Dan and Daves visit to Alloycars

[mikeinatlanta]

Question:
1. If you were to build a prototype of sufficient quality to show it, why would you then destroy it? Even as a one of one it has significant value.

2. As I understand, the claim is that this car was purchased and then rebodied. Where is the original MKII body? Is it going back on the MKII chassis and being sold, or is the entire car to be destroyed?

3. I'm seeing lots of pics of bodies being built. If they only took delivery of their MKIV in the last week or two, what was used for the tooling patterns for all the bodies already under construction? Building quality tools is not a fast process.

[g8rnbft]

When did it change that alloy was going to do more than re-body a ffr chassis.

[CobraDan]

Well, I have been gone for a short time as other things other than this thread happens in my life. I see the same people have not backed off & we are 3 more pages longer. But my real problem is I found out that Dave has moved the pictures into his Picasa site & it changed all the URL's of the pictures I posted. I redid my first post & those are back up. I will spend the time to do all the pictures but I'm beginning to wonder if all this is worth while.

[mikeinatlanta]

Originally Posted by CobraDan

Well, I have been gone for a short time as other things other than this thread happens in my life. I see the same people have not backed off & we are 3 more pages longer. But my real problem is I found out that Dave has moved the pictures into his Picasa site & it changed all the URL's of the pictures I posted. I redid my first post & those are back up. I will spend the time to do all the pictures but I'm beginning to wonder if all this is worth while.

"Backed off"?? Really?? This little detail may have skipped your attention, but your snippy comments have contributed nothing to the information you claimed to have gotten for relaying here. Your photos of the same car and same half finished bodies has contributed to the general knowledge of what is going on down there exactly none. I was hoping that you would be able to provide a few answers, but I can see now that you have no desire to do so, only wishing to parrot what you were told.

Let me sum up all of your posts on this thread. "With this mighty thread I have spoken. You shall now disperse and be satisfied".

[ACademic]

You know, just for grins I was hopeful that we might just get 90 days down the road in order to see an actual alloy body mounted to some sort of integrated bird cage/uni-frame, that would actually make its way onto an FFR MKIV chassis. Just to see how it was done, how it attaches, if it looks right, quality of craftsmanship, etc. Large, hi-definition photos and close-ups. Nobody's equity gone but for some guy in South Florida that has some demonstrated experiences working with alloy (albeit language barriers and prior attempts to communicate clearly aside). Not so sure we'll ever get there. What caustic company we keep here at times, huh?

[AL427SBF]

Well said Academic, but this saga has run its’ course.
Ingo has reviewed this thread and has asked Dan to finalize it.

Per request, Ingo’s final statement, he deserves the last word imo ...

I do this because I love it and fortunately I can afford it.
The FFR aluminum re-body project was just another project in a list of many.
I wanted to do this "together" with the forum so the rebody would satisfy the most customers.
Because of posts un-related to the project itself and dishonest with harmful intent to me, I am pulling the plug on the conversion kit. You can thank mrmustang, G-Pete, twobjshelbys, mikeinatlanta, Jamo, RodKnock and many more.

"It's not worth it to waste any more time with the conversion kit project on this Forum. Those keyboard slingers made others lose out on a good opportunity, I am loosing absolutely nothing. Their comments are so obviously stupid, as they talk between themselves and it just backfires on CC making it a place for under aged kids. Well, you can be 40 years old but still being under aged. Just imagine. A guy staring permanently at his monitor, 24/7 looking for post he can probably use to respond to communicate with other guys like him...searching something to communicate only and do everything to keep talking. No girlfriend, no friend, no mom anymore. Every day, every week, the whole year. Just look up when and how many time they post. Who healthy soul will take them seriously??? I am soooooo sorry for them. I don’t have time to care about psycho problems. I have to built my cars so let them keep talking while others are productive. Envy world.”

As delivered to me and forwarded to you unaltered, eos.
.

[McD00]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

You can thank mrmustang, G-Pete, twobjshelbys, mikeinatlanta, Jamo, RodKnock and many more.

jamos fault? jamo has put up with more crap than anybody and been fairer than anybody in this string. judge jamo should get a medal for his feat dealing with all this.

[RodKnock]

As I said earlier AL, your credibility ran out. You decided to leave the site with the "nuclear option", insult the moderator, who let you stay, and then return to the site as the de facto Co-Director of Public Relations for Alloycars, while denying you ever said that you used the "nuclear option."

As for Alloycars, when they're/you're (not sure whom I speaking to anymore) further along in development, then give us an update with real information about the car. They obviously haven't researched what product they'll be using, since the few specific answers they have given just aren't correct.

Right now it's a pipe dream. I actually asked a couple questions about what gauge aluminum will they be using for the body and are the wheels pin drive or bolt-on? No one answered those simple questions.

Pete and Mike have been/were trying to be helpful, but then get stonewalled on answers or it was clear to them that Alloycars didn't know their product. CobraDan keeps talking about buzzwords like "truth", but reading along the way, I certainly haven't found much truth coming from Alloycars, CobraDan or AL. Just some overly used pics of some unfinished bodies.

And finally, I'll respond to the Mr. Poth's last word, which AL feels he deserves.

Just stop calling people names. Stop! We have friends, girlfriends, jobs, etc. We aren't immature, psychos, stupid or "retards" and we're actually productive, but we do get free time, which we enjoy spending talking about cars. Stop insulting people and work on your project by doing real honest research and development. So you'll know how to answer customer questions, before they part with their hard earned money.

Pulling the plug? Just stop the BS and build an actual complete product to sell. That's what Carroll Shelby did. While you may think you have nothing to lose, the Cobra market is alive and well and there is always room for another quality manufacturer. So, if you choose to give up the alloy Cobra market, then you've lost a potential income stream for your business.

From my point of view, it seems like Mike, Pete, MrMustang, myself, etc. are talking to a wall. We keep asking for more info and get recycled pics and for the most part silence followed by insults.

Your tired? I'm tired too. We're unproductive? Do you have an actual finished product ready to show us? Who's being unproductive?

[AL427SBF]

Hell, then leave me out of it ...

Originally Posted by CobraDan

I'm here to only answer questions of those that can read & I'm really getting tired of the members who are out only to create grief, give me a break.
YOU ARE ONLY SEEING WHAT YOU ARE WILLING TO SEE and YOU ARE ONLY BELIEVING WHAT YOU ARE WILLING TO BELIEVE.

Originally Posted by CobraDan

I want everyone to not start with doubt just give me the opportunity to tell my story as I have been here a long time & deserve that opportunity. I want not to be attach as was the Alloy team & yes that name calling that occurred should have never happened on any forum and if this thread goes south as the other 2 have, then I have not had my opportunity to try & resolve every issue you have.

Originally Posted by CobraDan

I hope I answered Larry's question & like I said just give me the chance. Right now my wife's son is in town & even though my wife thinks I live at CC we are headed out the door & my response time will slow way down until I get back. I can see now how a hot headed German (Ingo) trying to repair the problems that his friend TOM started did not go well. I just want everyone to know that I'm also German & when you guys start on me I have to bite my tongue. I want CC to be a help to all as it was when I signed on in 2001. I have seen this problem going on for a long time here at CC & I want things to change. I have met many people in person on this forum & we have been friends for a long time & I do not have a grievance for many but there are some that just have to snipe away as I have seen comments on other threads that have nothing to say about Alloycars but they have to post a negative post, PLEASE STOP. Ron Barsamian who still works as a lawyer does not have time to monitor every thread & I do not want to have him stop the guys who think every thread is a time to get funny. Again I ask you to PLEASE STOP.

... Good job at śhitting all over this guys hard work, you should be proud.
.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Hell, then leave me out of it ...







... Good job at śhitting all over this guys hard work, you should be proud.
.

Actually, I do feel proud. Some people might call it "Consumer Watch." Thank you very much.

Who's hard work? What hard work? You serious? You can't be serious. They haven't built one car yet. Please convey this message to Alloycars: Build a real actual production Cobra that can/will be sold to the public. And please prepare a real actual information and specifications list.

Leave you out of it? Nah, because someone hired you as the Director of Public Relations for Alloycars and both you and the company suffer from credibility issues at this juncture.

[Jamo]

Ok...

When CobraDan indicated he had made the visit and said he had some pictures to post, I requested that he let me know before he posted the new thread. I made that request several times in our email exchange. I intended to post a clear warning to everyone to back off until Dan completed the posting. That was not done. Dan, I'm extremely disapointed by your failure to do so. As you noted, I'm in trial..in fact, I'm on the 71st day of trial against a union...so I have no patience anymore when folks don't listen.

I've also had an exchange of emails with Ingo, who took responsibility for the actions of an employee and a customer logging on here using his membership while he was in Europe. He did not try to excuse those actions, nor did he ask me to reverse my administrative actions, which I find adds to the credibility of his explanation. He only asked that Dan's thread be provided a fair chance.

...and by god that is what is going to happen, despite Dan's neglect in failing to give me a heads up, which required me to read what was several pages of intermittent BS.

The following folks are banned from this thread and from engaging in any discussion about Alloycars on this site unless and until I tell them they can. The very first time they violate this ruling, they will be gone for a substantial period of time.

MrMustang (I've warned you enough...try me...and do not PM me)

AL427SBF (I sure as hell did not "invite" you back...that invitation to post an apology was before you decided to have a tantrum here. I haven't banned you for your personal attacks against me, but I sure as hell don't like you. Keep your distance from me...and no PMs...or you will be gone forever and a day.)

G-Pete...just humor me.

RodKnock...bring it down to a mild constructive roar.

That's it...Dan, get the rest of the pics/explanations posted ASAP, and do not PM or email me...just move forward.

[BevanWright]

Can I have the sample body?

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by BevanWright

Can I have the sample body?

LMAO...thanks, I needed that.

[BevanWright]

Hehe. I'd love to see these guys succeed, get sick of cocks putting people down.

[CobraDan]

I did not really know how to finish this last post for me on this thread but since I have read it all now, I will start by saying Jamo please forgive me as I knew you were working & I waited a week before posting as you asked. I have had nothing but grief for trying to repair the damage of Alloycars on the first thread. I personally went out of my way to keep club cobra as it once was, as I’m really tired of all the back biting that continues on this site. Again Ron because you were busy, I thought you would have been ok after waiting a week and posting that I had done as you asked, again I’m sorry. I’m retired & should have all the time in the world to answer questions but I do not & now that I’m being personally attached, I’m really disappointed in some of CC members. I drove over to Fort Lauderdale to talk with Ingo Poth & try & fill in the missing blanks. I met a man who I liked right from the start, he wanted to take Dave & I out to lunch & pay for my gas, I refused his offer. I spent 5 ½ hours in my car & only a brief time at Alloycars. I took my camera but never got the opportunity to take any pictures. I’m so glad I took Dave along as he took all the pictures. When we got back he could not wait until he posted all the pictures he took on his personal site. I had him take them down as he took pictures of many things not related to Alloycars. I wanted to be able to post the pictures with an explanation attached with each picture, as to which ones Dave. If I used a picture from Ingo I posted that it was an Ingo picture. I really do not want to hear about the 150 cars that were built in Brazil as I’m not getting on any plane to try & satisfy your curiosity & come back & find that the information & pictures was all in vain. In my very first post I included the pictures of a FFR MKII re-body in aluminum, with a full explanation I thought. Even with picture you still doubt that it was built by Ingo & his crew. I do not have the time to continue trying to satisfy those who doubt. Jamo thanks for giving me the opportunity to tell my side & please shut down this thread,

[Jamo]

I'm not shutting down this thread...unless of course I have to because folks can't have a civil discussion.

Folks here are entitle4d to make fair comment about what you've posted and ask questions, even provide some constructive criticism.

I'm tired of folks piling on and getting into asinine little tiffs of who's right and who's wrong...to the point that they forget the point of the thread. However, I'm just as tired of folks who post something and then think nobody here has the right to respond and ask questions...even to the point of being somewhat critical...so long as it is constructive. That's Club Cobra...we're not a bunch of old ladies making a quilt.

So...if you folks think you can have a halfway decent discussion, go for it.

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Well said Academic, but this saga has run its’ course.
Ingo has reviewed this thread and has asked Dan to finalize it.

Per request, Ingo’s final statement, he deserves the last word imo ...

I do this because I love it and fortunately I can afford it.
The FFR aluminum re-body project was just another project in a list of many.
I wanted to do this "together" with the forum so the rebody would satisfy the most customers.
Because of posts un-related to the project itself and dishonest with harmful intent to me, I am pulling the plug on the conversion kit. You can thank mrmustang, G-Pete, twobjshelbys, mikeinatlanta, Jamo, RodKnock and many more.

"It's not worth it to waste any more time with the conversion kit project on this Forum. Those keyboard slingers made others lose out on a good opportunity, I am loosing absolutely nothing. Their comments are so obviously stupid, as they talk between themselves and it just backfires on CC making it a place for under aged kids. Well, you can be 40 years old but still being under aged. Just imagine. A guy staring permanently at his monitor, 24/7 looking for post he can probably use to respond to communicate with other guys like him...searching something to communicate only and do everything to keep talking. No girlfriend, no friend, no mom anymore. Every day, every week, the whole year. Just look up when and how many time they post. Who healthy soul will take them seriously??? I am soooooo sorry for them. I don’t have time to care about psycho problems. I have to built my cars so let them keep talking while others are productive. Envy world.”

As delivered to me and forwarded to you unaltered, eos.
.

Perhaps you should not post private messages exactly as delivered to you as the rant at the end was probably not meant for general public consumption.

However, Ingo, if you are still paying attention. Why not continue with both the roller project and the re-body project? If I was in your situation, I would take it as a personal challenge to deliver both projects and show satisfied customers to prove MrMustang, etc. wrong. If you don't, it will seem like MrMustang, etc. proved that you had not thought this through and could not deliver.

In the thread about the re-body project, you wanted cooperation. There were questions asked that were not answered. It could just be that you did not have an answer yet. It is OK to say, my company is building a prototype, I have not figured that out yet. I will get back to you. If you wanted cooperation, you should have expected many questions like those asked.

Come back in a couple of months or a year or whenever you have products delivered and show us.

[CobraDan]

I totally agree with Jamo, & even I will come back & try & reveal what Ingo was trying to say, when he wanted input from the cobra experts here at CC. Yes he has secrets, but I tried to explain how he made that front fender all in one piece & not multiple pieces welded together with some pictures. At this time he will not reveal how he can make this front fender in one piece, as he considers this his personal trade secret. He knows that he & his crew made mistakes with the ensuing language that was inserted in the first thread. He tried to apologize in that first thread & he did send an email to Ron with an apology from him & his entire crew. At this time Ingo will not come back & post at CC even if Jamo lifts his being banned. I am still in good with Ingo & if you have questions, I could be his go between but not if I’m going to be thought of as his PARROT, then I’m through. I’m sure he would be glad to tell me the size aluminum he uses in making the cobra body. Please go back and read Brent’s post on being respectful when posting. Now let's continue.

[Jamo]

Bill...I warned you repeatedly...action taken.

[G-Pete]

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Because of posts un-related to the project itself and dishonest with harmful intent to me, I am pulling the plug on the conversion kit. You can thank G-Pete...and others

I can't speak for others, but I can speak for myself. My posts were always related to Alloycars. My posts where honest and to the point. The only one hurting Alloycars, was the person who wrote for Alloycars.

Originally Posted by AL427SBF

Who healthy soul will take them seriously???

Well, over 50.000 (fifty-thousand) views in that short period of time tells a different story.
As I said before in an Alloycars thread, for every active writer on CC, there are 500 reader in the background.
The general perception is the reality.
My assumption is, you are ceasing the project because of the lack of sales. At least that is what I understand about "pulling the plug".
Businesses make decisions based on sales, not because G-Pete posted...get a grip!


BTW: as of 8:13am CST Alloycars still taking orders on the website.

That forces the question: Development, production and sales are ceased or not?
This question is,
a) Related
b) Not harmful
c) Honest
and d) Serious