Any 427 FE owners regret not going for a small block stroker?

[patrickt]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

Is it "Fysics Friday" again?

Yes it is, and now it's time for you to graph the path of a Quesalupa that is dropped from a moving Cobra that is accelerating at a rate of 50 feet per second squared. And if you can't do that, surely you can come up with a wise ass response.

[RodKnock]

Originally Posted by patrickt

Yes it is, and now it's time for you to graph the path of a Quesalupa that is dropped from a moving Cobra that is accelerating at a rate of 50 feet per second squared. And if you can't do that, surely you can come up with a wise ass response.

That'll be an expensive graph and Quesalupa, because littering has a fine between $100 to $1,000 plus community hours for litter cleanup here in CA. And I don't look very good dressed in a neon yellow vest. Just in case I want to prove that theorem.

[dallas_]

I've had both and like both.

Just get what YOU want, not what someone else thinks you should have.

[DanEC]

Originally Posted by rodneym

Physics says a smaller stroke does make it rev faster BUT, how much will you notice on 1/8" difference in stroke on such a big engine?
Considering some builders say yes and others no, it would appear that the difference is negligible.

That was always my theory also - but now I have two long-stroke modular motors - a 5.4 blown Lightning pickup and a 5.0 Coyote motored Mustang GT. Both of them - particularly the 7k redlined Mustang rev like electric motors. My 4.25 inch stroke 428 with medium weight flywheel seems to be extremely responsive and rev-happy for a fairly mild motor. So now I'm not so sure. There is quite obviously more to it than just the length of the stroke.

[Bernica]

I am 4.25 x 4.25 with a 236 / 236 cam and 108 separation. Seems to work for me anyways.

[Bernica]

And aluminum flywheel, toploader and 3:31 gears...

[Jeff mccabe]

Originally Posted by Dimis

Now c'mon Jeff - spill the beans... and start a build thread!
I want to know all about it!

Here you go !

Let my Electric Roadster begin ! - Page 5 - FFCars.com : Factory Five Racing Discussion Forum

[Dimis]

Originally Posted by Jeff mccabe

Here you go !

Let my Electric Roadster begin ! - Page 5 - FFCars.com : Factory Five Racing Discussion Forum

Thanks man!
I got me a bit of reading to do.

Ps. As for Physics - I've got my thoughts.
Barry R is right: a short stroke should rev faster. BUT that's not to say Brent and KC are wrong. The extra fuel that a longer stroke sucks in could provide enough bang to make up the difference.
Problem with physics is that while it always works, it only always works when "all else is equal", and in practice changing the stroke can change other things too. Isolating the single one variable in this case is challenging. It's not as simple as just changing the strokes.

[mdross1]

Originally Posted by patrickt

The problem is that if you don't go with the big block FE, you might very well be happy, but you will always question yourself as to whether you would have been more happy had you gone with the bigger engine. Life is too short to second guess yourself.

Learned this a long time ago. Building/owning a vehicle that makes you happy no matter what it takes is the only way to go for me as well. Life truly is too short for those kinds of doubts. Either way enjoy your ride.

[Dwight]

Any 427 FE owners regret not going for a small block stroker?

I think the answer is NO


Dwight

[wkooiman]

I've had many 302/5.0 style engines and 2 different 428s.

Back in the day, there was no question between 302 or FE. There were no stroker cranks and Windsor heads were anemic. That has all changed with the plethora of parts we have these days.

Having said that, I wouldn't trade my FE for anything. The only negative of the FE is the cost. Parts cost more with an FE - not a lot more, but more.

[jcam]

I researched and purchased my car based on it reputation, correct details (appearance) and for it's improvements over the Cobras of years past. My car has been improved on many fronts while still maintaining it's original appeal. I believe, many of the improvements made to the modern Cobra replicas would have been used in the originals, if they were available. And, this goes for the engine, I believe Shelby would have used a modern SBF if he had them available to him. I have a 400+HP 351w now and plan to replace it with a 427 SBF in the near future. My reasons are simple, the badge says FORD 427, so I want a 427. I plan to track down the HP/Torque information from the original BB 427 engine and have a SB 427 built, if possible, to match it's performance while maintaining the advantages of the modern engines. I drive my car year round averaging 5-6k miles per year. For me this is the right thing to do. For others, bigger is better!

BTW...OP - it might be an act of treason to admit that you would trade your FE for a SBF!

My two cents...Now quit reading these post and go rev whatever engine you have.

Jamie

[olddog]

Originally Posted by AC Ventura

Just wondering. With so many and not just S/B owners saying 331/347 is the default choice for a balanced car, if there are any 427 FE owners out there who actually agree that the smaller motor is the better route.
Somehow, I doubt it but interested in what the real-life feedback actually is.
Alternatively any S/B owners who if they were to do it all again, would build in the big boy.

Let me start with a little history, for perspective. The Ford flat head V-8 was made from 1932 to 1953, a 21 year success story. The first OHV V-8 was the Y block in 1954. Although produced in trucks until 1964, the FE and SB Windsor engines replaced it in cars, years earlier. It had a short life. The FE engine was developed from the Y-block and still had Y-block DNA in it. The FE was made from 1958 to 1976. Starting life at 332 cid, the FE grew to 428 cid. In its short 18 year life span, it won many races of all types. The little 221 cid Small Block sprang onto the seen in 1961, grew to 302 cid, and was made until 2000. From it grew the 335 series 351C/400C and the 351W. They were taller deck larger displacement versions of this small block design. Arguably, with a 39 year life span this was the most successful Ford engine family to date. It too has claimed all types of race tittles. Likely more than the FE, do to its long history. The 385 series that replaced the FE, also enjoyed a long life from 1968-1997. A 29 year life span, undoubtedly cut short by the ever increasing government regulations, which also helped to kill the SB.

Now why do some engines have a shorter life span than others? Many factors come into play, but costs and needs pretty much covers the main factors. The reason the FE had such a short life was costs. It lacked nothing in terms of filling what Ford needed. The FE design is difficult to produce and assemble reliably, which is its problem to this day. It requires much more knowledge and talent to build than a Windsor SB. To this day you will spend much more money to build an FE. It is difficult to house break (it pisses oil on the garage floor). The probability of having to pull it down and fix something that was not assembled correctly is much higher, when compared to a SB.

Now the FE is by far, the most nostalgic engine, at least to the old dogs that remembers its glory days. It is a beautiful engine to lay eyes on. It lacks nothing in the power department. The sound is glorious. It is the engine that came in the 427 Shelby Cobra that we all love. No one, who has one in a Cobra, is ever going to say, I wish I had a small block instead. However after spending mega bucks and running into problems and having to spend more, and loosing ride time, I’m sure some unlucky people have questioned if it was worth it. Some have sold their car, disillusioned. Most do not run into problems, just higher costs.

That said a 351W stroked to 391, 408, 427 costs less to build. By simplicity of design, it is less likely to have a problem. It is lighter than a FE, and can make similar power. Logically it is a better choice to build, if all you care about is numbers and logic. Performance per dollar, it is a great choice. It will never have the nostalgic value of the FE. But how do you measure nostalgia and put a value on it?

Similarly the 385 series engine is a great design. Dollar per Hp, it cannot be beat. It is heavy. It takes magic mirrors and special shoe horns to fit it into a Cobra, but it is done. The one I road in was the most amazing ride of my life, but it still is not an FE.

Bottom line: It’s a personal choice. What’s it worth to you?

PS
For those of us that do not race or auto cross (just ride for fun), there really is no need for a SB. I suspect most of us would love to have a 427 SO, if there was no cost difference. Heck I'd go for a cammer if it was free. I think if we are honest, most SB owners will say "I have a SB because the FE just wasn't worth the cost to me, but I would love to have one, if the price was right." If I hit the lottery, I will drop a 482 FE into a Kirkham. No doubt in my mind.

[Dangerous Doug]

I'm very happy with my KC 331 in my 289 FIA, and at times I think it's a bit much for regular street driving. It's pretty awesome.

However, I had an opportunity to drive a 427 SO powered Shelby Cobra, and it was AWESOME. Firing it up, it sounded like a biplane, too loud, too obnoxious, too powerful, and SO intoxicating. I loved it. What an adrenaline rush.

My 331 stroker seemed docile after that.

I drive my 331 Cobra frequently, and am glad I have the small block. It's plenty powerful for street driving, and really, I probably could have installed a Ford Racing 302 and called it good. Driving the 427 SO was over-the-top awesome, so I find it hard to think anyone would regret that choice. But, I don't regret my 331, either.

DD

[SHTMDWN PA]

Nothing beats the ground pounding, heart stopping thump of an original 427 SO. The Webbers are he cherry on top.

RodKnock, have you looked at the Chambered Classic pipes for Cobras?
"Purred like a kitten til the lake pipes roared."
Classic Chambered Exhaust Inc. - Home Page

[Kit Coyle]

I agree with Doug. I love the 289 FIA body style and have since I saw them
race in the 60s. I personally never cared for the 427 Cobra body style from
an artistic viewpoint. I have close to 400hp with the Boss 302 in my ERA,
which pretty much replicates what the originals had for power, and it is quite
enough for the street. If I had a 427 then I would want similar power and
torque to the original 60s spec. engine. For me the idea is to replicate the
look and feel of an original Cobra. No matter how much $$ we throw at these
cars, they are still replicas. If we could have a pit lane with a variety of
real and replica Cobras, all with different engine specs, and the ability to drive
each one in sequence around a track, then we would know which we liked
best! Wouldn't that be fun. In the end, I think they would be variations on a
theme! I like the theme!

[Joe's Garage]

Best of both worlds, 427w

[Dangerous Doug]

One thing to consider, especially if rude people can get under your skin:

If you have a "427 Cobra" and you don't have a 427SO, or 428PI under the hood you'll have to deal with parking lot trolls (as they get out of their '84 Tercels) dissing your Cobra because you don't have an FE engine.

As if...

I escape this nonsense in that the 289/302 block is "correct" for my 289 FIA.

DD

[LMH]

Originally Posted by jcam

I researched and purchased my car based on it reputation, correct details (appearance) and for it's improvements over the Cobras of years past. My car has been improved on many fronts while still maintaining it's original appeal. I believe, many of the improvements made to the modern Cobra replicas would have been used in the originals, if they were available. And, this goes for the engine, I believe Shelby would have used a modern SBF if he had them available to him. I have a 400+HP 351w now and plan to replace it with a 427 SBF in the near future. My reasons are simple, the badge says FORD 427, so I want a 427. I plan to track down the HP/Torque information from the original BB 427 engine and have a SB 427 built, if possible, to match it's performance while maintaining the advantages of the modern engines. I drive my car year round averaging 5-6k miles per year. For me this is the right thing to do. For others, bigger is better!

BTW...OP - it might be an act of treason to admit that you would trade your FE for a SBF!

My two cents...Now quit reading these post and go rev whatever engine you have.

Jamie

Shelby did use small block Fords and the majority of Cobra's were/are small blocks.
Larry

[rodneym]

You've all got it wrong.
It's small block Chevys you all should be driving.
That's the way Carroll wanted it.