fire suppression types pro/cons

[Beastly]

I am trying to decide on a fire suppression system type. At first it seemed a straight forward decision.

Now that I have done my research I am really perplexed. In late 90s most ran Halon1211 and FE36- Now foam fire types are becoming more common.

I found Halon 1211 and foam fire types to be running neck and neck.

I am carb'd and not running any NOS or pressured induction that would fuel a compartment fire.

The ease of recharging/clean-up for the foam fire types is a definate plus-Not that I plan on having a lots of fires So I ask for input from group.

[fordracing65]

Safecraft, that is what the Kirkhams use on there cars.

[Beastly]

I found most safecrafts are using the FE36 agent but I do beleive they offered 1211. I am not sure what agent is best for the configuration of the car. Open cockpit fiberglass enginebay. Whereas the kirkham decision may have been based on the aluminum body of the car. I realize I may be digging deep.

[fordracing65]

I have seen on a few csx glass cars, but they may be wrong.

[mrmustang]

Coldfire

The safecraft "halon style" systems work on the principal of removing oxygen from the fire, sadly, with an open cockpit car like the cobra, this just does not work well.


Bill S.

[csingletary01]

Something to think about with Foam Systems is freezing. I have a Safequip foam system in my vintage racing Formula Vee and the bottle is filled with water/foam chemical mix. Will freeze in low temps and it is possible for it to freeze and split bottle. So on a street car this could be and issue if driven in cold weather or left in an unheated storage.

[mrmustang]

Originally Posted by csingletary01

Something to think about with Foam Systems is freezing. I have a Safequip foam system in my vintage racing Formula Vee and the bottle is filled with water/foam chemical mix. Will freeze in low temps and it is possible for it to freeze and split bottle. So on a street car this could be and issue if driven in cold weather or left in an unheated storage.

Back when I was doing a group buy for FireFreeze (Coldfire) we had the company design a low temp formula that did not freeze (I think it was -10f to -15f or so before it would) under normal temps. Never had an issue with any of mine (unheated garage or out in my trailer at the time). yes, you do have to worry if you do not have what is now a standard mix, but was a special order item back then.

Bill S.

[madmaxx]

why have one at all? Put your money into correct install, tires, if you want to spend.

[SPF1061]

Originally Posted by madmaxx

why have one at all? Put your money into correct install, tires, if you want to spend.

In 11 years and 62000 miles of Cobra driving I've had 2 engine bay fires. I was running Yokos when I had the first fire and Avons during the second fire. In neither case did my tires put out the fires. Fortunately, my fire suppression system worked just fine.

[tkb289]

Any thoughts as to the need for a fire suppression system in a car with a mechanical fuel pump vs one with an electric pump? Or Carb setup vs Fuel Injection ?

There are differences in fuel pressure and plumbing with the different fuel delivery systems … does this change the 'need' for a fire suppression system ?

Don't intend to sidetrack the OP's original question, just wonder if different setups would be a factor when considering the installation, or the type of fire suppression system.

[undy]

Here's the fixed Halon system I'm running.


I've got two multi-angled nozzles on the right and left on the engine, spraying up and down both sides of the intake/carb. I also have a nozzle under the dash and into the driver's footwell.



Actuation trigger on the dash...

[mreid]

I would think about the steps in preventing a fire first, then in puting it out. If you have an electric fuel pump, an inertia or at a minimum oil pressure electric cut out is mandatory. Routing and type of lines and connections is next. Anyway, prevention needs to come first, then puting it out. Hand held is good to protect you, but you need to protect your value, read as cobra next. At a minimum, engine compartment, but you might want to consider trunk since that's where the bomb lives. Individual controls is also nice, but that may take too much thinking in an emergency.

What I'm saying is think through the entire process from prevention to life saving to investment saving.

[SwiftDB4]

I always had Halon systems in the half dozen race cars I had over the years. Only had to pull it once, but it was the superior fire suppresion until environmental concerns were discovered. Safecraft and a few others still sell Halon systems, but refilling them may be a problem as time goes by. I see SFI no longer certifies Halon for new race system use. Anyone out there actually discharged a foam system?

[Outwest34au]

I have done a lot of work with and prefer AFF Foam systems.
A 9 litre tank in the boot with 5 micro nozzles is a good compromise between protection v's size/ weight.
Most of the installs I have done have been 2 x 106 ltre, 4 x 106 litre, 60 litre and a few 23 litre. They are good for industrial equipment but I wouldnt like to be dragging that sort excess weight around in the cobra.
You can set up a Loss of Pressure system (LOP) which may go off if you ever get a air leak in the holding system, or a Rise of Pressure system which burns a wick that makes gas pressure to open the valve and release the goods.
LOP is probably the better system in event of a fire but ROp is less prone to false triggering.

[Beastly]

I appreciate the responses- Particularly prevention first! As I understand the input the following seems to be consensus based on my situation (a elect pump on carb) is: 1. shut off pump. 2. Kill electrical 3. Dispense fire retardant. 4. Abandon aircraft- Sounds like an inflight emergency checklist!!! I am thinking the rechargeable 10lb foam equivalent is for me...install and refill costs + issues mentioned by Bill S (works better in open areas).

[kevins2]

I'm also working throught the details of an upcoming build and have considered the alternatives. Think I'll start with an extinguisher in the cockpit and consider a more automated system as a mod (want to get the car on the road first). Take a look at the coldfire product before you make a decision - it looks like a good choice for our application - Cold Fire - Multipurpose foaming wetting agent for firefighting - Firefreeze Worldwide. Also click on the "Racing" link on the left side of the page - worth a read.

Regards,

Kevin

[Beastly]

kevins2

Wow! I just read the cold fire link. This stuff seems very impressive, thanks for the info! ...just when I thought I had figured out the right answer for me setup- I learn something else...I gonna do some cost benefit comparison over the weekend.

[kevins2]

Bill S. (aka Mr. Mustang) has posted on this before and apparently used to be a dealer. You should be able to find his other posts with a search on cold fire. I'd never heard of it before but it sounds like the best solution - works great, non-toxic, non-corrosive to the car, being used in race cars...

As for cost, the only reason cost would really come into play is if you have to recharge the cylinder annually. Otherwise, it is a one time cost for a long period of time so shouldn't be an issue. Bill, if you read this, what's the recommendation on maintaining a cylinder?

Regards,

Kevin

[mrmustang]

Originally Posted by kevins2

Bill S. (aka Mr. Mustang) has posted on this before and apparently used to be a dealer. You should be able to find his other posts with a search on cold fire. I'd never heard of it before but it sounds like the best solution - works great, non-toxic, non-corrosive to the car, being used in race cars...

As for cost, the only reason cost would really come into play is if you have to recharge the cylinder annually. Otherwise, it is a one time cost for a long period of time so shouldn't be an issue. Bill, if you read this, what's the recommendation on maintaining a cylinder?

Regards,

Kevin

Install it and forget about it, check it annually for pressure and that is about it. Also when you buy it, ask for the "winter mix", I believe that is the standard now, but better to be 100% sure upfront.


Bill S.