Small block Chevy in a cobra?

[t walgamuth]

Tough crowd when 700 hp is not awesome!

[joyridin']

Originally Posted by Ace23

I wouldn’t think twice about a Chevy engine if that is what you want. A nice stroker LSX block making 700hp+ On pump gas with a hydraulic roller and OEM fuel injection would be pretty awesome.

Mine is 850 hp, and you can drive it easily in traffic or on a 95 degree day. On top of that, it gets 22 mpg on the highway on pump gas.

[Ace23]

Originally Posted by olddog

There are gobs of FE making 700hp and more. In fact Shelby built two with ~900 hp. The surviving one (his personal untouched Cobra) went at auction around $6,000,000.

People put EFI on FE too. You don't like FE? Well a EFI Windsor can easily make 700 Hp. Want something newer? You can make 700 hp out of a Modular to.

Exactly what is so awesome about it?

Just a personal opinion based off no facts. I would think the LS platform would be more reliable than an equally powered FE build based on the thousands of them running around. I also would expect the availability of the OEM electronics and fuel injections setup to be far superior of anything available for an FE. I have zero issues with a higher powered FE but I assume you really pay to play at that level.

If it’s a higher HP build I was driving all the time I want something I can easily get parts for and people know how to build. I have a dart block windsor but I will be making a change at some time as I want a bit more power...I’m running around 575hp/575tq with a t56 and 4.30 gear. I haven’t come across many 700hp+ pump gas Windsors that are not running rollers or higher compression. I spoke with Jim Kuntz before he passed and he convinced me he had a recipe. I now see that Bennet Racing located in AL offers a 445w windsor that looks like a nice offering.

I may have missed the original post but the value of one of these cars doesn’t mean much to me. I view them all as kits or replicas. I just want it to be fun to drive. So whatever floats your boat is good with me.

[Ace23]

Originally Posted by joyridin'

Mine is 850 hp, and you can drive it easily in traffic or on a 95 degree day. On top of that, it gets 22 mpg on the highway on pump gas.

That is awesome and I am jealous of that power and fuel mileage. I haven’t been on the site in awhile but if I recall you were running a turbo setup. I’ve never been in a turbo cobra. I’m more of a NA or twin screw supercharger guy. I would love the option for a blower on my windsor. I had a 600hp turbo charged Hayabusa that made 320hp on pump gas...what a riot.

[olddog]

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Tough crowd when 700 hp is not awesome!

You missed my point (most likely sarcastically ignored it - for humor).

You can make 700 Hp with a FE, 385 series, Windsor, Clevor, Modular, and a Coyote.

You can put OEM EFI on any engine. I personally have a Ford OEM Mass Air Flow EFI on my 347, and you can put it on any engine. You just have to put a chip on it to tell it the cid, injector size, MAF meter curve, and then set your AFR maps and timing maps for your engine. Likewise you could put a GM EFI on any engine. I'm not exactly sure how to tune GM and some of the newer stuff, as I have not done it, but I know it is done.

So that leaves "why do this with a Chevy engine when there are many roads to get there with Ford engines?"

I suspect the answer is:
I know Chevy engines.
My budy, who does the work, knows Chevy engines.
Everyone I know uses Chevy engines.
I can buy a junkyard Chevy cheap.

[blykins]

Ace, I have some 700 hp pump gas Windsors….

[peterpjb]

Originally Posted by blykins

Ace, I have some 700 hp pump gas Windsors….

700hp... 850hp... lots of power, guys

is that the power on the dyno or at the rear wheels?
brent, did you ever measure the difference with your engines?

[blykins]

Originally Posted by peterpjb

700hp... 850hp... lots of power, guys

is that the power on the dyno or at the rear wheels?
brent, did you ever measure the difference with your engines?

Engine dyno power. Last 460W I did made about 720 hp on pump gas.

I don't have access to a chassis dyno, so I only have numbers from guys who put the engines in the car, then take them to tune. On Cobras, the difference can be pretty substantial because of the restrictive sidepipes and air cleaners. I think the last Cobra that I saw the results for made 660 hp on the engine dyno and 550 on the chassis dyno. So about 17% loss.

On other vehicles, can be as low as 15% or as high as 20% if the vehicle has a 9" rear and an auto trans.

[blykins]

Originally Posted by peterpjb

700hp... 850hp... lots of power, guys

Nah, this is a lot of power....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Epb3F5txePk

[Alfa02]

@ olddog, I speak of org. Cobras racing in vintage races only. But if you think they drive them as if their worth million's of dollar's you are all wrong, I've ran with these guy's on the track, None of us that know how, or have the gene to be a "shoe" (Driver), let any grass grow under the tires, we use your cars as they were meant to be driven. I've raced in vintage racing for 16years, and never dented mine or anyone else's fender. You can be careful, and still drive 9.8 to 9.9 We of course talk with each other, to say who we feel safe racing with, like anything else there is always the 1% that we don't trust out there, but we just give them a wide berth. Cheers TommyRot.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Alfa02

@ olddog, I speak of org. Cobras racing in vintage races only. But if you think they drive them as if their worth million's of dollar's you are all wrong, I've ran with these guy's on the track, None of us that know how, or have the gene to be a "shoe" (Driver), let any grass grow under the tires, we use your cars as they were meant to be driven. I've raced in vintage racing for 16years, and never dented mine or anyone else's fender. You can be careful, and still drive 9.8 to 9.9 We of course talk with each other, to say who we feel safe racing with, like anything else there is always the 1% that we don't trust out there, but we just give them a wide berth. Cheers TommyRot.

Take a look at the history of all of the Cobras at the Shelby American Collection. Most of them have a race history and were vintage raced, most by Bill Murray. These are cars owned by Larry Miller and Steve Volk.

[Ace23]

Originally Posted by blykins

Ace, I have some 700 hp pump gas Windsors….

I forgot my man Brent who has built quite a nice portfolio of engines. Brent specified the cam for my rebuild amongst other assistance and it absolutely delivered...rowdy sounding at about 1100rpm idle.

Brent, hope all is well. When I last spoke to Jim before he passed he was hot and heavy on a new Brodix Head Hunter 15 or 20 degree setup he was working on. He was wanting to do a 445w with a hydraulic roller and a super victor.

[Alfa02]

Indeed Tony, In fact Steve owns the Cobra that Ken took me for a ride in Oh'these many years ago (I was 8yo) in 1963. I believe Tom's (Benjamin) 289 FIA is still in the collection, he and Wade Carter (906 Carrera) used me as moving chicane, by passing me on either side 30mph faster then me That's getting up close & personal, with these cars The site, feel, smell, sound of those two at speed (14cyl's.@ full chat), as they went by still gives me "Goose-bumps". Cheers Tom.

[blykins]

Originally Posted by Ace23

I forgot my man Brent who has built quite a nice portfolio of engines. Brent specified the cam for my rebuild amongst other assistance and it absolutely delivered...rowdy sounding at about 1100rpm idle.

Brent, hope all is well. When I last spoke to Jim before he passed he was hot and heavy on a new Brodix Head Hunter 15 or 20 degree setup he was working on. He was wanting to do a 445w with a hydraulic roller and a super victor.

I could do a pump gas, hydraulic roller SBF that would make 700.

[joyridin']

Originally Posted by Ace23

That is awesome and I am jealous of that power and fuel mileage. I haven’t been on the site in awhile but if I recall you were running a turbo setup. I’ve never been in a turbo cobra. I’m more of a NA or twin screw supercharger guy. I would love the option for a blower on my windsor. I had a 600hp turbo charged Hayabusa that made 320hp on pump gas...what a riot.

No, it is supercharged. If it was turbo, it would be in the 4 digit horsepower range with ease. I like the sidepipes and it would have been a nightmare to run all the plumbing.

If E85 were easy to find around here, you could probably add another 75-100 hp with that, but it is non-existent. So pump gas it is.

[Ace23]

Originally Posted by joyridin'

No, it is supercharged. If it was turbo, it would be in the 4 digit horsepower range with ease. I like the sidepipes and it would have been a nightmare to run all the plumbing.

If E85 were easy to find around here, you could probably add another 75-100 hp with that, but it is non-existent. So pump gas it is.

Are you running a centrifugal setup
Or something like an LS3 with a whipple on it?

Strangely enough we don’t have E-85 in Memphis. If we did I would be running 13.1 compression N/A with an e85 carb or something.

[twobjshelbys]

Originally Posted by Alfa02

Indeed Tony, In fact Steve owns the Cobra that Ken took me for a ride in Oh'these many years ago (I was 8yo) in 1963. I believe Tom's (Benjamin) 289 FIA is still in the collection, he and Wade Carter (906 Carrera) used me as moving chicane, by passing me on either side 30mph faster then me That's getting up close & personal, with these cars The site, feel, smell, sound of those two at speed (14cyl's.@ full chat), as they went by still gives me "Goose-bumps". Cheers Tom.

It's the best kept Shelby Cobra and GT40 secret in the world. There are currently more original LeMans winning GT40s in that little building in Boulder than anywhere else on the planet.

Plus the car that started it all - CSX2000 now lives in Boulder when it is not on tour.

My favorite is Otto's original 260.

[maui]

Originally Posted by Ace23

Just a personal opinion based off no facts. I would think the LS platform would be more reliable than an equally powered FE build based on the thousands of them running around. I also would expect the availability of the OEM electronics and fuel injections setup to be far superior of anything available for an FE. I have zero issues with a higher powered FE but I assume you really pay to play at that level.

If it’s a higher HP build I was driving all the time I want something I can easily get parts for and people know how to build. I have a dart block windsor but I will be making a change at some time as I want a bit more power...I’m running around 575hp/575tq with a t56 and 4.30 gear. I haven’t come across many 700hp+ pump gas Windsors that are not running rollers or higher compression. I spoke with Jim Kuntz before he passed and he convinced me he had a recipe. I now see that Bennet Racing located in AL offers a 445w windsor that looks like a nice offering.

I may have missed the original post but the value of one of these cars doesn’t mean much to me. I view them all as kits or replicas. I just want it to be fun to drive. So whatever floats your boat is good with me.

not your LS comparison but

among the challenges for the FE engine v a big block chevy is bore spacing (4.630" v 4.840") Simply put, the extra real-estate from having the bore further apart allows for bigger components/features the the cylinder head, runners, valves, etc.

The 385 blocks have similar bore spacing to the Big Chevys (a little more actually, 4.900"). The FE is kinda the small big block of the group.

Chevys have a .210" advantage, and 385's have .270" over the FE. Thats not something you fix with porting and cam selection.

[TomP]

I call a Chevy engined Cobra an AC Delco so an electric one would be an AC DC

[olddog]

Originally Posted by Alfa02

@ olddog, I speak of org. Cobras racing in vintage races only. But if you think they drive them as if their worth million's of dollar's you are all wrong, I've ran with these guy's on the track, None of us that know how, or have the gene to be a "shoe" (Driver), let any grass grow under the tires, we use your cars as they were meant to be driven. I've raced in vintage racing for 16years, and never dented mine or anyone else's fender. You can be careful, and still drive 9.8 to 9.9 We of course talk with each other, to say who we feel safe racing with, like anything else there is always the 1% that we don't trust out there, but we just give them a wide berth. Cheers TommyRot.

I have seen a vintage race on TV. Yes they ran them hard. No delusions there. My hat is off to them and you.

A wise man said "a man has got to know his limitations." I have no delusions there either. I'm not capable of handling a Cobra on a track in full out competition. When I was younger I had pretty good reaction time and natural abilities. With the proper training and practice, I might have been able to do it, but even that is a question.

I had a 1968 Dodge Charger, that was highly modified. It would top out at about 175 MPH. It had a lot longer wheel base though. It was my favorite of all the cars I owned until I got my Cobra. My Cobra handles like a dream to any car I ever owned, but I do not push it to the limits. I have pushed it a bit on autocross tracks. I definitely know it is capable of much more than I can handle.