Why does every thread here devolve into a "Real" vs. "Replica" argument?

[RodKnock]

The 1st Gen and 2nd Gen Ferrari Testarossa's.

[mikeinatlanta]

As soon as I win the VIN tag being raffled on the other thread, I'm mounting it to my FFR so I can have a real 1 too.

[Joe's Garage]

Originally Posted by Nedsel

Regrettably, it is the Shelby organization that committed the fraud, not the buyers of their product. One has to wonder about marketing tactics that beg the law to look the other way so cars could be sold as something they clearly were not. And this is not a case of not being able to say nice things about my old friend Carroll - it's simply stating the facts.

Seems Shelby is no stranger in figuring out ways to bilk customers out of their hard earned money. The csx continuation just being one example. If Kirkham sold row boats, Shelby would sell the same row boat but call it a dinghy and get thousands more for it telling his customers it's not a row boat lol. I would like to know more about the Shelby-McClusky barn yard find, what scam were those two up to with that one?

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

The most recent Registry had just come out when my car was born, but had not yet been sold by Kirkham to me. I bought an "inventory" car, so no owner info was recorded, just the # 539.

I feel bad for you, since #684 may never make the next Registry. I think all the modern "genuine" replicas, like the Shelbys, SPF's and Kirkhams, will be removed.

So when I win the official Shelby tag from the other thread, I can mount it on the car and get it in the registry as the restored csx...

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by mikeinatlanta

As soon as I win the VIN tag being raffled on the other thread, I'm mounting it to my FFR so I can have a real 1 too.

I wonder if I should get my Kirkham "tech'ed" by Shelby American and convert to a Shelby CSX # and badge and make my Kirkham a Shelby instead.

How much would the Shelby CSX badge cost? Meh, who gives an S.

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I wonder if I should get my Kirkham "tech'ed" by Shelby American and convert to a Shelby CSX # and badge and make my Kirkham a Shelby instead.

How much would the Shelby CSX badge cost? Meh, who gives an S.

If you bought a 50th ann car 427 you would have it, its a Kirkham exactly, rebadged Shelby, they even used our billet suspension, Shelby how could you...

[REAL 1]

Holy cow. You guys are still at this?

There hasn't been a group of men so inept at trying accomplish something since the Keystone Cops.

As you were.

I check back in later.

[fordracing65]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Holy cow. You guys are still at this?

There hasn't been a group of men so inept at trying accomplish something since the Keystone Cops.

As you were.

I check back in later.

We love laughing at you at your expense, I live a boring life but love it...

[REAL 1]

[quote=Al G;1367176]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Speaking of agendas, cough, cough, the word "genuine" as it relates to the CSX4000 replicas is not used. QUOTE]

My mistake, the word "genuine" is used in the quote from SAAC in post 513. I don't know if it also appears in the registry. However, SAAC still recognizes them as genuine.

Ooops. Yes, alas, Rodknock is finally correct. The Registry uses the word "authentic" not "genuine". See page 27 of the World Registry. I get confused between the two words likely because they are synonymous. The Registry also defines them as "current production Cobras". Page 30. It also states calling them "replicas" is a misuse of the word. Page 30.

SAAC website statement in or about 2008 in relevant part:

......As far as CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars are concerned, SAAC accepts these cars as genuine Shelby American Cobras (as opposed to "original" Shelby American Cobras). The definition we use to identify an original Cobra is one which was, 1) built between 1961 and 1968, 2) at the direction of and under contract from Carroll Shelby/Shelby American Inc., and 3) sold by Shelby American or one of its franchised dealers. The only difference between original Cobras and CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars is the time frame in which they were built....

SAAC website statement currently in relevant part:

In the 1990s and beyond, Shelby became aware of the increased interest and subsequent rise in value of the cars and began building another generation of them—both Cobras and Shelby Mustangs.

This should really spool up the Keystone cops.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I wonder if I should get my Kirkham "tech'ed" by Shelby American and convert to a Shelby CSX # and badge and make my Kirkham a Shelby instead.

How much would the Shelby CSX badge cost? Meh, who gives an S.

The cost would probably be 5-10 in Leavenworth.

[Joe's Garage]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I wonder if I should get my Kirkham "tech'ed" by Shelby American and convert to a Shelby CSX # and badge and make my Kirkham a Shelby instead.

How much would the Shelby CSX badge cost? Meh, who gives an S.

If you did you would have to downgrade on suspension and brakes, maybe take a hammer to the chassis and weaken it a bit

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

The cost would probably be 5-10 in Leavenworth.

Actually, I've heard they've done it for other Kirkhams. The VIN remains the same, unaltered, but Shelby affixes it CSX plaque and charges a fee. And voila!

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Actually, I've heard they've done it for other Kirkhams. The VIN remains the same, unaltered, but Shelby affixes it CSX plaque and charges a fee. And voila!

This sounds like an urban legend. Let's let someone who actually did it come forward. I'm not saying one way or the other, just being not from Missouri, but "show me".

I know of only one incidence of vehicles that were re-VIN'd. (Not) surprisingly they involved Shelby GT500s (after Shelby was out of it). The last remaining 1969 GT500s were re-VIN'd as 1970 model year cars. The FBI was present to destroy the 1969 VIN plates and supervise the new 1970 plates.

But of course by then, they were just "replicas".

It would be a bit of SAAC history to know the original 1969 VINs or which 1970 VINs they became but I've never seen it come up anywhere.

[Paul F]

Somebody ought to stop this thang. Stay down REAL1.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n0mgkaEGQc[/ame]

[fordracing65]

He goes down in round 88, gets back up in round 89 to fight another day, just wait, like a cockroach...

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

This sounds like an urban legend. Let's let someone who actually did it come forward.

Well I proved you wrong earlier in the thread when I posted the Morgester/fraud/criminal cases back in 2007.

Anyway, the Shelby and Kirkham are the same car. Shelby buys the bodies and chassis from Kirkham and the 50th Anniversary Shelby is a complete Kirkham. Nonetheless there are several entries of at least one individual who purchased a few Kirkhams "with the intention of being finished as Shelby." I'll let you look them up since you could use some exercise.

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

But of course by then, they were just "replicas".

Quotes aren't needed, the modern Shelbys are replicas. See Ned's posts above.

[RodKnock]

[quote=REAL 1;1367208]

Originally Posted by Al G

Ooops. Yes, alas, Rodknock is finally correct. The Registry uses the word "authentic" not "genuine". See page 27 of the World Registry. I get confused between the two words likely because they are synonymous. The Registry also defines them as "current production Cobras". Page 30. It also states calling them "replicas" is a misuse of the word. Page 30.

SAAC website statement in or about 2008 in relevant part:

......As far as CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars are concerned, SAAC accepts these cars as genuine Shelby American Cobras (as opposed to "original" Shelby American Cobras). The definition we use to identify an original Cobra is one which was, 1) built between 1961 and 1968, 2) at the direction of and under contract from Carroll Shelby/Shelby American Inc., and 3) sold by Shelby American or one of its franchised dealers. The only difference between original Cobras and CSX4000 and CSX7000 cars is the time frame in which they were built....

SAAC website statement currently in relevant part:

In the 1990s and beyond, Shelby became aware of the increased interest and subsequent rise in value of the cars and began building another generation of them—both Cobras and Shelby Mustangs.

This should really spool up the Keystone cops.

Evan, you'll need to post the link. I can't find it.

The Registry also refers to your car as a true replica and Cobra-like. And then there's Ned's statements above. As well as your own stipulation that it's a replica. Modern Shelby Cobras are replicas. Not genuine or real or authentic, because a replica simply cannot be any of those. JUST NOT LOGICAL.

It's the Dolly The Sheep Analogy. It's a clone.

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Actually, I've heard they've done it for other Kirkhams. The VIN remains the same, unaltered, but Shelby affixes it CSX plaque and charges a fee. And voila!

Funny, I heard the fountain of youth really exists. Maybe that's where the re-badging operation takes place too.

[REAL 1]

Originally Posted by Paul F

Somebody ought to stop this thang. Stay down REAL1.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n0mgkaEGQc

Thanks Paul. No doubt whatsoever I'm Cool Hand Luke in this one. Absolutely. Have you guys watched the full movie as opposed to just that short clip? I am gladly taking that role.

[REAL 1]

[quote=RodKnock;1367249]

Originally Posted by REAL 1

Evan, you'll need to post the link. I can't find it.

The Registry also refers to your car as a true replica and Cobra-like. And then there's Ned's statements above. As well as your own stipulation that it's a replica. Modern Shelby Cobras are replicas. Not genuine or real or authentic, because a replica simply cannot be any of those. JUST NOT LOGICAL.

It's the Dolly The Sheep Analogy. It's a clone.

Rod Knock: You are just not getting this. You read and see what you want to see and hear what you want to hear. That's OK. Its just you.

I'm not good at posting links but I have cut and pasted the relevant portions and even cited page numbers in the Registry that are more than clear. Please just read the Registry. It's all explained and in there. Your arguments are jejune at this juncture. This is not difficult stuff. The only reason I am clarifying as this thread goes along is to make sure any new visitors' to this cite researching the issue don't have the issue clouded by petty, envious, trite and hackneyed smears on the current production Cobras. That's all.

What Ned says or doesn't say is not determinative. His knowledge as to the original series doesn't make him an arbiter of the facts, the law, reality, Websters definition and what the Registry itself clearly says on the current production Cobras. No person can change that I don't care who they are. Period. The facts, the law, Websters and the Registry are very clear.

BTW, your posts are still one of the few I will read (completely skip over the others who post at 3rd grade levels with name calling and insults) even though your position is clearly erroneous since you don't stoop to 3rd grade levels in having to personally insult. You are entitled to disagree and have your view but its erroneous. That's all.