Cobra Make, Engine: # 757 ERA 427 SC , 482 Al. big block
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There was another thread about moving body production out of Mexico .... and then they announce a major price increase ...... any connection ?? Inquiring minds want to know .
At the end of the day, and removing emotions from the discussion, it really comes down to how much an individual values the Shelby and CSX brand (please note I am not discussing anything about perceived quality or other elements).
One could perhaps get a sense of this by looking at Shelby dealers today. How often do they turn over their current inventory, for those that have been built out, how quickly they sell, what does it take for them to remain a viable business?
What is a commodity, what is a brand and how much are people willing to pay for the delta?
Yes but also remember that the CSX cars are different. Different body, different chasis etc etc. As a former Superformance owner I can tell you they are completely different. I think some buyers also had considered this in their purchases.
Without a doubt, there's a segment of the Cobra buyer's market who want a CSX/Shelby, because of the name and number, and are willing to pay extra amount for it. No surprises here or there.
Also, if the manufacturing facilities are moving from outside of the US to the US, then the labor market is far more expensive here and the $10K price increase doesn't surprise me there either.
Cobra Make, Engine: KMP 427 S/C, Twin Paxton 511 FE
Posts: 2,594
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Seems to me that the price increase won't hurt Shelby much. I believe that most CSX owners are people who may own other toys, like Ferrari's. We obviously all have discretionary income, but an average CSX owner probably has more than most of us. For the wealthy it's a no brainer. They think, "Vintage Shelby's are more than I want to spend, so I'll get the next best thing". Not, "Vintage Shelby's are too much, so I'll spend countless hours researching the vast Cobra replica market and make a sound decision based on value for the dollar". Let's face it, if you own a Ferrari, names DO mean something to you. Period. Nothing wrong with that IMO, for I too believe provenance has value.
For most of 'us' (if we're in the market for upper echelon replicas) are even considering a CSX, than ten grand for the name may not be worth it. But to the guy who bought his wife a $30k ring 'just because', the money won't mean as much.
I know there are exceptions to who I believe the average CSX owner is, and gratefully many of the exceptions are on this site, but most probably wouldn't have gone elsewhere for a 10k bump.
And while I'm on my soapbox: These arguments and opinions about CSX continutions being a rip off, or the 'ol man being a crook, are getting a little long in the tooth. It's like being a Disney fan but hating Walt because he dipped his donuts in Scotch.
rodneym
Seems to me that the price increase won't hurt Shelby much. I believe that most CSX owners are people who may own other toys, like Ferrari's. We obviously all have discretionary income, but an average CSX owner probably has more than most of us. For the wealthy it's a no brainer. They think, "Vintage Shelby's are more than I want to spend, so I'll get the next best thing". Not, "Vintage Shelby's are too much, so I'll spend countless hours researching the vast Cobra replica market and make a sound decision based on value for the dollar". Let's face it, if you own a Ferrari, names DO mean something to you. Period. Nothing wrong with that IMO, for I too believe provenance has value.
For most of 'us' (if we're in the market for upper echelon replicas) are even considering a CSX, than ten grand for the name may not be worth it. But to the guy who bought his wife a $30k ring 'just because', the money won't mean as much.
Boy, did you hit the nail on its head.
Actually I own 4 ferrari's, F40, F50, and 2 Enzo's, just because I can. I actually never even priced a CSX car compared to others, I just told my buyer to get me one of those instead of a real one, even though I could afford one, two, or several. What, $30K for a ring? I'm actually insulted, I never spend less than $50K for any piece of jewelry.
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"After jumping into an early lead, Miles pitted for no reason. He let the entire field go by before re-entering the race. The crowd was jumping up and down as he stunned the Chevrolet drivers by easily passing the entire field to finish second behind MacDonald's other team Cobra. The Corvette people were completely demoralized."
Actually I own 4 ferrari's, F40, F50, and 2 Enzo's, just because I can. I actually never even priced a CSX car compared to others, I just told my buyer to get me one of those instead of a real one, even though I could afford one, two, or several. What, $30K for a ring? I'm actually insulted, I never spend less than $50K for any piece of jewelry.
Well, if you were a true Ferrari connoisseur, then you would have one of these.
As a factory authorized Shelby Cobra CSX dealer I have the last seven (7) HST built CSX Cobras at SAI factory, in Las Vegas, being finished up - Until December 1st I will offer them for the old price of $ 49,995.00 (+ options) - They are as follows:
CSX 6063 - Color and options TBD by EOM
CSX 6065 - Navy Blue
CSX 6066 - Guardsman blue
CSX 6067 - LeMans Blue
CSX 6068 - Russo F-1 Red
CSX 6069 - Guardsman Blue w/ Wimbledon White LeMans stripes
CSX 6070 - framed and raw body - customer can pick color and options by EOM 11/2010
Last edited by stephen_becker; 10-21-2010 at 08:06 AM..
Here is just another what if..... What if there was
another replica that was exactly like the fiberglass
Cobras Shelby sells. Down to the last nut, bolt and screw. And they were 40K instead of their old price of 50K. Now are you telling me they would still sell more of the Shelbys because of the name and CSX?
Cobra Make, Engine: KMP 427 S/C, Twin Paxton 511 FE
Posts: 2,594
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Jeez, Hersh. You with your "what ifs".
That is an intriguing question. I've seen this scenario done with guitars and watches. You could get an Ollech & Wajs watch made with NOS Breitling Navitimer parts, in effect buying a NOS Breitling for less than a new 'Real' Breitling. And the Ollech & Wajs will have the period correct movement. To watch fanatics 'in the know', it's better (in a vintage sense) than a new Breitling. All of us know Breitling but who would investigate an Ollech & Wajs?
Perhaps more of 'us' would buy the identical 'CSX' knockoff, but not Anthony!
Won't the Riverside Racers FIA fit this category?
That is an intriguing question. I've seen this scenario done with guitars and watches. You could get an Ollech & Wajs watch made with NOS Breitling Navitimer parts, in effect buying a NOS Breitling for less than a new 'Real' Breitling. And the Ollech & Wajs will have the period correct movement. To watch fanatics 'in the know', it's better (in a vintage sense) than a new Breitling. All of us know Breitling but who would investigate an Ollech & Wajs?
Perhaps more of 'us' would buy the identical 'CSX' knockoff, but not Anthony!
Won't the Riverside Racers FIA fit this category?
rodneym
Jeez, Rodney. For us non-watch guys, we have no clue what you just said.
BTW, what does the acronym HST mean? Is that South Africa, Mexico or Las Vegas? I'm lost. Sorry.
Cobra Make, Engine: NAF 289 Slabside Early Comp Car with 289 Webers and all the goodies. Cancelling the efforts of several Priuses
Posts: 6,592
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Something that hasn't been touched on is often marketing studies dictate that a price point can be created based upon various indicators whereby fewer item are made/sold to a smaller or more select market (disposable income) without any reduction, and often time a net increase in revenue. It is often done on "High Ticket" items. We look at them (as we have in this thread) and find it difficult to understand why a price has been raised. OEM mfgr fo this often .
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As you slide down the Banister of Life, may the splinters never be pointing the wrong way
That is an intriguing question. I've seen this scenario done with guitars and watches. You could get an Ollech & Wajs watch made with NOS Breitling Navitimer parts, in effect buying a NOS Breitling for less than a new 'Real' Breitling. And the Ollech & Wajs will have the period correct movement. To watch fanatics 'in the know', it's better (in a vintage sense) than a new Breitling. All of us know Breitling but who would investigate an Ollech & Wajs?
Perhaps more of 'us' would buy the identical 'CSX' knockoff, but not Anthony!
Won't the Riverside Racers FIA fit this category?
rodneym
Like putting a Rolex movement in a Panerai case...
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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I wonder if Shelby dropped their price by $10k (so $39,995), rather than increasing it, whether they'd pick up a enough customers currently buying BDR's, SPF's and ERA's to generate enough sales that their overall margin would increase or whether lower sales at a higher price still results in better a better overall margin. Wonder how price elastic the demand is for CSX cars?
I know that Shelby generally is pursuing a strategy of reducing its auto sales business and focusing on parts, but it is an interesting question.
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Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RodKnock
So, if you're a buyer out there looking to buy a new CSX4000/6000, it sounds like you would prefer a Las Vegas or South African built CSX?
Ask a different person, get a different answer. I have heard all of the following answers to this question:
1) The best cars were the early 4000 series cars built in LV.
2) The early 4000 cars built in LV had lots of issues due to inconsistent manufacturing and lack of overall organization at the facility.
3) Cars have been built by HST nearly since the beginning and the quality is the best, better than LV built cars and some of the bigger dealers (George Anderson at Gessford and Stephen Becker at Planet Cobra to name two) specify HST-only cars.
4) HST has quality issues and Hi-Tech (SA) is a more sophisticated factory, therefore SA builds cars are better. (I know people that have toured the Hi-Tech factory and say it is very impressive)
I have never actually heard anyone back up any of these statements with empirical evidence. So your guess is as good as mine. Who knows?
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“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #539/427 Holman Moody #7HM20 from 1967
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For a perspective, I am reading Cobra The Shelby American Archives (62-65) by Dave Friedman and on page 34, they have an invoice dated April 7 1964 for CSX 2393 no engine, silver, with red trim top and tonneau, rack/pinion. It cost Ford 778 Pounds about $1,500 US in 64. I did not check equivalency in 2010.
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Learjockey1
For a perspective, I am reading Cobra The Shelby American Archives (62-65) by Dave Friedman and on page 34, they have an invoice dated April 7 1964 for CSX 2393 no engine, silver, with red trim top and tonneau, rack/pinion. It cost Ford 778 Pounds about $1,500 US in 64. I did not check equivalency in 2010.
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