A.C. Cars Ltd. looking for info

[1ntCobra]

And I am pretty sure I remember that David put a body and frame up for sale in the Kirkham Garage Sale thread, but it is odd that thread is only 3 pages now and I think that was a rather long thread back in the day. David had mentioned that he had sold just body and frame before as well in the past. I am not sure if the other companies that make aluminum bodies will do that.

[1ntCobra]

Now if you think your car may have originated in the 1970s...

[LMH]

Take a look at the quick jack body holes in relation to the vent hole in the body. On a Kirkham, they are higher with the top jack home almost in line with the top of the vent.
On an original car, those are more in line with the center of the vent.
I was hoping someone knew of a chassis number on a Kirkham that's placed in an inconspicuous place that Brian could look at on his car.
Larry

[peterpjb]

Originally Posted by 1ntCobra

Now if you think your car may have originated in the 1970s...

so what are the differences in the 289 mk I and mk II bodys?
the "289 sc" are the sebring or lemans bodys i suppose....

[LMH]

Originally Posted by peterpjb

so what are the differences in the 289 mk I and mk II bodys?
the "289 sc" are the sebring or lemans bodys i suppose....

Fender flare is approximately 1/2" wider on a "MKII" body.
Larry

[Phx Mike]

Originally Posted by LMH

Take a look at the quick jack body holes in relation to the vent hole in the body. On a Kirkham, they are higher with the top jack home almost in line with the top of the vent.
On an original car, those are more in line with the center of the vent.
I was hoping someone knew of a chassis number on a Kirkham that's placed in an inconspicuous place that Brian could look at on his car.
Larry

I wil climb under mine later today and see if I can find a number anywhere. Mine is new though somethings may have changed.

[Phx Mike]

Originally Posted by LMH

Take a look at the quick jack body holes in relation to the vent hole in the body. On a Kirkham, they are higher with the top jack home almost in line with the top of the vent.
On an original car, those are more in line with the center of the vent.
I was hoping someone knew of a chassis number on a Kirkham that's placed in an inconspicuous place that Brian could look at on his car.
Larry

Here is a pic on my Kirkham showing the relationship of the quick jack holes to the brake vent openings



Another angle:

[LMH]

Thanks Mike! That illustrates exactly what I was pointing out!
Larry

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by LMH

Take a look at the quick jack body holes in relation to the vent hole in the body. On a Kirkham, they are higher with the top jack home almost in line with the top of the vent.
On an original car, those are more in line with the center of the vent.
I was hoping someone knew of a chassis number on a Kirkham that's placed in an inconspicuous place that Brian could look at on his car.
Larry

In the SAAC registry it mentions 3 locations for Kirkham. Shock tower - full number. Door hinge - last 2 or 3 digits. Foot box tag - full number.

Of course the foot box tag is easily removed and replaced.

Is there a 2 or 3 digit number on the door hinge? If you get me that number I can see what it says in the SAAC registry when I get back home tomorrow. The registry may say if it that number is associated with a roller or just a body and frame.

[1ntCobra]

By the way when I was at an open house at Kirkham, one of the Kirkham brothers told me that he reserved the Kirkham serial number 666 for his use for his personal car at a later date.

[Phx Mike]

Originally Posted by 1ntCobra

In the SAAC registry it mentions 3 locations for Kirkham. Shock tower - full number. Door hinge - last 2 or 3 digits. Foot box tag - full number.

Of course the foot box tag is easily removed and replaced.

Is there a 2 or 3 digit number on the door hinge? If you get me that number I can see what it says in the SAAC registry when I get back home tomorrow. The registry may say if it that number is associated with a roller or just a body and frame.

On the Kirkham the last 3 digits are on the door hinge. See pics below. They are on the hinges on both sides.

[maurice19]

1nt cobra,

Your contributions are always very interesting and appreciated.

I remember when Mark Gerisch ( sp.), located in wisc., made an all aluminium replica back in the eighties and I think Jay had to have the second one he made.
Maurice

[mrmustang]

Confirmed with Ned (again), this is not an original COB/COX car and/or chassis number. He (and I) have seen this type of thing before, 90% of them from overseas, with buyers insisting they are real/original and found sitting in a warehouse or old dealership basement until they bought it.


Bill S

Originally Posted by LMH

A couple more. The number on the chassis is on the shock tower.
Larry

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by mrmustang

Confirmed with Ned (again), this is not an original COB/COX car and/or chassis number. He (and I) have seen this type of thing before, 90% of them from overseas, with buyers insisting they are real/original and found sitting in a warehouse or old dealership basement until they bought it.


Bill S

Bill,

I don't think any of us think this is really a COB/COX car. And it seems highly likely (at least to me) that it is a Kirkham, but I suppose there might be a very, very small chance this was something sourced from say some incarnation of "AC" in the last couple of decades. So figuring this is not really a COB/COX car, do you have an opinion on where it may have come from.

From what I understand it is a bit tricky to get a US sourced Cobra replica registered in Canada (unless it is an existing 20 year old complete car), but some manufacturers like Factory Five have found the right formula for producing something that a Canadian can build and register. Perhaps this started off as a Canadian attempting to get a Kirkham registered a number of years ago. From what I understand there is no way to get a Kirkham roller into Canada and get it registered, but perhaps starting with just a Kirkham frame and body might make it easier. Now lets say a Canadian tried to start that, but might have been trying to short cut the process by replacing the serial number, couldn't that have been a way that we got to the current situation? What do you think?

Ken

[adv-ent]

Hi, I resent the latest post, nobody is trying to deceive anybody or try to fool anybody with this chassis number.
I simply was asking if anybody could help me identify the manufacturer, I personally don't care if it is a AC, Kirkham or built by Billy Bob I was just hoping someone could help identify who actually manufactured it and maybe when. It is exactly as it was purchased so what ever or who ever stamped any kind of numbers on it, I have no idea. It is exactly how I received it from the US and from a US seller. It was cleared into Canada years ago as parts only by a local Cobra builder so please let me worry how it will be registered.
Thanks for all your help and especially to Larry for all his comments to me and for posting the pictures.
BK

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by adv-ent

Hi, I resent the latest post, nobody is trying to deceive anybody or try to fool anybody with this chassis number.
I simply was asking if anybody could help me identify the manufacturer, I personally don't care if it is a AC, Kirkham or built by Billy Bob I was just hoping someone could help identify who actually manufactured it and maybe when. It is exactly as it was purchased so what ever or who ever stamped any kind of numbers on it, I have no idea. It is exactly how I received it from the US and from a US seller. It was cleared into Canada years ago as parts only by a local Cobra builder so please let me worry how it will be registered.
Thanks for all your help and especially to Larry for all his comments to me and for posting the pictures.
BK

I did not intend to insult you and I am sorry if I did. I don't know the whole story, I assumed that you acquired this car from someone else in Canada in its present state and some earlier Canadian owner might have tried to take a short cut with the serial number for some reason. I did not realize that you brought the car in from the US from a US seller. Perhaps going back through the chain of ownership from the US seller backwards might be the best way to figure out what you really have.

Is there a 2 or 3 digit number on the door hinge in the location where Kirkham have their serial number?

[adv-ent]

1ntCobra, OK, thanks no problem.
I have checked everywhere, there are no numbers on the door hinges, I was even asked to check the drivers side rear frame rail end cap where I was told Kirkham sometimes stamps there numbers. There are no numbers anywhere other than the 0666 on the inside of the trunk clasp that I can find.
I even looked very closely to see if maybe original number have been removed but the paint seems original and is in very good condition and nothing seems out of place.
The biggest mystery is why anybody would use the COB 0666 number if it is a known fact that this number never existed and especially when all the original cars chassis numbers seemed to start with 6. Seems like a pretty stupid choice.
I have collected WW2 militaria for years and run into fakes all the time but most fakes encountered are at least not so obvious.
Unfortunately there is no longer any information of the previous owner, I traded the car away and never thought I would ever have a chance to get it back so until a couple of weeks ago it was lost to me. This is why I now am looking for info on who made it because it is now mine again. I can't even remember exactly when the car was purchased, my car is now over seven years old and the aluminum body was purchased before my car was started.
I do know it was not purchased from any kind of manufacturer but from an individual. It was picked up in Malibu Beach from a storage facility.
BK

[mrmustang]

Before I comment any further, I need to see full size shots of the door hinges, trunk hinges and latch, and the welds of the front "X" member



Bill S

[1ntCobra]

I was just looking at this picture of the shock tower:



And then comparing it with the picture of the Kirkham shock tower on page 851 of the SAAC registry.

Unlike the above picture, which has the number going from top to bottom, the Kirkham number runs left to right closer to the bottom than the middle.

The Kirkham shock tower plate also has 2 threaded holes on the right side (could be mounting a horn?), which are not found above.

If the picture in the SAAC registry is typical of where Kirkham stamps their serial number, then this does NOT appear to be a Kirkham shock tower bracket with the number ground off and replaced.

[LMH]

VvERY

Originally Posted by 1ntCobra

I was just looking at this picture of the shock tower:



And then comparing it with the picture of the Kirkham shock tower on page 851 of the SAAC registry.

Unlike the above picture, which has the number going from top to bottom, the Kirkham number runs left to right closer to the bottom than the middle.

The Kirkham shock tower plate also has 2 threaded holes on the right side (could be mounting a horn?), which are not found above.

If the picture in the SAAC registry is typical of where Kirkham stamps their serial number, then this does NOT appear to be a Kirkham shock tower bracket with the number ground off and replaced.

That's very interesting, thanks for posting that! I notice the registry also says the Kirkham number is on the drivers side shock tower. Brian can correct me if I'm wrong but I think the photo is of the passengers side.
Larry