351W experience

[Lou1119]

I purchased an SPF about 3 months ago from a scam artist. He implied that he was the original owner but after taking delivery and reading the owner's manual I noticed that the original owner's name was covered with white out and it was not the person who sold me the car. He also gave me an appraisal conducted in 2003 which stated that the car was built by Top of the Hill in Livermore,CA.
Moving on, the car would turn over but not start so I contacted a tech who had worked on my cars in the past. After looking at the motor we pulled the MSD distributor only to find that the gears on the distributor were all chewed up in varying degrees. In addition the gears on the cam are also chewed up.
I contacted the seller several times to find out who built the motor but you probably guessed it --- he won't respond to phone calls or emails. We contacted Top of the Hill who said they did not build the car but had worked on it for the original owner ( not the scum bag who sold me the car).
Before we move forward I would like to know member's experience with a 351W that has been bored and stroked to 427 ci. That is what the flim flam man stated as to the size of the motor. However I am skeptical about anything this guy said.

Thanks,
Lou

[buddyg]

Wow sorry to hear this, scary when buying from individuals vs a reputable dealer. Mine's only stroked to 392 so no experience to report. Hope you get this solved quickly and as inexpensively as possible.

[Igofastr]

Lou,

Sorry to hear of your travails. I'm local (Granite Bay), have we met?

I can't say that I have specific experience with a 351 to 427 (mine is 393), but what exactly to you want to know? It's not an uncommon conversion, I understand that you have to be careful about wall thickness if using a Ford block, but it is certainly do-able. Many builders do this on aftermarket blocks. I would assume that like a 302 to 347 build, there can be issues with oil consumption, and that you can't wind it up as much as a motor that hasn't been stroked as far, but, it should make good torque.

As far as your dizzy and cam gears fighting, that's another matter likely related to the camshaft. Do you have a roller cam? Depending on your camshaft, you need to either use a steel or bronze gear (you may already know all of this), or there will be trouble...it all depends on the cam gear. Of course, the lash may not have been set right when the dizzy was installed, but thats less commonly a problem (in my extremely limited experience).

Anyway, if you haven't alreay attended, the local cobra group (NorCal Cobras) meets most 3rd Saturdays. A good group.

[Clois Harlan]

Most everyone I know that has a sb 427 have been very happy.I went the 408 stroker route and never had a minutes trouble with my coupe.

Clois Harlan

[PSB]

Nothing wrong with a 427W if it's built correctly. Ford Racing sells a 427W crate motor.

How do you know if it's built right? Only way is have someone who knows what they're doing tear it down.

[Tommy]

Lou1119,
You're either going to have learn an awful lot about engines, or find someone you can trust to work on the engine and advise you. I was fortunate to find a trustworthy local shop owner who advised me. I had my 351W engine rebuilt twice during the first four years after hard track use revealed some shortcoming in what started as a basically stock engine. After the second rebuild it had aftermarket heads, cam, pistons, oil pump, oil pan, crank, and was bored/stroked to 410 ci. That was almost ten years ago and I've had few problems with it since then. ... My point is that there should be nothing inherently problematic with having a 427W, but it can give you trouble if something wasn't done right before. The fact that someone apparently used the wrong combination of cam/distributor gears is a cause for concern. As long as it's going to need to come apart for a flush and new cam anyway, I suggest you have your trusted mechanic inspect the whole engine, make a list of everything that might need attention and develop a budget for how much it will cost. You can then compare that with whatever options (e.g., a new crate engine) you want to consider. ... BTW, given what you already know about this car, I suggest you have a knowledgeable hotrod shop look over the entire car, especially the brakes, steering and suspension.

[Lou1119]

Thanks for all of your input. We fully understand that the motor has to be fully dismantled, flushed and completely rebuilt. The car had 2,900 miles showing on the odometer but again I am suspect about everything.
I have had more years of experience dealing with cars motors, etc. Than I would like to admit.

Lou

[Lou1119]

Originally Posted by Igofastr

Lou,

Sorry to hear of your travails. I'm local (Granite Bay), have we met?

I can't say that I have specific experience with a 351 to 427 (mine is 393), but what exactly to you want to know? It's not an uncommon conversion, I understand that you have to be careful about wall thickness if using a Ford block, but it is certainly do-able. Many builders do this on aftermarket blocks. I would assume that like a 302 to 347 build, there can be issues with oil consumption, and that you can't wind it up as much as a motor that hasn't been stroked as far, but, it should make good torque.

As far as your dizzy and cam gears fighting, that's another matter likely related to the camshaft. Do you have a roller cam? Depending on your camshaft, you need to either use a steel or bronze gear (you may already know all of this), or there will be trouble...it all depends on the cam gear. Of course, the lash may not have been set right when the dizzy was installed, but thats less commonly a problem (in my extremely limited experience).

Anyway, if you haven't alreay attended, the local cobra group (NorCal Cobras) meets most 3rd Saturdays. A good group.

Once I get it back together I do plan on attending the Nor Cal events.

[Rick Parker]

You might want to contact FE Specialties. Even though it's not an FE, Tom is a reputable builder in your area.

[Igofastr]

Lou,

Feel free to come, even Cobra-less.

I've even seen people show up in Chevys.

I can vouch for Tom at FE Specialties. He did a fair amount of work on my 427SO when I had a Kirkham, and he built the 351W/393 that I currently have in my GT40.

He's up in Auburn now, but certainly worth considering.

PM me if you have any questions.

[SPF1061]

Lou,
Sorry to hear you are having issues. There are some very experienced and reputable builders on the board. I think they would all advise against taking a stock Ford 351W out to 427cid. Pretty much all of the stout 427 stroker motors use aftermarket (Dart) blocks. 408/410 is pretty much the safe limit for a stock block.

[NewYorkGuy]

Originally Posted by Lou1119

Thanks for all of your input. We fully understand that the motor has to be fully dismantled, flushed and completely rebuilt. The car had 2,900 miles showing on the odometer but again I am suspect about everything.
I have had more years of experience dealing with cars motors, etc. Than I would like to admit.

Lou

How much did u pay? Every used car needs fixing.

[Igofastr]

NYG,

I don't know you, but you've made quite an impression.

Perhaps its a rhetorical quiestion, but do you really think its appropriate to ask what he paid for the car?

And that, my friend, IS a rhetorical question.

[frdfver]

Pretty broad statement...I wouldn't say that Every used car needs fixing.

Paul T.

[DanEC]

You will probably have to tear down the motor or at least pull a head to determine if it's bore and stroke actually measure out to 427 cu in. Considering your story about the previous owner I would suspect it may not be - he probably didn't know himself what it is. Unfortunate story - I hope you can get it running without getting completely upside down on it.

[madmaxx]

So a reputable dealer pulls distributors? Kinda why I buy engines that say Roush or kc on them or a reputable builder like blykins with appropriate documentation including dyno work etc....

Not a real big deal. Call blykins tell him to build what u want.

[Tony Radford]

Lou, I have a 427W stroker in my car and have had for about seven years. I have over 30K miles on the car. I love the engine. It was built by Southern Automotive a bit south of Atlanta. It used to consume oil, but a switch from Amsoil synthetic to Lucas racing oil fixed that.

[Fenderboy]

I have a 392 stroked Windsor in my shell valley car, and love it. I considered the option of the 427 when my builder here in Oklahoma discussed it with me. He advised against the 427 due to "extreme rod angles" and generally higher stress on the internal components of the motor. My 392 makes 480 horse...so it works fine for me and has a nice torque curve, so no regrets, but I did think it would be cool to actually have the 427 in a small block. all that being said, I know several people who have had 427 strokers and had great experiences with them. GENERALLY said...I have always heard the more extreme the stroke geometry, the theoretical shorter the life of the motor due to increased internal stresses. Regardless of what motor you are running, big or small block, any make or manufacturer...

again...what I have heard from "reputable" builders and read in some literature. but its just my .02.

[Frank Messina]

The longest generally available stroker crank for a 351 is 4.0" so unless you have a Dart or Ford Boss 351 block the most you can get is 408 CI. There are exceptions to that of course but I kind of doubt the BSer you bought this from went to that trouble. FWIW.

Frank

[Rick Parker]

Ahh but every NY used car probably does