Best way to adjust rear coil overs for proper height on my SPF

[Jerry Clayton]

I think I'll go over to the local high school (there's a teachers insitute day going on there) and see how many American cars are there compared to the furriners----

[Silverback51]

Thank god for beer.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Silverback51

Thank god for beer.

... and if you refuse to get on the bathroom scales you'll never know that you may need to lose weight.

[Silverback51]

Originally Posted by patrickt

... and if you refuse to get on the bathroom scales you'll never know that you may need to lose weight.

I no longer give a rip roaring sh!t.

[DanEC]

Originally Posted by patrickt

It's not what you do with information, it's how you adjust the coilovers so that you have the proper ride height while having as close to 50/50 cross-weight distribution with your body weight behind the wheel. Your car will do everything better if you set it up this way and it costs nothing to do it.

So if I understand correctly your initially scaling the car and then adjusting the coilovers to jack the spring loading from one corner of the car to the diagonal corner and vice versa with the other diagonal corners. Your not actually moving weight - just compensating with spring pre-load - in other words tansferring loading to or from - say the LR corner to the RF corner. I assume that when re-scaled the pre-loading is reflected in weight shown on the scales and you're shooting for approximately equal L to R. Am I understanding this or completely missing the whole point? I'm more of a straight-line guy than a roundy-round guy.

It seems like that could seriously screw up how the car sits on level ground if one got too carried away with this.

Go ahead - flame away.

[patrickt]

Right, you do not actually put weights around the cars, you're just adjusting the springs (but you can move weight around, like the battery to the back of the car). You can get the corner weights right, and the ride height right, by taking your time and watching the scales. Try downloading that little program from Performance Trends that has the demo and try "raising the coilover" and then "lowering the coilover" and you can see how it affects the other wheel weights along with the ride height.

[Pman1961]

D-Cel and Hydramada...you guys are hilarious!!

[scottj]

Originally Posted by DanEC

So if I understand correctly your initially scaling the car and then adjusting the coilovers to jack the spring loading from one corner of the car to the diagonal corner and vice versa with the other diagonal corners. Your not actually moving weight - just compensating with spring pre-load - in other words tansferring loading to or from - say the LR corner to the RF corner. I assume that when re-scaled the pre-loading is reflected in weight shown on the scales and you're shooting for approximately equal L to R. Am I understanding this or completely missing the whole point? I'm more of a straight-line guy than a roundy-round guy.

It seems like that could seriously screw up how the car sits on level ground if one got too carried away with this.

Go ahead - flame away.

For any corner that you raise by increasing pre-load, you increase weight on that corner and the diagonal corner. Ex: raise the RR and you increase the weight carried on the RR and the weight carried on the LF. Likewise, the weight carried on the LR and RF would decrease by an equal amount. And yes, if you increase pre-load on only one corner, say the RR, you will increase ride height on the RR, LR, and RF, while decreasing ride height on the LF, thereby "screwing up how the car sits on level ground". But, say the LR/RF is carrying more weight than the RR/LF; you would decrease pre-load on the LR/RF springs and increase pre-load on the RR/LF. This will maintain ride height while while "balancing" your cross-weights.

You can not equalize L to R weight with spring pre-load adjustments.

[Jerry Clayton]

Stick around Scott--they all got mad at me for calling them posers

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Jerry Clayton

Stick around Scott--they all got mad at me for calling them posers

... and they dragged me out back and worked me over with a tire iron.

[D-CEL]

Jerry,

Not mad, disappointed. So anyone that wants a lower level of involvement is a Poser?
If they don’t want to build motors or lay paint that makes them less than you?
It must be lonely being that cool……

Patrick,

Tire Iron…..Don’t tease me..
Remember, this is your “shtick”. You happily waded into this pool and were quite unapologetic about it. MANY,MANY times, from your crazy narcissistic perch, you take shots at whomever strolls by and then cry when you get smashed like the cockroach that you are. Why is that? You may want to do a little research of NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder)
If you don’t want to get “worked over”, stop attacking. Present you opinion politely and someone (that has no history with you) might take you seriously.

[Jerry Clayton]

D-Cel

First off----what defines a lower level of involvement when someone wants 600 hp in a lightweight 90 inch car??In case you haven't ever heard, these cars had the quickest accelerate /brake 0-100-0 out there--

It is totally insane that someone would want a 600 hp dyno sheet but wouldn't think they need to balance there car out , not fot the highest level of performance, but just to have a preditable and concsistant level of response for any driving manuever that resulted from even the slightest to most extreme movement of any pedal or steering wheel or gearshift.

Your own deal is a glaring example of a very minor nature all the way up to those that have lost their lives----

Other responses clearly state examples of erratic handling and I have also received several emails requesting info as these people want a straight answer about basic handling pricipals and needed corrections without going thru the drivel that guys like you put out on the forum---

I asked ScottJ to respond to this corner weight issue as I believe he is probably the very best one on here(or anywhere else) to clearly guy guys thru this process--
My main thing has been drag racing altho I have been deeply involved in earlier circle track up to stock block IRL cars--and one thing that is a very necessary thing is for the car to be predictable to any instant reflex action taken by a driver as a primary move or a defensive/recover action--sometimes both feet in doesn't get you out of a hell hole

Isn't a Poser and a replica about the same thing???

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by Jerry Clayton

D-Cel

First off----what defines a lower level of involvement...?

I think what Jason was alluding to -- and Jason can certainly correct me if I'm wrong -- but we had at least one person on this thread who took the position that "I do not want to know what my weight distribution is, nor am I inclined to adjust it, even if the existing danger is exacerbated by having a passenger; I simply do not believe it makes a difference." It is certainly that person's right to have that level of involvement (or uninvolvement), and I think that is what Jason meant. While it may not make a lick of sense to anyone else, it is what it is. Most thinking Cobra owners will now at least think about having the corner weights measured so they can at least eyeball the numbers.

[G-Pete]

I like to make it clear ones more (for the last time)

Not to corner weight and adjust make your car NOT more dangerous, it just optimize the behavior of turns.

With other words,(for an example) you're on the track and your right turns are fine and the neutral at the acceleration point but your left turns you have a under-steer and you lose time.

In many cases (after checking/adjusting - springs, shocks anti-roll bar) it leads to excessive cross weight.

My 911 was 52% on the high rate and still placed many 1st. Just like to glue in the rights and drift a little in the left.

Anyhow, it is pretty irresponsible to spread the idea a car is not safe until it's corner weight and balanced.
AGAIN all your calculations, measurements and adjustments are OUT THE WINDOW when you have a passenger on board (or you gain 10 pounds over winter, or both).


...and Jerry, call me totally insane. C-ya on the track

[ACademic]

I wonder how many of those 700hp '13 Mustangs will Ford corner-weight before they let them loose on the streets? Same for Chevrolet's ZR-1s, the Camaro ZL-1s, etc., etc.? Do the ownership manuals in these cars specify that the driver must check their corner-weighting before they drive their new toys?

The defense rests, Your Honor.

[JBCOBRA]

Only a Fool would Not corner weigh a 5, 6, 700hp, 2400lb, 90" wheelbase car.
Unless of course you never drive it.
Mine was so far off at first I could absolutely Crank right hand turns.....but lefts were tricky at best, at speed. Balancing everything made a Huge difference in the car.

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by JBCOBRA

Only a Fool would Not corner weigh a 5, 6, 700hp, 2400lb, 90" wheelbase car.

In G-Pete's defense, it's possible that his corner weights are spot on. But I guess we'll never know....

[JBCOBRA]

I am not sure of the manufacturing process in Detroit, but I would bet they at least get a baseline reading.
All the serious Cobra, Stang and Vette guys around me just take their cars straight over to
Phoenix Performance
They know their ****e ;-)

Originally Posted by ACademic

I wonder how many of those 700hp '13 Mustangs will Ford corner-weight before they let them loose on the streets? Same for Chevrolet's ZR-1s, the Camaro ZL-1s, etc., etc.? Do the ownership manuals in these cars specify that the driver must check their corner-weighting before they drive their new toys?

The defense rests, Your Honor.

[G-Pete]

To stand corrected mine will have not 700HP more like 475 to 500 at the wheels and will weigh below a ton (weight distribution 50/50)

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by G-Pete

... and will weigh below a ton (weight distribution 50/50)

OK, I gotta ask... "How will you know that?"