil coolers that you need to know.

Oil is heated by RPM's. Routine or even hard steet/highway will warm the oil to about the same temp as the coolant, and maybe a little higher. But not that much higher. If the coolant temp is a steady 180*, oil temp shouldn't get more than 200*'ish.

Oil has an operating range. Max temp depends on the oil type, and duration. Sometimes a higher oil temp will result in a litle more available power.

Minimum temps is a bit tougher to obtain, but seems to be about 180*. Below 180*'ish, the oil and the additive package don't work they way they're supposed to. For example, a 10W-40 oil will have the viscosity of a 40wt oil when heated to 100*C. What is the viscosity at 60*C? IDK.

There is a myth that if the oil doesn't get above 100*C, the water that collects in the oil will remain there. That's rediculous. If that were true, your kitchen floor would never dry.

So, the trick, then, to use an oil cooler, but not actually cool the oil. Most automatic thermostats - Mocal, Russell, Canton - are never fully closed or open. When cold, about 10% of the oil is routed through the cooler. That allows all the oil to warm up at the same time. When fully open, about 10% is routed directly back to the engine, and that prevents pressure drop and starvation. Unfortunatly, on a cold day your oil will still not get warm enough, even with the cooler cover with cardboard and tape. I know, I'v tried it.

As I understand it, the Beaumont valve will actually allow you to completly shut off flow to the cooler. That's what you need - the ability to completly stop the flow through the cooler. The Beaumont valve is pretty nice, and looks great. But, you could accomplish the same function with two $15 ball valves and a handfull of AN fittings.

[mkassab]

Doug.... here's a very good link that will give you what you want.... http://www.supramania.com/forums/sho...-Remote-Filter

Here's my link for what I did (too much bling for you) http://www.uniquecobra.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=68

good luck... Mark

[dcdoug]

Thanks, that is helpful!

[Bob In Ct]

Doug:
I'm using a piece of plexi in front of my oil cooler in the colder weather and my oil gets to 180 F, and I have a small block. Why is it you're only getting to 140 (60C) with a BB?

Bob

[ERA Chas]

Originally Posted by Cobra 29

Doug,
I recently ordered a sandwich-style thermostat adapter plate from BAT. The model is SP1T-HF.
How will will this work? I do not know. I have not installed it yet. I hate the idea of cutting the AN lines! I thought I would share mydirection since I have similar objectives.
Cobra 29

Well, I know.
In an effort to limit your loss and prevent needless work-send it back for refund. I have the exact same Mocal from BAT. In fact had the early one too. Re-read my post #2.

Doug-Data about Supra's oil temp control and Cobra's is apples to oranges. The engine compartments and heat rejection of both is different worlds.

[cobrarkc]

Originally Posted by Jim Kellogg

Doug,

When I upgraded to the Beaumont unit, I also went from AN10 to AN12 lines for more flow, and changed the oil cooler to AN12.

for you.
Jim Kellogg
Breesport, NY

If the port coming out and into your engine is 1/2"npt that is -10an sized. How will going to -12an give you more flow? It is only going to give you a pressure drop. This is basic plumbing, if you have a 1/2' feed in you house and feed your shower with 3/4" the pressure drops can flow more than the smallest point. I don't think anyone has 3/4" oil ports on these engines, especially internally.

[mkassab]

Originally Posted by Bob In Ct

Doug:
I'm using a piece of plexi in front of my oil cooler in the colder weather and my oil gets to 180 F, and I have a small block. Why is it you're only getting to 140 (60C) with a BB?

Bob

Doug... is your gauge accurate?

[cobrarkc]

Originally Posted by dcdoug

Too much bling in the Canton products for me.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. The Canton unit is black and could be placed on the oil cooler side of the frame. The Bueamont unit is all polished and shiney, very blingy.
http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/...ion&key=22-480

[pusherfans]

Originally Posted by ERA Chas

Doug,
I posted this last time you asked-NOTHING will keep temp in the oil below 50 degrees ambient at 60+ MPH-including NO oiler cooler. Ask how I know. If you want to give your precious NOS parts longevity, forget driving in those conditions. Period.
Also forget heaters, seat heaters, tops, hot vests and all the other junk for cold driving. No originals had them except tops-it's not what they were about. You say you don't want complexity and needless expense.
It's your money and your car. I will not join in after the torrent of nonsense that will follow.

I had a feeling this was the case, since taping off my oil cooler did not help. But why does that happen, if there is no cooler?

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by mkassab

Doug... is your gauge accurate?

Seems OK in other driving. I did insulate my oil temp sensor after last winter, so maybe I will get higher readings now. I will put the plexi in place again for sure this year, but still isn't enough.

And I am sort of with Jim Kellogg. I want to drive this car. It's a replica, not a museum piece. Having said that, I obviously want to limit wear on my engine as much as possible.

[dcdoug]

Originally Posted by cobrarkc

I'm not sure what you mean by this. The Canton unit is black and could be placed on the oil cooler side of the frame. The Bueamont unit is all polished and shiney, very blingy.
http://www.cantonracingproducts.com/...ion&key=22-480

It is hard to tell from just a pic, but it just seems like it will look very out-of-place to me. It is also bigger, which doesn't help.

I think with a bit of steel wool I could matt down the Beaumont piece and it wouldn't be that noticeable being just a block of mono-alloy.

[patrickt]

Doug, I think Chas. is right. If you're going to drive it at speeds over about 30mph, in temperatures below 50 degrees, I don't think you're going to get your oil up to temp even with no oil cooler at all. The oil pan itself is acting like a big oil cooler. I just don't think it's going to work.