Chevy in a Cobra

[AL427SBF]

Thanks Brent, I think we can agree "family cobra" make good pet owners, just don't go puttin' a bunch of us in an elevator together

I don't disagree with your kit car vs. replica distinction, but if one is to replicate everything that the originals had, including an FE in a 427 car and a SBF in a 289 car, then most here are kit car owners. That level of replication just isn't done, many think a stroked BBF under the hood of a 427 (or a 351w in a 289) hits the mark for replica and nothing more need be replicated.

The Shelby/Chevrolet misfire seems to be well documented, I'll let the true historians chime in if they want.

[blykins]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Thanks Brent, I think we can agree "family cobra" make good pet owners, just don't go puttin' a bunch of us in an elevator together

I don't disagree with your kit car vs. replica distinction, but if one is to replicate everything that the originals had, including an FE in a 427 car and a SBF in a 289 car, then most here are kit car owners. That level of replication just isn't done, many think a stroked BBF under the hood of a 427 (or a 351w in a 289) hits the mark for replica and nothing more need be replicated.

The Shelby/Chevrolet misfire seems to be well documented, I'll let the true historians chime in if they want.

I got caught up in it all, that's why I sold my Cobra.

So were there any Chevy Cobras in the SAAC? Anyone have a CSX number? I've never heard of any, just speculation that Shelby approached Chevrolet. That may be true, but there again, I don't see any reflection of it in the original cars.

[AL427SBF]

compliments on some mighty fine deep sea Evan bait there

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by blykins

I got caught up in it all, that's why I sold my Cobra.

So were there any Chevy Cobras in the SAAC? Anyone have a CSX number? I've never heard of any, just speculation that Shelby approached Chevrolet. That may be true, but there again, I don't see any reflection of it in the original cars.

Does the corvace count

CorVace Photos!

Enjoy.


Ps. Obviously it was no good else it would have won something.
Relax, relax... RELAX! I'm just teasing.

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

These are hotrods with cobra bodies, they are not required to uphold some standard of authenticity, bring on the LS7's!

My oh my... Haven't you changed your tune
Good to see you were listening though.

This from you in regard to putting a Chevy under the hood not all that long ago really.

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

No argument here, but there is one minor difference you overlooked. When I park at the local watering hole and get the inevitable "what's under the hood?" I can proudly pop the latches without fear of "you ruined it!"

Good for you AL! Good for you!
I'm happy for you.


Now it might take a couple years more, but it won't be too long before you change your tune on the SB revving faster than BB, and before you'll want a BB in your ultimate cobra.

Relax, relax... RELAX! I'm still just teasin'

Enjoy your day.

[AL427SBF]

Won't happen Dismiss, my roadster choice determined motor choice and was made in that order, looks like a little sarcasm to a patrickt comment
Truth be told, it's already "ruined" in the facsimile department, get about 15' from it and you'll know know something ain't right

[Dirkdaddy]

This is a thread I sort of expected on this type of forum (I'm new). I have bee non C2 Corvette sites where some of the faithful get very particular about authenticity and they strong opinions on what mods if any are tolerated...

Regarding how far should a replica be able to go and call itself a Cobra.. IMHO it should be built along the lines of the originals, the same basic shape of the body and having a loud, powerful v8 engine, RWD, and be a raw basic sports car stripped to bare essentials, not loaded with stereo equipment and creature comforts, ABS Traction and Stability control (although it could be argued this would be a good idea in this car). If you are putting the body over a corvette chassis, or using a honda 4 cylinder, I would think it would be better suited to another name for the car, but you can't force people. These are supposed to be modified cars for extreme performance. If someone wants to put a BMW M3 engine and suspension in one to go faster, I'd cheer them on but also they are going to take questions about "where's the Ford engine" from everyone.

If you think they all should be Shelby produced with Ford, well that's fine but don't be such a d*ck about what others want.

[BevanWright]

I would like a second cobra that has a mild and modern engine to drive to work each day, coyote or chev ls motor would be great. Kit car is fine for me.

[Dirkdaddy]

I happened on a Shelby register or something like that forum and one guy had a supercharged Lexus engine in his cobra. So there.

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by Dirkdaddy

This is a thread I sort of expected on this type of forum (I'm new). I have bee non C2 Corvette sites where some of the faithful get very particular about authenticity and they strong opinions on what mods if any are tolerated...

Regarding how far should a replica be able to go and call itself a Cobra.. IMHO it should be built along the lines of the originals, the same basic shape of the body and having a loud, powerful v8 engine, RWD, and be a raw basic sports car stripped to bare essentials, not loaded with stereo equipment and creature comforts, ABS Traction and Stability control (although it could be argued this would be a good idea in this car). If you are putting the body over a corvette chassis, or using a honda 4 cylinder, I would think it would be better suited to another name for the car, but you can't force people. These are supposed to be modified cars for extreme performance. If someone wants to put a BMW M3 engine and suspension in one to go faster, I'd cheer them on but also they are going to take questions about "where's the Ford engine" from everyone.

If you think they all should be Shelby produced with Ford, well that's fine but don't be such a d*ck about what others want.

Bingo! From the keyboard of babes, from a newbie, a neophyte, novice or what ever else you want to refer to this guy as he nailed it. Maybe it's the fact you need a fresh new outlook untainted with BS to this point I don't know. This is exactly what I have been saying from many posts back.

Case in point. Look at post #16. Is that Cobra replica? Geez, it has a body that approximates the Cobra shape. Clearly has nothing in common with a Cobra, 0, nadda, zippo beyond the body shape. My vote is it is not. Where do you draw the line? Agreed it is hard to define and like there will never be a consensus but at some point isn't there a limit? Crikey.


Whats this "kit" vs. "replica" stuff? A replica can be kit and a kit can be replica. You guys are trying to make a distinction where none exists. ERAs are kits, FFR are kits. They are also replicas if you at least use some "Cobra ingredients". A gauge set, gauge pattern. Shifter knob, spinner, Trigo, correct overflow tank, peddles etc...Doesn't have to be all of it just at least something. Make some effort to have some ingredient from the original receipe. Put a Lexus chassis and drive train under an ERA shell and thats where I have an issue calling it a replica as that term is now commonly understood.

Very simple the term replica is now commonly understood to mean a car which looks and copies a Cobra but is not a Cobra. The farther away you get from what a Cobra is inside and out the farther away you are from having a replica of a Cobra. Period.

Again, as to Chevy power. I have no issue with a "personal choice" to put Chevy power in a Cobra replica for personal reasons but don't start telling everyone it's the "engine CS wanted first or it's better a better choice than SBF or BBF for a Cobra replica" cause that were the chit hits the fan with me, the facts, history and reality.

Dimis: Look they have butchered original Cobras into hotrods and for Hollywood in the past I suppose the current production Cobras are always exposed to such tragic endings too. Sad really.

[mdross1]

Go to any car show every where you look are hot rods built so far beyond what they were originally nobody seems to have a problem calling them what they came off the factory floor as.
A Harley with after market engine is still a Harley to me, of course a small minority will argue that.

The way I see it our Cobra is everything I ever imagined a small two seater big block powered car could ever be and then some. Best of all I built it from the ground up but more important nobody is going tell me it is not a Cobra. After all except for things only the perfectionists would harp on about, this car is as good a representation of the original 427 cars as there is.

I'm participating in a Cobra forum should never be a need to defend it yet with some it is hard not to. That by itself makes me less eager to visit this forum. Thankfully though the majority of members here want to communicate and are not so one sided.
It is obvious we all own cars that stir enough emotion to defend them. Some days I feel like going toe to toe other days it is just not worth the aggravation.

[AL427SBF]

Follow-up question for Dirkdaddy. With this as your opening premise ...

Originally Posted by Dirkdaddy

... Regarding how far should a replica be able to go and call itself a Cobra.. IMHO it should be built along the lines of the originals, the same basic shape of the body and having a loud, powerful v8 engine, RWD, and be a raw basic sports car stripped to bare essentials, not loaded with stereo equipment and creature comforts, ABS Traction and Stability control ...

Do the Kirkhams, SPFs, BDRs, FFRs, ERAs, DAXs, APs and other respected builders of these cars, who adhere to your criteria above and which are not built on a donor chassis, meet your "cobra replica" standard?

Note "powerful v8 engine" is a broad category of motor. All the replica manufacturers as well as SAI continuation series allow for the buyer to select power plant and transmission. For US buyers the Ford motor is most popular, for AUS buyers the chevy motor seems to be the popular choice, for the UK I would say a good mix of both.

[blykins]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Whats this "kit" vs. "replica" stuff? A replica can be kit and a kit can be replica. You guys are trying to make a distinction where none exists. ERAs are kits, FFR are kits. They are also replicas if you at least use some "Cobra ingredients". A gauge set, gauge pattern. Shifter knob, spinner, Trigo, correct overflow tank, peddles etc...Doesn't have to be all of it just at least something. Make some effort to have some ingredient from the original receipe. Put a Lexus chassis and drive train under an ERA shell and thats where I have an issue calling it a replica as that term is now commonly understood.

Very simple the term replica is now commonly understood to mean a car which looks and copies a Cobra but is not a Cobra. The farther away you get from what a Cobra is inside and out the farther away you are from having a replica of a Cobra. Period.

My idea of a kit car is to make a Fiero a Ferrari, make a VW a Porsche 356, etc. Most of these "kits" are designed to use whatever parts the builder has in his arsenal, or whatever his imagination leads him to use.

I have ever-so-slowly been turning myself away from the Cobra. It doesn't matter what word you use to "punctuate" your statement you just made, unless it's a CSX car from the 60's, you have a replica....and to 99% of the general population out there, it's a "kit-car". Exclamation point.

I will agree that some of your higher quality manufacturers can get as close as possible to the look/feel/functionality of an original, but it's still a replica.

I'm glad I just build engines.

[AL427SBF]

Agree, there are good replicas, bad replicas and everything in between. Owners can explain to Joe Public what they built, bought or botched up, it's all good

[Cobra #3170]

Originally Posted by blykins

I got caught up in it all, that's why I sold my Cobra.

So were there any Chevy Cobras in the SAAC? Anyone have a CSX number? I've never heard of any, just speculation that Shelby approached Chevrolet. That may be true, but there again, I don't see any reflection of it in the original cars.

Ned will know the CSX number because I have related part of this story before and he knew the car. As I remember, this occurred in the early seventies.
I was running in a time trial at Waterford Hills race track and a guy showed up with an original 427 or 428 Cobra. He had installed a 427 BBC with aluminum heads and had the hood open for all to see. I gave him a ration of you know what over the blasphemy of putting a chevy in the car. He said that he believed that he had created the ultimate Cobra because it was well known that a BBC would make more power than a 427 FE. That really bugged me so I challenged him to enter the time trail and see if he could beat my Tunnelport 427. He declined so that was the last time we talked.
Several months later on a rainy day I heard sirens near my house in Dearborn.
I walked over to Outer Drive and saw this Cobra completely destroyed. He apparently got on it in the rain and it went sideways over the line and was hit broadside by a big Mercury sedan. Both the guy and his girlfriend were killed in the crash. I have a picture of the car somewhere that I posted some time ago on CC. This history after that is checkered, some people have said that the car had a fiberglass body which is BS it was an original aluminum bodied car. A guy I knew bought the car after I told him where it was. He sold the engine and trans and the Vin plate but that is all I know about the car. It is probably one of the famous "air" cars now because you would need the chassis stampings too and it was U shaped after the accident.

[blykins]

But it didn't come like that from Shelby, right?

I know there was a Ford 390 FE installed from Shelby into a Cobra....it was actually an aluminum block as well. Nicknamed "The Turd" ?????

[Cobra #3170]

Originally Posted by blykins

But it didn't come like that from Shelby, right?

I know there was a Ford 390 FE installed from Shelby into a Cobra....it was actually an aluminum block as well. Nicknamed "The Turd" ?????

You are correct, it came with a 428 (I think) but never a chevy from Shelby.
When I bought my car I had a Bill Strope engine blue printed prior to Shelby installing it and they were so nervous that I was going to put a chevy in it that I had to sign a contract saying that a Ford 427 was going in the car. Somewhat mystifying because they were doing the final installation and they would never do that. The FE's at that time were all iron and weighed about 670 Lb's so I can understand how a lightweight small block chevy might make them nervous.

[Jerry Clayton]

Brent--don't know if the car your talking about with the 390FE had one --but in that late 67 or early 68?? the Nascar racers were running 390 cid FE which were the bigger bore blocks and shorter 332 0r 352 stroke cranks-----they had weight /cubes ratio deal and these worked better for brakes on the shorter tracks--------

[blykins]

It was a separate one Jerry. It was truly a 390. The 396 engines that you were talking about were 427's with the 352 cranks.

[dallas_]

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