427 or coyote?

anthonyL · #1 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 11:34 AM

I'm currently speaking with the builder who built my last backdraft cobra. I am torn between the Ford racing 427 535 hp engine that I had in my last build or the new coyote. I built my last car in 2011 and the coyote was Available but I liked the vintage look of the 427. I have since sold my last car (big mistake) I want to get started on my next build but have been trying to decide on the motor for two weeks going back-and-forth. I like the reliability of the coyote but I am concerned about resale value. Any thoughts?

razerwire · #2 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 01:13 PM

I'm Involved with high end sand cars and have seen Northstar, newer Chrysler Hemi(not 426 old school) and various new technology engines tried. By far the big and small block Chevys with blowers or turbos are used. Same with boats, mostly big block Chevys and Fords. In a cobra, in my opinion, you would be best served with big block Ford. The new engines look different and somewhat cool but did not hold up well in the sand and did not put out the power needed for sand. Much more support with Big block Ford also. More builders with experience. I have had success with my twin turbo chevy Buckshot sand car and have had no problems with Shelby engine in cobra. Shelby engine is stroked and fuel injected, been in car 5 years. Also sand cars with Northstar, ect, engines do not resale as well. My opinion only fwiw. I bring up sand cars because I ran my car with guys that had these engines and my car is just ls1 with twin turbos, puts out about 700 hp and all I do is put gas in it. Sand will test your engine for sure.

Sawdust · #3 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 01:35 PM

427 for sure!

andig · #4 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 04:20 PM

Anthony,
I have had my BDR for a year now and have put 2000 miles on the Coyote engine and I wouldn't go back to a 427 (my previous BDR had a 427R motor).
I have the Vintage 93 Octane tune which produces somewhere in the region of 475/500hp and it is plenty quick enough.
A few observations compared to the 427 are (a) it doesn't have the massive low end torque hit but it is very smooth and has a pretty explosive top end ie 5000 to 7000 rpms. (b) the coyote doesn't have the classic lumpy/loud idle of the 427 but as soon as you put your foot down it is still very loud. (c), the lighter weight of the Coyote combined with the well matched TKO 600 and 3.91 LSD rear end makes the car much better balanced and better handling than my 427 and (d), I am not much of a tinkerer and the long term reliability and low maintenance of the Coyote appeals to me, although I admit when you open the hood it can't compete with the looks of a 427 with 8 Stack Injection!
Resale wise, I am not qualified to comment but I wouldn't expect it to be that much different from a 427 and not enough for it to be a deciding factor in which engine to choose.

Andy

Bill D · #5 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 04:36 PM

My vote is for a 427 FE

MJJ · #6 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 05:00 PM

I am in the same boat. I going to go with the new mod motor but am now trying to decide between the aluminator, boss or aluminator xs.

I would like to hear from someone who has installed the aluminator xs. Is it significantly different in feel compared to the regular aluminator? It is 2X the cost and 3K more than the Boss Motor.

toddl · #7 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 05:06 PM

We are about to find out what the XS will do. The guys at Vintage are about to do the final tune on my Backdraft with aluminator XS with Lund Racing tune maybe this week. Jay and Brian are the only people that can speak to seat of the pants feel since they are the only ones that have driven a Cobra powered by this engine. Should no more by end of the week. Hoping for around 500rwhp.

MJJ · #8 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

We are about to find out what the XS will do. The guys at Vintage are about to do the final tune on my Backdraft with aluminator XS with Lund Racing tune maybe this week. Jay and Brian are the only people that can speak to seat of the pants feel since they are the only ones that have driven a Cobra powered by this engine. Should no more by end of the week. Hoping for around 500rwhp.

Good timing on my question. Thanks for the response. I will be interested to hear the results!

Couldn't ask for a better tuner! Just curious why did you go with the XS instead of the Boss motor?

Dimis · #9 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 05:58 PM

Welcome Anthony.

Good name by the way.

There are NO right answers to this but if it were me in a BDR I'd go either a 427 if I wanted a carb, or Coyote in I wanted EFI.

Logic here is:

If you wanted to go modern, then go all the way, and that's the coyote.
Feel free to even strap on a SC if you can fit it under the hood scoop.
It may even give the hood scoop some functionality.

If you want OLD school then I'd go for a SBF without EFI.
That way you can still get yourself out of a fix with a basic screw driver.

On a BDR I'd personally stop short on an FE, only because ROI would out-rule this for me.

Just my 2 cents.

Kind regards,
Anthony

toddl · #10 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 05:58 PM

If I'm not mistaken the XS is the replacement for the BOSS. I was initially going to do a supercharged coyote. Was not enough room under the hood to do AC and the supercharger. Jay suggested the XS. Higher revving and he figured we could get similar HP with it N/A. Also, we would have the first one off the line that is kinda cool. To hear them talk it is awesome to drive. Can't wait to find out for myself.

MJJ · #11 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

If I'm not mistaken the XS is the replacement for the BOSS. I was initially going to do a supercharged coyote. Was not enough room under the hood to do AC and the supercharger. Jay suggested the XS. Higher revving and he figured we could get similar HP with it N/A. Also, we would have the first one off the line that is kinda cool. To hear them talk it is awesome to drive. Can't wait to find out for myself.

Ford Racing Boss 302 5.0L Crate Engine at AmericanMuscle.com - Discontinued

http://fordracingparts123.com/crate-...FcVFMgodgx8Ajw

The XS has more cobra jet parts and is rated higher out of the box than the Boss is from what I can tell.

Edit: I see the Boss motor is now discontinued. My mistake.

toddl · #12 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 06:26 PM

A call to Jay at Vintage Motorsports and he could answer all your questions.
They do everything from old school to modern. Tell him what you want and he can help you decide what is the best direction to go.

anthonyL · #13 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

A call to Jay at Vintage Motorsports and he could answer all your questions.
They do everything from old school to modern. Tell him what you want and he can help you decide what is the best direction to go.

Jay at Vintage built my last car and is going to be building my next also (great guy) I've been talking with him every other day...and I don't want to keep driving him nuts lol. Thanks for all your input! Very helpful

Ps I've been admiring the photos of your car for the past 3 weeks on Jay's website...Bad ass!!! Enjoy!!! My last build was #1012 on jays website FYI

toddl · #14 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 06:56 PM

Thanks for the compliment on the car. I know how you feel on the driving them nuts thing. I try not to call them to much but it is hard not to call everyday to find out what is new. The closer the car gets to getting done the harder it gets. Have you ordered your new one yet or are you still figuring out what you want?

anthonyL · #15 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

Thanks for the compliment on the car. I know how you feel on the driving them nuts thing. I try not to call them to much but it is hard not to call everyday to find out what is new. The closer the car gets to getting done the harder it gets. Have you ordered your new one yet or are you still figuring out what you want?

I hear ya, I think I did call him every day on my last build… Actually he had my car finished two weeks ahead of schedule, I think he was sick of hearing from me! Haven't ordered it yet but I've priced out the car a couple different ways, Again I love the look of the 427 but I'm in Cleveland and if there's any kind of service issue it cost me $1500 round-trip to get the car back to Jay to do the work. Not that I had a lot of problems with my 427 but there were a few times I wish Vintage was right around the corner so I could take the car to them to look at stupid little things. I'm 36 years old and I love the coyote I'm just afraid that most of the buyers that can afford these cars are older and want the 427? I'm guessing by your photos of your car you're around my age

toddl · #16 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 07:34 PM

Yep 37. I went with Vintage because I wanted a modern take on a Cobra. If you think Cleveland is bad try rural Arkansas. So, reliability is very important for me. I joke with my friends that I am building the Lexus of Cobras! (A/C radio heated seats ect.) I wanted the car the way I wanted it and I think that is the cool thing about what Vintage does. You get a car that is like no one elses! Looking forward to seeing your build.

anthonyL · #17 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

Yep 37. I went with Vintage because I wanted a modern take on a Cobra. If you think Cleveland is bad try rural Arkansas. So, reliability is very important for me. I joke with my friends that I am building the Lexus of Cobras! (A/C radio heated seats ect.) I wanted the car the way I wanted it and I think that is the cool thing about what Vintage does. You get a car that is like no one elses! Looking forward to seeing you build.

Thanks again Todd and enjoy that new ride!!

PLDRIVE · #18 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toddl

We are about to find out what the XS will do. The guys at Vintage are about to do the final tune on my Backdraft with aluminator XS with Lund Racing tune maybe this week. Jay and Brian are the only people that can speak to seat of the pants feel since they are the only ones that have driven a Cobra powered by this engine. Should no more by end of the week. Hoping for around 500rwhp.

Toddl 500rwhp is overly optimistic seeing that the crank hp is just over 500.

Cashburn · #19 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PLDRIVE

Toddl 500rwhp is overly optimistic seeing that the crank hp is just over 500.

You will be very surprised

WardL · #20 (**permalink**) 01-19-2014, 10:21 PM

IMO: As far as resale value, if it is a Ford engine, you are going to get back pretty relative to what you put in it. If any other brand engine, you will take a hit on resale because there will be fewer people willing to accept a Cobra with a Chevy, etc. engine in it. There are big block people and there are small block people. Of the 10 or 15 people I know with a Cobra, 90% of them are stroked 351 to ~408. You can see what I have and I would gladly trade it in for a Coyote or BOSS engine. I would want to fine the computer switch to change the sound to lumpy. There are few things more ego building than sitting at a light and listening to your lumpy cam..... I wouldn't worry about resale if you are going with a Ford engine, buy what you want. It is one of those decisions that at the time seem SO IMPORTANT, but once you get on the road in your Cobra you don't remember what you decided because all you can do is SMILE.....