Club Cobra Gas-N Exhaust  

Go Back   Club Cobra > Cobra Talk Areas > ALL COBRA TALK

Keith Craft Racing
Nevada Classics
Main Menu
Module Jump:
Nevada Classics
Nevada Classics
MMG Superformance
Advertise at CC
Banner Ad Rates
MMG Superformance
Keith Craft Racing
MMG Superformance
Keith Craft Racing
September 2024
S M T W T F S
1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17 18 19 20 21
22 23 24 25 26 27 28
29 30          

Kirkham Motorsports

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:28 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default Bondurant School of High Performance Driving

(Note: I'd mentioned here that I'd attended this class. I did the following writeup on Team Shelby and am reposting here.)

To recap....

Last December at the annual Shelby American Collection fundraiser party I picked up one of the classes that Bob Bondurant put in the silent auction. That entitled me to a two-day "Z06 Experience" class. Based on some discussion with others I decided to upgrade to the 4-day Grand Prix racing class.

The outline for the class is taken from the Bondurant brochure:

Day One
• Intro / Tour / Van Ride
• Ground School
• Throttle Steer
• Heel & Toe Downshift
• (Lunch)
• Ground School
• Accident Avoidance
• Handling Oval
• Heel & Toe Downshift

Day Two
• Ground School
• Maricopa Oval
• Skid Car
• Braking Exercises
• (Lunch)
• Ground School
• Intro Race Track
• Lead & Follow
• Instructor Ride & Drive

Day Three
• Ground School
• Skid Car / Instructor Ride & Drive-Short
Course [we didn't go back to this - straight to the track]
• Intro Full Course / Lead & Follow
• Instructor Ride & Drive
• (Lunch)
• Race Ground School
• Practice Race Starts

Day Four (Formula Mazda)
• Ground School
• Fit to Cars
• Formula Mazda Shifting
• Lead & Follow / Open Track-Short Course
• (Lunch)
• Ground School
• Lead & Follow / Open Track-Full Course

There is an instructor for each three students. This is determined by the use of the Cadillac CTS as an instructor car - driver plus three passengers for the course path intros and discussion. [One of these could be a very fun car. Certainly a sleeper car comparable to the Galaxie 500's of yesteryear.]

The first three days are in the Corvettes. I'd not driven one for something like 20 years, and I think maybe they're kind of OK now

The first day and second morning was in the practice area. It started off with a rather spirited drive over everything in a big van that had obviously been suspension tuned for some pretty cool handling. Then right to the cars and practice heel-toe downshifting.

Then to an accident avoidance portion of the course - you go down a single lane to a 3-lane fanout with three lights and have to take the one that stays green. A similar spot is used for some braking exercises.

The skid pad was a very good exercise. They have some Cadillacs with hydraulic lifter outriggers that lift the car's front and rear wheels to create under and oversteer. It really reinforces the "look where you want to go" when handling skids.

The second half of the second day was on the track. On the first afternoon we got introduced to a portion that is an oval with a constant radius and a decreasing radius circles and practiced entry / apex / exit. On the third day the other half of the course is used with lots of different turns and some tight chicanes that require the use of heel-toe and other things. Then the entire track is opened up combining both parts with two hills that really make it interesting.

During the driving sessions you are in the car by yourself most of the time. The instructors observe and then will ride with you pointing out areas of improvement that can be made, and once drove the car with me riding. I was overly cautious as I tried to approach the car's capabilities and he showed me that if I keep looking for the limit that it was going to take a while As I said, the Corvette has grown up quite a bit. That said, the Corvettes had all of the "electronic nannies" (ABS, traction control and stability control) enabled, so it was almost impossible to really experience any oversteer even on the tightest turns. "Remember what you did to get the car to fix it and don't do that again". (Don't worry, no nannies on day 4).

For the SCCA card they also do race starts and restarts (with a pace car and green flag and all).

The third day is the end of the main class. One of the students couldn't continue to the 4th day which left us with 5 into day 4.

Day 4 is a totally different animal. We "graduate" from the Corvettes to the Formula Mazda cars. These are small purpose-built race cars with nothing but a seat, 4 wheels, engine and transmission wrapped in fiberglass. No nannies here. Low center of gravity and very stable. And fun. After getting fitted into the cars, and a brief intro lead/follow trip we were on the short track in the morning and the full track the rest of the day (about 5 hours total).

Passing is allowed in designated zones (the straight, with another zone added during the Mazda portion of the class).

This class is definitely worth it. You get to do things that you'd never be able to do on public streets, and the racing isn't in a competition mode.

It's not real easy to take pictures because you're in the car almost all the time. Lunch was 1-1/2 hours and for the first three days there was something on the track so I got some pictures during lunch. They follow.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:30 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

Day 1 AM intro to the site

Corvettes everywhere







The Formula Mazda garage.



They also have a separate Go-Kart track. These are little rockets. The sign says 0-100MPH in 6 seconds.



Bob is a very hands on guy. He's there all the time he is in town. He dropped in on us when we were in the Kart garage.









Bob's wife

__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:32 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

More Corvettes. These are the new Grand Sports that will be replacing the older C6 cars over the next few weeks. Wish I'd gotten there a little later





They have a "museum" with some of the cars from Bondunt's history. We were zipping through and didn't get everything.






Class photo




A car running the track:









__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:34 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

Another car on the track










They have ZR1s for a ZR1 class.



__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:36 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

One day there was an advanced class running the Formula Mazdas. After the class we took there is an "advanced" follow on class. It is offered with either Corvettes or Formula Mazda. On Tuesday at lunch the Mazdas were on the track - two students and an instructor. The instructor is in the blue car.

















These cars were so much fun to take pictures of. I took them from the tower but they stopped before I had time to get to the inside of the track.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:45 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

Wednesday was Bob's 78th birthday.







__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:47 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

On Wednesday at Lunch Bob decided to take one of the new Grand Sports for a spin. I think they guy with him is a GM guy. P.S. I like the roof line and overall looks of the Grand Sport. Don't worry, I'm not going to by a Corvette.













__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:55 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

And this was the best part. There were a couple of us from the Shelby American group that got the class at this session son after everyone finished lunch at the birthday party, Bob pulled out his ZR1... And gave us hot laps. All I can say is WOW!!! We were going around the track and I asked him about something he was doing and his comment was something like "they're conservative". Then we rounded a corner that most of the students were doing at 110-120, and he was carrying on a conversation at 145. I do believe a lot of it had to do with the ZR1. Our cars were constantly squealing the tires at the point of "a happy tire is a squealing tire" on the verge of breaking lose. Also lots of body roll and nose dive when you hit the brakes. The ZR1 never squealed and when he hit the brakes it was simply solid.

Anyway, these are shots from Bob driving just before I went on my lap.











__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:57 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

The 4 day class can be followed with a 2 or 3 day advanced class. The advanced classes are lots smaller - the one that was running when we were there was 2 students. You have to choose advanced Corvette or Formula Mazda.

The difference in the advanced class is that you can bring your own car. It has to get through their mechanics and safety inspection, but they will let you mix the car with something of similar capability. I queried about a Ford GT and they said it would be allowed.

I would add that if you drive your own car be prepared to buy new tires when you're done (and even possibly to have a truncated session if you don't). I would advise using their car for the majority of it and your own the last day or half day. Better to beat up theirs than yours.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 07:00 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

All of the pictures above were taken by me. The following were part of the package of photos I bought. They have a resident photographer and sell you pictures of you in your car. There were lots of them, these are the ones I liked











__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 07:04 AM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

Another forum member asked me about the class and driving his own Cobra. As I mentioned earlier, the heel-toe downshifting thing seems like it will be difficult to master and without it you really won't get full enjoyment. Also, after three days on the Corvettes with all the nannies - ABS, traction control and stability control - to help correct mistakes, I would feel that trying to drive any other car to the same performance will be difficult unless you're already experienced.

In my talks with the one instructor who did know about this his recommendation was the last half of the last day of the advanced class. I say this for two reasons, one as noted above, and the second being wear and tear on your car. I'd not be too concerned about the track itself - there are some tire walls but they are on the straights with plenty of space around the turns so if you do go off the track it wouldn't be too big of a deal.

The big deal is wear and tear - Bob himself when I asked about this in December strongly encouraged me to wear down his tires and brakes. I thought it would be fun to drive the car on the track after learning a lot, but I wouldn't want to substitute my car (no matter what it is) for the class.
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA

Last edited by twobjshelbys; 05-04-2011 at 07:06 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 08:32 AM
dcdoug's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD
Cobra Make, Engine: CSX 6022, navy blue, period correct 427 SO
Posts: 2,154
Not Ranked     
Default

Great write up Tony - thanks!
__________________
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”

www.partskeeper.com
(Less time searching, more time wrenching & driving)
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 11:33 AM
Nope It's Fake's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North Central Illinois, IL
Cobra Make, Engine: FFR with '94 SVT 5.0
Posts: 35
Not Ranked     
Default

I only have positive things to say about Bob and his school, including the level of preparation and maintenance they give their vehicles. Here's a picture of my ex-Bondurant car that I bought from the school and owned for a few years before selling it recently to a friend.

__________________
Later,
Chris

FFR Mk3.1 #7074 - Start Date: 10/11/09
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 05-04-2011, 12:00 PM
twobjshelbys's Avatar
CC Member
Visit my Photo Gallery

 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Cobra Make, Engine: Shelby CSX4005LA, Roush 427IR
Posts: 5,535
Not Ranked     
Default

They will begin soon the process of changing some of the cars (I think the ones we were using, C6+Z51) to the Grand Sports. The instructors told us we could probably buy any of the cars we wanted right then and there. Otherwise they (1) go to auction for cars with a VIN as is (including Bondurant stickers) or (2) back to GM to crush (for cars without VINs, apparently some are delivered that way).
__________________
Cheers,
Tony
CSX4005LA
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:42 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
The representations expressed are the representations and opinions of the clubcobra.com forum members and do not necessarily reflect the opinions and viewpoints of the site owners, moderators, Shelby American, any other replica manufacturer, Ford Motor Company. This website has been planned and developed by clubcobra.com and its forum members and should not be construed as being endorsed by Ford Motor Company, or Shelby American or any other manufacturer unless expressly noted by that entity. "Cobra" and the Cobra logo are registered trademarks for Ford Motor Co., Inc. clubcobra.com forum members agree not to post any copyrighted material unless the copyrighted material is owned by you. Although we do not and cannot review the messages posted and are not responsible for the content of any of these messages, we reserve the right to delete any message for any reason whatsoever. You remain solely responsible for the content of your messages, and you agree to indemnify and hold us harmless with respect to any claim based upon transmission of your message(s). Thank you for visiting clubcobra.com. For full policy documentation refer to the following link: CC Policy
Links monetized by VigLink