Drag race - Kirkham 65 side-oiler vs Ferrari 458 italia

[FIA Mike]

Oh this is going to be fun to watch. Hopefully it doesn't turn out bad for the Cobra. Lets see, an idiot proof Ferrari vs. a high HP Cobra with an inexperienced driver. NOT a good combination. But worth the price of admission. Get the popcorn!

FIA Mike

[David Janowic]

Give details on date and location of this race, I have to watch it. Have you done any quarter mile trials in your car, not that there is much practice to pushing a button and stomping on the gas, im curious if he has a perfect launch and does everything correctly if he can even win.

[Jamo]

Whether it is real or not (sorry Tommy...still no real confirmation), the bench racing opportunity was just too good to pass up.

Be that as it may, I'm reminded of the R8 spider and Porsche turbo cab (both awd..sort of a "damn near" launch control) matchup conducted by Jeremy and the Stig. They made a run, and then switched cars...the Stig won both times.

Seems to me that on any given day, a pretty good driver in the Italia will win if he's read the owner's manual and become acquainted with the launch control. On the other hand, a damn good driver in a high-average spec'd, big motored (460ci+) arruminum Cobra with at least Billboards (a common build) could do it on another day.

I'd feel better with a rolling start.

Hope we find out.

[tommygold]

Hi everyone. I think this is most likely going to go down on February 25 (assuming we can get access to the drag strip at LV Speedway that day). My car should be picked up on the 13th (likely by GranTurismo, which offered me a good price and has a warehouse by the Speedway). Incidentally, I've offered an alternative bet and it will be interesting to see if he accepts: one time with my launch control; if I win then I'll race him a second time for slightly more money w/o LC. But I only have to win the individual races not beat him 3x in a row.

Then this other news. He measured off a 1/4 strip (imperfectly) and couldn't get his time below 13.8. But I think that's actually misleadingly low. His buddy stood at the finish and started the stopwatch when he heard my buddy's car. So there were 4 things that should make his time worse -- no delay in driver reacting to the start light; delay in starting the stop watch; delay in hearing the sound of the Shelby a quarter-mile away; and delay in stopping the stop watch. All of those add well over a second. So I think his time was 15 or worse.

I'll keep you updated.

[Don]

Tommy......any predictions on the outcome of the match race ? Road & Track December test: 11.0 @ 128.5 for the 458.

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by tommygold

STL - that's the point!!! I can't send him here. I'm trying to learn here whether I've definitely got the advantage, and over on the Ferrari forums how best to win! -Tom

Where, please? ...which F forum?

(other than your first post on F-chat a few minutes ago)

[tommygold]

Hi CW. I am traveling (now in Nashville, off to Cinci) so I hadn't started the Ferrari forum discussion. But I now have: http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=312330. Will be interesting to see what they say. -Tom

[tommygold]

Hi Don. The posted times I've seen for the 458 all have 11-11.5. (I assume and expect that the posted times are using my stock tires.) I have to think that my time will be around 12 -- a bit slower off the start and less perfect paddle shifts -- but not really worse than that with practice. So much of my run is controlled by computer (in a race using launch control), I think I've got a big advantage. He reported significant control probems in 1st, 2d, and 3d gears, as well as difficulties with the move from 2d to 3d gear. -Tom

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by tommygold

Will be interesting to see what they say.

It certainly will.

[Don]

1/4 mile = 10.85

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=301096

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/for...204&order=desc

[RodKnock]

I realize that I'll never be Big Daddy Don Garlits, Richard Petty or Mario Andretti (or a Danica Patrick ), but 14's and/or 15's with a 2,150 lb Kirkham with 600 +/- HP?

Is someone "sandbagging" or what?

[Silverback51]

I don't know, but I think we may be having our chain yanked.

Tommy just joined the Ferrari forum today. I would have thought as a Ferrari owner he would have already been a member there.

Guess we will see later this month.

[Don]

Granted, experienced driver, drag specific set up, gearing, tuned.......but a reference point. The R & T 1/4 mile test had the 458 @ 10.85

" Of further interest is CSX3198, which was the only Dragonsnake buit with a 505 hp, 427-cid engine. This car was sold to Haar Motor Company in Worcester, MA, for NHRA competition. At the 1966 NHRA Winternationals in Pomona, it set the A/SP national records at 10.86 seconds and 127 mph results."

http://www.stangtv.com/news/spotligh...a-dragonsnake/

[tommygold]

Hi SB/John. It is so funny that people really just want to believe that they are being lied to. I've had my 458 for about 3 weeks; my first Ferrari. The first thing you did when you got a car may have been to join a chat site, and that's great; it just wasn't mine. I've explained who I am, where I got my car, who he is and where his car will be, and where and when the race will be. And it wouldn't remotely interest me to spin out some tale (pun intended) about a fantastical drag race. I'm just trying to figure out what my shot is at winning. -Tom

[tommygold]

RB. I don't think he's sandbagging. Like I said, we're friends, and he doesn't have any incentive to -- the race is booked. I think this is just his first time, and he has a ways to go before he's got the mechanics of a drag down. -Tom

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by tommygold

RB. I don't think he's sandbagging. Like I said, we're friends, and he doesn't have any incentive to -- the race is booked. I think this is just his first time, and he has a ways to go before he's got the mechanics of a drag down. -Tom

I'll bet the Ferrari wins. Is there a side bet on which car breaks first?

With an experienced Cobra driver in the Kirkham, I'd say it would be much closer, notwithstanding the lack of specifics for the Kirkham.

[rodneym]

Originally Posted by Silverback51

I don't know, but I think we may be having our chain yanked.

Tommy just joined the Ferrari forum today. I would have thought as a Ferrari owner he would have already been a member there.

I'm certainly starting to feel that way too.
I joined this circus before I got my first Cobra.
If I was to race, I would ask Cobraphiles BEFORE Ferrari desciples.
You would probably get a more honest answer from 'your own kind'.

Just ask the guy in the 355 who only saw the rear of my SPF on the 57 South. Ok, ok, that wasn't fair, but it was in my SPF with a small block.

[Excaliber]

I don't see a valid reason to doubt Tommy's profile and posting at this point, no need to get all paranoid you guys.

I ran 14 ET with a STOCK 302 (air pump, catalytic converters and all emission controls as well), the Excalibur, longer and heavier than most other Cobras, nice car but SLOW. So the timing method for the Cobra in question here is certainly suspect.

Most ALL Cobra's are in the 12's, high or low, even with near stock small blocks and worthless traction. A slow Cobra, not common, would be low 13's (13.0-13.1). Getting into the 11's, however, certainly takes some serious horse power, decent traction and at least a few runs to get the hang of drag racing.

10's? Traction is a very serious issue at this level. Can do, even with moderate traction IF, your running some very serious horse power AND a light weight Cobra (like a Kirkham or an FFR). In that case the the last 1/8th mile is everything.

But 12's? Pfffftt, with one arm tied behind you back in a Cobra, piece of cake. It's a long haul from 12.9 to 12.0, by the way.

[*13*]

10 Pages in & No race date?

[Dimis]

Simple - It will come down to whether the Kirkham is polished, brushed or painted Black!

We all know Black cobras are fastest (as per a previous thread), but even they are second only to the fastest of cobras of them all a Polished Kirkham.


Race date was loosely earmarked for the 25th Feb