The Unofficial Guide to Cobra Replicas

[Buzz]

As promised in the current "Which is the best Cobra" thread, here is my early draft suggestion for a format documenting and comparing the various Cobra Replica manufacturers and models.

I have used my Unique Motorcars car as a guinea pig (among other things ) and the format and layout is open to critique.

An originality rating and index is included because, after all - these are replicas of the original Cobra. How important that is will be up to the individual using the list.

Something like this has been proposed many times over the years and I think a group of dedicated monks and scribes should put one together and make it available as an ongoing basic resource for interested Cobraphiles.

I volunteer to part of the group that compiles the information and sets up the database, but it will take someone with spreadsheet etc. skills that I do not posess.

[computerworks]

Good luck, Buzz....

...hope it gets going and that you get some help with the project.

[patrickt]

OK, so maybe I should write the FFR and SPF categories?

[Buzz]

Thanks Ron. Hopefully It will at the very least generate some interesting debate.

[Buzz]

Originally Posted by patrickt

OK, so maybe I should write the FFR and SPF categories?

Popcorn stocks just went through the roof

[BAsque1]

Buzz: so we submit the info to you, I will prepare the one pertaining to the West Coast Cobras.
Basque1(Lou)
PS
Let me know the format; Excell perhaps?

[crASH]

This is great Buzz. One of the things that would be additionally useful to include, albeit difficult to compile,
is the various dimensions of the vehicles. Don't know if it is feasible to gather this data so this is just food for thought.
Pehaps a field in your spreadsheet could be included for future use as "Dimensions"

I just think of the vehicle dimenions that are available for comparison on Edmunds.com when I am shopping for my next
daily driver. The taller/larger drivers would find this useful.

i.e. legroom (length from front of seatback to pedals?), footbox (width/depth at pedals?), hiproom in factory seat, etc.

Just ideas.

[Dimis]

Me likes the idea, but am totally fearful (admittedly - sadistic) of the potential sh!te ph!te that will no doubt ensue!
As a forum we can't even agree on BB vs SB, or even 1 roll bar or 2.

Ahhh... What the heck... Best of luck brother, I for one love the idea!
...and really would like to see Patrickt make good his word and do the SPF & FFR cars... Happy if he put his hand up to do ERA as well... or should we leave that to Chas?

Originally Posted by Buzz

I volunteer to part of the group that compiles the information and sets up the database, but it will take someone with spreadsheet etc. skills that I do not posess.

PS: The guy is seemingly a genius with graphic designs, a magician with photoshop and no doubt other picture drawing & rendering programs yet admittedly lacks the skills to cut and paste in excel? WT...? I must be missing something?

[LightNFast]

Hi… My name is Fred Hornbuckle and I resent that the rating scale (in fine print) indicates my Corvette based replica with a “stretched fiberglass body” has a rating of only 1!!!
Thank you very much…..

I’m only joking Buzz. It certainly has potential.

All the best!

[YerDugliness]

I think this is a great idea!

I wonder how accurate the information will be since it will reflect the personal opinions of those users who provide the "data".

An excellent example will be the issue of accuracy...the sample spreadsheet says the body on the Unique is accurate, but that could be misleading...didn't we just have a thread comparing the ERA and the Unique, the rocker panel on the ERA seems to be more in line with the shape of the originals than the Unique, IIRC....to the uninformed (read: ME!!) that would be something I would not ever notice, but to some it would be a critical issue.

How about models that have been upgraded from time to time...Hurricane comes to mind, and what model are we on with the FFR offerings...MKIV?? MKI, MKII, and MKIII would require a separate field for each.

Sounds like a monumental undertaking, but if it is successful I think it would be one of the most visited threads on the forum. Does a week go by without yet another new thread by a noob asking these very questions????

Another field I think would be helpful would be one indicating where the parts for the build can be sourced...donor build (ala FFR), complete kit (like Hurricane), etc...how much fabrication is necessary (that is a deal-breaker for ME)...internet links so potential buyers can find online support communities (FFROG, etc.)...those sorts of things. All that could be invaluable for someone attempting to conduct their due diligence.

Cheers!!!

Dugly

[WardL]

This is a great start. I approached Brent last month about a posting a spreadsheet of replica specs in a similar attempt to allow newbies to have a quick reference to what is available, but have not heard back. I think it would be great to have a spreadsheet with the details of each manufacturer in one handy place. I've already put together the SPF, ERA and Kirkham and set up similar details for 427, 289, GT40, engines and buyer tips. I'll investigate trying to upload a spreadsheet to Club Cobra.

[WardL]

I've started a spreadsheet with Shelby, SPF, Kirkham, ERA and others. If you send me the details of your manufacturer I will update the spreadsheet. Keep it to the facts. We all love the Cobra we own, everyone understands that. So try to keep it factual and not personal. You can send info or an updated spreadsheet to my email: WFridrich@Comcast.net.

I tried to upload the spreadsheet but it was too large after creating a Zip file. Maybe Brent can suggest a way to manage this or post the spreadsheet in some way.

[Buzz]

Originally Posted by BAsque1

Buzz: so we submit the info to you, I will prepare the one pertaining to the West Coast Cobras.
Basque1(Lou)
PS
Let me know the format; Excell perhaps?

Hi Lou, I am willing to compile the info if necessary, but I would prefer to see a group of seasoned Cobra folks work together to ensure some standards of fairness, accuracy and reliability of the information. As for the format, let's hear from folks with expertise in that field on which is the best way to go, keeping in mind issues of compatibility with the forum, editability and accessibility to those seeking the info.

Originally Posted by crASH

One of the things that would be additionally useful to include, albeit difficult to compile,
is the various dimensions of the vehicles. Don't know if it is feasible to gather this data so this is just food for thought.
Pehaps a field in your spreadsheet could be included for future use as "Dimensions"
I just think of the vehicle dimenions that are available for comparison on Edmunds.com when I am shopping for my next
daily driver. The taller/larger drivers would find this useful.
i.e. legroom (length from front of seatback to pedals?), footbox (width/depth at pedals?), hiproom in factory seat, etc.
Just ideas.

An excellent suggestion! We would have to come up with a set of standardized measurement guidelines or templates and get owners to supply the numbers.

Originally Posted by lightNFast

Hi… My name is Fred Hornbuckle and I resent that the rating scale (in fine print) indicates my Corvette based replica with a “stretched fiberglass body” has a rating of only 1!!!
Thank you very much…..

lol! Good one, but I must emphasize the accuracy rating is strictly a measurement of how far the manufacturer chose to go (or not) in replicating original Cobra details and is NOT to be perceived as a rating of the quality or desirability of the car. One man's pro may be another man's con so the idea is to simply put the factual info up and let each person decide what matters to him and what doesn't.

Originally Posted by Dimis

As a forum we can't even agree on BB vs SB, or even 1 roll bar or 2.

PS: The guy is seemingly a genius with graphic designs, a magician with photoshop and no doubt other picture drawing & rendering programs yet admittedly lacks the skills to cut and paste in excel? WT...? I must be missing something?

We don't need to agree on anything here though. If it has three roll bars let's just state that and leave it up to individuals to decide whether that is a good or a bad thing for them.

I can muddle my way through most word processing programs, but there are others who have mastered them. I never attempted to and I'm happy to let better people do a better job than I could in that area.

Originally Posted by YerDugliness

I wonder how accurate the information will be since it will reflect the personal opinions of those users who provide the "data".

An excellent example will be the issue of accuracy...the sample spreadsheet says the body on the Unique is accurate, but that could be misleading...didn't we just have a thread comparing the ERA and the Unique, the rocker panel on the ERA seems to be more in line with the shape of the originals than the Unique, IIRC....to the uninformed (read: ME!!) that would be something I would not ever notice, but to some it would be a critical issue.

How about models that have been upgraded from time to time...

Another field I think would be helpful would be one indicating where the parts for the build can be sourced...donor build (ala FFR), complete kit (like Hurricane), etc...how much fabrication is necessary (that is a deal-breaker for ME)...internet links so potential buyers can find online support communities (FFROG, etc.)...those sorts of things. All that could be invaluable for someone attempting to conduct their due diligence.

Cheers!!!

Dugly

Firstly, don't get caught up in what I posted for Unique - it's just a hastily prepared suggestion for capturing the data. Next - We don't want this to be a promo for individuals to big up their preferred brand of replica, which is why we need a team of people that includes someone with established Cobra expertise willing to provide input, sort and compile factual data, good, bad and Dugly about each brand. the only field open to some subjectivity should be the wiki notes area where owners can post relevant material about their direct experiences with the only the car and/or the manufacturer in question.
BTW - the thread you refer to discussed 289FIA models from ERA and Unique - mine is a 427 model.

Originally Posted by WardL

I've started a spreadsheet with Shelby, SPF, Kirkham, ERA and others. If you send me the details of your manufacturer I will update the spreadsheet. Keep it to the facts. We all love the Cobra we own, everyone understands that. So try to keep it factual and not personal. You can send info or an updated spreadsheet to my email: WFridrich@Comcast.net.

I tried to upload the spreadsheet but it was too large after creating a Zip file. Maybe Brent can suggest a way to manage this or post the spreadsheet in some way.
Today 12:29 AM
WardL This is a great start. I approached Brent last month about a posting a spreadsheet of replica specs in a similar attempt to allow newbies to have a quick reference to what is available, but have not heard back. I think it would be great to have a spreadsheet with the details of each manufacturer in one handy place. I've already put together the SPF, ERA and Kirkham and set up similar details for 427, 289, GT40, engines and buyer tips. I'll investigate trying to upload a spreadsheet to Club Cobra.

Great WardL! sounds like we have a foundation to begin building on.

More suggestions please - what else can we do to ensure completeness, factuality and objectivity of the final document?

[Bill Bess]

Maybe a good way to do it would be to prepare a Standard form and format. Have each manufacture/company prepare the forms with specific required information. Specs., frame design with standard pictures, specify what comes with std. kits, Options, and custom applications available. Also list the sales options ie. turn-key to bare bones kit or part it out system.
By doing it that way each manufacture can put out their best information available and it wouldn't be influenced by us builders in the field. We would want apple to apples, not a bunch of information we have on our respect cobras including our bias opinions.
Anyrthing else is going to be pretty useless and give new builders some wrong information.
Bill

[BAsque1]

[quote=Buzz;1201963]Hi Lou, I am willing to compile the info if necessary, but I would prefer to see a group of seasoned Cobra folks work together to ensure some standards of fairness, accuracy and reliability of the information. As for the format, let's hear from folks with expertise in that field on which is the best way to go, keeping in mind issues of compatibility with the forum, editability and accessibility to those seeking the info.

Buzz:
I am not infering that I have tons of Cobra Experience, I thought that in fairness to ALL manufacturers, that the info should be included.
It is unfortunate that because one individual's undoing @ WCC that a great kit does not get the credit due. If you need the info I have the manufacturer"s specs and all other pertinent info available for you to include however you like. Let me know I am volunteering my time and info.
Sincerely
Lou(Basque 1)

[SunDude]

Buzz,

For the "Accuracy" category, it might be worth mentioning which original 260/289 or 427 Cobra (if applicable) was used as the basis for the replica manufacturer's body molds.

I tried to put together a list a while back, but this info is hard to find. I suspect a lot of replica bodies were simply "eye balled" and not pulled from an original car.

[Wbulk]

Buzz, I would really like to see measurements of the cockpit included if possible. I have been trying to get these on the various brands. One thing that most don't know, including some manufatures is that there are low, medium and high bodies. They measure from a low of 24" to high of 27" from the main floor to the center rear cowl deck.

The measurements I have been collecting are basic. They are:
1. From the rear center cowl deck to the main floor.
2. The height of the door at the latch to the main floor.
3. The body length and width of the cockpit (inner most points).
4. Length from the drivers firewall to the rear bulkhead where it meets the floor.
5. Across the seat the distance from the tunnel to the door.

What you are trying to do is great. One issue that has to be resolved is car version. Like FFR they are now on the Mark IV. Most other manufactures have not numbered or kept track of the changes. Another example is Shell Valley, when they started up again they now use the higher body that is 27". How do we resolve this? Maybe just a manufacture build date and if it varies from someone elses there would be another entry. Ideas?

Wayne

[Buzz]

Originally Posted by Bill Bess

Maybe a good way to do it would be to prepare a Standard form and format. Have each manufacture/company prepare the forms with specific required information. Specs., frame design with standard pictures, specify what comes with std. kits, Options, and custom applications available. Also list the sales options ie. turn-key to bare bones kit or part it out system.
By doing it that way each manufacture can put out their best information available and it wouldn't be influenced by us builders in the field. We would want apple to apples, not a bunch of information we have on our respect cobras including our bias opinions.
Anyrthing else is going to be pretty useless and give new builders some wrong information.
Bill

Hi Bill - if the manufacturers are willing to participate by supplying all of the requested info and specs, that would be great. We can send them the format once we finalize it, but somehow I suspect the response will be lukewarm at best. We can get basic spec info from their websites, but remember, we won't be advertising their products - we'll be listing all of the vital statistics; not just the positive hype from their promo material.
Owners and builders who see the value in providing objective data may well be our most reliable source of information. Maybe someone from each regional club can be the point person to use our finalized template to gather measurements and info from the various brands in their groups for consolidation and entry.

Originally Posted by BAsque1

Buzz:
I am not infering that I have tons of Cobra Experience, I thought that in fairness to ALL manufacturers, that the info should be included.
It is unfortunate that because one individual's undoing @ WCC that a great kit does not get the credit due. If you need the info I have the manufacturer"s specs and all other pertinent info available for you to include however you like. Let me know I am volunteering my time and info.
Sincerely
Lou(Basque 1)

Lou, actually I was inferring that I do not have all of the relevant knowledge and experience to be entrusted with compiling all of the data and info. I'm suggesting a team including people like yourself with brand-specific knowledge would bring the most value to the project. We will absolutely need the info you've already compiled and thanks for volunteering to help.

Originally Posted by SunDude

For the "Accuracy" category, it might be worth mentioning which original 260/289 or 427 Cobra (if applicable) was used as the basis for the replica manufacturer's body molds.

I tried to put together a list a while back, but this info is hard to find. I suspect a lot of replica bodies were simply "eye balled" and not pulled from an original car.

I remember that thread and you're right - most replicas are second generation splashes from other replica brands with a small few who can establish that their molds came from an original car. That info if available would be a great addition to the list.

Originally Posted by Wbulk

Buzz, I would really like to see measurements of the cockpit included if possible. I have been trying to get these on the various brands. One thing that most don't know, including some manufatures is that there are low, medium and high bodies. They measure from a low of 24" to high of 27" from the main floor to the center rear cowl deck.

The measurements I have been collecting are basic. They are:
1. From the rear center cowl deck to the main floor.
2. The height of the door at the latch to the main floor.
3. The body length and width of the cockpit (inner most points).
4. Length from the drivers firewall to the rear bulkhead where it meets the floor.
5. Across the seat the distance from the tunnel to the door.

What you are trying to do is great. One issue that has to be resolved is car version. Like FFR they are now on the Mark IV. Most other manufactures have not numbered of kept track of the changes. Another example is Shell Valley, when they started up again they now use the higher body that is 27". How do we resolve this? Maybe just a manufacture build date and if it varies from someone elses there would be another entry. Ideas?

Fantastic Wayne! I could even render up a line drawn template to create a visual reference for the measurements. We would definitely need to mention what generation car from each manufacturer the stats are referring to, with a possible listing of the changes made from the previous generation car.

I'll PM Ron (Computerworks) to see if he has any suggestions or guidelines for developing and posting the list.

[computerworks]

Listen- This thread will have a lot of info, requests and suggestions added over time and will probably become a sticky.

Do not, please, litter the thread with crosstalk posts or side conversations.

From now on, Moderators will simply delete without explanation any post that does not add value to the thread.

Thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator

[WardL]

I've listed the criteria for original. The format is all screwed up because I tried to copy-paste but maybe you will get the idea. I have suggested tabs for 427, 289, GT 40, engines and tips. How can I post the full blown spreadsheet?

Cobra Manufacturers
Updated: 7/6/2012
Contact Wfridrich@Comcast.Net if you have updates

Manufacturer Original 427 Cobra
Web Site WWW.ShelbyAmerican.com
Model 427 Cobra S/C
Type Complete
Manufacturer, Location Shelby American, Venice, CA
Notes
Approximate Number Produced
Retail Cost New $6,000
Typical original complete cost $6,000
Range of Used Vehicles $750,000

Standard Items:
Battery
Body Aluminum
Body Parts
Body Prep
Brake Lines
Brake Master
Brake, emergency
Brakes, front Girling discs, 11 5/8"
Brakes, rear Girling discs, 10 3/4"
Bumpers
Carpet
Carpeting
Chassis Tubular type chassis based on two parallel main members.
Colors
Dashboard
Defogger
Doors
Drive Shaft Safety Strap
Electrical
Electrical, Switches
Exhaust
Firewall
Foot Boxes
Fresh Air Ducting
Fuel Line
Fuel Tank
Gas Cap
Gauges
Glove Box
Hardware
Heater
Hood Scoop
Horn
Instruction Manual
Interior Panels
Lights
Lights
Mirrors
Oil Cooler
Paint
Passenger Air Vent
Pedal Box
Radiator
Rear End Type
Roll Bar
Seat Belts
Seats
Shifter
Shock Absorbers
Steering
Steering Wheel
Stripes
Sun visor & wind wings
Suspension, Front Independent coil springs with parallel arms
Suspension, Rear Independent coil springs with parallel arms
Tires
Transmission tunnel
Trim
Wheels
Windshield & Visors
Wipers & Washer


Dimensions & Capacities
Wheelbase, Inches 90
Length, Inches 156
Height at Screen, Inches 49
Width, Inches 68
Front Track, Inches 56
Rear Track, Inches 56
Fuel Tank Capacity, gallons 18
Front Wheels 7.5 x 15
Rear Wheels 9.5 x 15
Tires: Front
Tires: Rear
Rear End Ratio
Ground Clearance, Inches 5.5
Empty Weight, lbs. 2,355
Weight with 351 Motor, lbs.
Weight with 427 Motor, lbs.
Weight with 460 Motor, lbs.

Optional Items:








Subjective Advantages:









Subjective Disadvantages: