Oil cooler advice

[Tulsa cobra]

I have read multiple threads that for most an oil cooler is not needed, and it was been true for me until this year. I recently participated in the Ford/Shelby MidAmerica and while participating on the track, air temp was 98 degrees, I noted the oil temp, which usually stays around 70 (158) got up to 120 (248) after about 5-7 laps. Since oil temp is associated with high RPM, I tried to gear up the next session and though it took slightly longer, the oil temp got up to the same.

I then would run a few slow laps, it would come down appropriately and then after 2-3 laps it would go back to the 120ish level.


My question is, I plan to go to track events about 3 times or so a year. Mainly in the summer, where the air temps will be in the upper 90s to 100.
1. Is it ok to run for about 4-5 15 minute sessions with my oil temps in the 120-130 range.

2. If not, and I do need an oil cooler, and I want to limit the cost and complexity, could I use the Mocal oil cooler and simply bypass my remote filter, just for the event, then reconnect it after, because otherwise I would not need the oil cooler.

3. And if that is not an option, and given the fact I have a remote oil filter, what would the diagram of the plumbing look like. I know there are in line thermostats, and adjustible flow devices, but I am looking for a 3 to 4 day a year fix.


Thank you for you help and insight.

[Tulsa cobra]

My water temp stayed at 90-95 degrees with no changes

[Rick Parker]

Use the filter before the cooler.

[RICK LAKE]

Tulsa cobra Heres the couple of ideas I have for you to look at,

1 How much oil are you running in the car?? If you are racing add 1-1.5 extra quarts to help around high"G" turns. See where this leads you. depending on the oil, 240 is not out of range if a synthesic. Conventional yes.
2 You can add the cooler in the front of the car. Will give you an extra quart of oil between lines and cooler. Will bring down the oil temps by 10-40 degrees. This is good but if the oil is too cool, it doesn't do max lubercation of the parts. Cooler needs a screen on it if you track race. Debry can hit the cooler and you could win the oil down the track award and cleaning bill if they charge. This is not good.
3 How about a water/ oil cooler exchanger?? Helps in a couple of ways. Helps heat up the oil faster to get it in the correct temp range. Helps do the same for the coolant or water in the coolant system. HP drain is almost none. You do need to have a good radiator system for this. You can mount the exchanger almost any where under the hood and doesn't take alot of room depending on what size you buy
4 Slow down at the track and enjoy the cruising part. You can still be fast and lower the chances of damage to you and the car. I know this is not fun but I have way too many years, labor, money and time to test out the max limit of the car. It's about FUN. It's about hitting the pefect line. Over the years have seen many cobras and other vehicles damaged for bragging rights and to win a $10.00 piece of pressboard with a bronze plated plate saying how good you are today. Sorry it took 20+ years of saving to get my dream. I have had a few spinouts looking for walls and last year lit the car on fire due to a small leak from a valve cover. No damage to car or paint, Just lucky.
I think this will give you the best choises of what to do with the car. If you are going to get serious about track running, a dry sump setup is the only way to go if you are going to pull high "G" turns. Also a long oil pressure light on the dash for under 25 psi. This is the reason alot of motors break at the track from racing. Long turns at high speed and slow oil returns to the oil pan. Rick L. ps I track my car 98% of the time. No dry sump yet but have a 3 quart accusump hooked into the system for maintaining good oil pressure though along turns or sweepers. 14 years and no failures of the bottom end. Rocker shafts breaking, that's a different story.

[bobcowan]

External oil coolers add complexity, cost, weight, and expense. To do it right is going to cost you, there's no way around it. For 3-4 track days a year, you're better off with a high capacity pan and a synthetic oil.

There are a few good thermostats available. But even when closed they allow about 10% of the oil to move through the cooler. When you're not on the track they will keep the oil too cold. On a cool morning it will be common to see oil temps aroun 120-140*F; that's too cold to work correctly.

Oil has a temp range where it does what it's supposed to do. Minimum temps seems to be about 160-180*. For the upper limit it's also a function of time. A few short bursts to 240-250* for a true synthetic oil is nothing to worry about. BTW, there's only 4 true synthetic oils on the market, and Mobile 1 isn't one of them.

[vector1]

i wouldn't worry about using a good synthetic with the current setup if you are only going out for a short amount of time.

[Bobcat]

I just finished a track weekend over Memorial Day at VIR ... temps were in the mid 90`s ... oil temps got to the 220 range when I really pushed it and water temps stayed at 180 to 190 degrees . I`m running a 6" oil cooler with the Canton oil thermostat as I also drive on the street . I agree 100 % with Bob Cowan and Rick on max oil temps and deep sumps . I called Canton and they claim their oil thermostat passes 99% of the oil when fully opened , however , I have no way of verifying that .
If you run an oil cooler on the street , IMO , you MUST run an oil thermostat to get the oil into the 180 degree range ... otherwise , bad things happen to engine longevity . fwi , a friend of mine used to build engines for several NASCAR teams and he also liked to see oil temps in the 220 to 230 range for race engines .

Bob

[Bobcat]

Rick ... you have a PM .

[Tom Howland]

I have a Beaumont oil cooler by pass and remote filter. Just turn the valve to how much oil flow you want. It’s a new install and I haven’t had a hot enough day to open it yet.
Oil cooler by pass valve

[madmaxx]

More important what was the oil pressure when was your oil was at those temps, if it was 50-60 psig, you are good to go.

[Tulsa cobra]

Running Mobil 1, but I have no problem changing to a synthetic, I know there were several threads on that, oil pressure remained at 3.5 to 4 bar the entire time, which is 45-58psi. No noticeable drop in corners, I had a passenger keep a very close eye on it during the first few outing out.

I agree about driving within my limits. That being said, I know that I have a tendency to push a little to improve, I will make more of a effort of this time keeping the limit a little bit further down.


What is the problem with running a higher temp for a total time of 20 minutes tops (assuming that 60 or 70 percent of the time on the track the oil temp will be in the normal range) as long as the pressure stays normal. I personally would rather change my oil after a track day, then go to the expense and work of adding an oil cooler just for the 3 days a year.

I have some very good video, it is currently being edited by one of my friends, I used the Drift HD170 with a remote mic ( would highly recommend over a GoPro) and I have 4 different camera and mic placements.

Will post as soon as finished.

[DAVID GAGNARD]

Originally Posted by Tulsa cobra

Running Mobil 1, but I have no problem changing to a synthetic, I know there were several threads on that, oil pressure remained at 3.5 to 4 bar the entire time, which is 45-58psi. No noticeable drop in corners, I had a passenger keep a very close eye on it during the first few outing out.

I agree about driving within my limits. That being said, I know that I have a tendency to push a little to improve, I will make more of a effort of this time keeping the limit a little bit further down.


What is the problem with running a higher temp for a total time of 20 minutes tops (assuming that 60 or 70 percent of the time on the track the oil temp will be in the normal range) as long as the pressure stays normal. I personally would rather change my oil after a track day, then go to the expense and work of adding an oil cooler just for the 3 days a year.

I have some very good video, it is currently being edited by one of my friends, I used the Drift HD170 with a remote mic ( would highly recommend over a GoPro) and I have 4 different camera and mic placements.

Will post as soon as finished.

For 3 or 4 track days a year,as long as your oil pressure is good don't worry about it,use a good synthetic oil and you'll be fine, synthetic oil is good for up to 300 degrees....oil temp is directly related to rpms, higher rpms,higher oil temp, you could always lower your shift point by 500 or so rpms, this might help keep the oil temp down some, but overall, you'll be fine....not a bad idea to do an oil change after a hard track day.......
David

[lovehamr]

Originally Posted by Tulsa cobra

oil pressure remained at 3.5 to 4 bar the entire time, which is 45-58psi.

Just a note on the math (a good one though) 3.5 bar would equal about 50.75psi and 4 bar would be the 58 so you really never went below 50 psi while you were running. I'd call that a good thing.

I'm in the process of plumbing in my cooler with a canton thermostat so once I get the puppy back on the road I'll see how that goes. I live in S.E. GA and it gets quite hot here as well. If this thing over-cools the oil, as is prognosticated by some here, then the first thing I'll try is the old cardboard over the cooler trick. If that doesn't work then I'll drop back and punt.

Steve

[PLDRIVE]

Lovehamr i doubt you will have any trouble keeping that engine up to temp. I have the Canton Thermostat on my car, and after several minutes of driving, temps are up to around 190 degrees (10w-40).
Tulsa Cobra run a good synthetic oil. Stepping up to a higher viscosity oil when doing track events will help to lower the temps a bit

[xlr8or]

You could always put the cooler in there and just cover it up when the temps are lower.

[bobcowan]

I originall installed mine with a billit Russell thermostat. During the summer it wasn't an issue. Oil would warm up yo proper operating temp. It took a little bit longer than normal, but not much.

On a cold morning, it's a differant story. The engine warmed up t the oil didn't. That small amount that flowed through the cooler kept the oil pretty cold. I tried to cover he coller with duct tape, cardboard, and cardboard held on with duct tape. It was better, but still couldn't get the oil up to temp.

So I now use a completly seperate cooling circuit, with it's own electric pump. It adds a little weight, but works better.

[lovehamr]

Bob, would you mind posting pics or a scematic of how you did that?

[bobcowan]

Originally Posted by lovehamr

Bob, would you mind posting pics or a scematic of how you did that?

It wasn't very difficult. I got the idea from a friend of mine, and used all off the shelf parts. Nothing fancy in my garage.

The first step was to tap into the oil pan. I installed a pair of -10 bungs, pick up at the bottom of the sump, and return at the front of the pan. Initially I used bolt in parts, with a gasket. Later on I welded some to the pan.



The Tilton electric pump was designed to move gear oil from the trans or diff through a cooler in back. It has no trouble moving hot engine oil.



I mounted the pump to the frame rail. I didn't like the cheap mounting bracket it cam with. So I added a hose clamp for extra protection.


I routed the cooling line from the right side of the sump, along the right frame rail, through the cooler, back along the left frame rail, to the pump, and then back to the front of the pan. I don't have a picture of it, but I also installed a filter just past the pick up. If I blow up another engine, it will keep trash out of the cooler and pump.

The pump is controlled by a manual switch on the dash. If the pump is off and the pan is hot, you don't want to turn the pump on while the engine is running. That will dump a slug of cold oil into the pan. It can shock the pump and break things - like the distributer gear, or oil pump drive shaft.

I instaled the pump at the end of the circuit, as that's where the oil will be coolest. In theory, the pump will last longer with less heat exposure.

The pump is also self priming. When I change the oil, I run the pump when the pan is empty, and that pulls the old oil out of the cooler and lines. When I refill the pan and run the pump. Very simple.

The whole thing works quite well. The electric pump doesn't flow as much oil as the engine pump, so it doesn't cool quite as well. It's gotten as high as 220-225*. But with a good synthetic oil it's still way below max temp.