Insurance information straight from the source!

[CSX 4039]

If you want to file a charter, go to www.thinkvermont.com. I have been considering doing the same thing for a long time now, but didn't quite have the premium dollars personally to justify the $100,000 start up cost, or save much $$ with the $30,000 yearly maintainence fees, but if you want another start up partner, call me. I almost have enough to justify one on my own, but not quite.

http://www.sugar-addiction.com/
http://www.freedomyou.com/addiction/...0addiction.htm
http://www.sugaraddict.com/
etc.,etc.,etc.......

Evan, I was not referring to the addiction though, rather that the fact that smokes were marketed as 'healthy'- "help you relax", etc. and burgers are marketed without mentioning the health effects, i.e.- "McLean", "garden fresh" salads. If you think thousands dying from cigarettes was/is bad, wait to you see this current crop of morbidly obese 30 year olds hit 60.

Quote from yours truly- "Morbid obesity will do to medical costs what confiscating all the tooth brushes would do to dental costs".

Now, back to charters--I'm a player, if you're interested.

[Turk]

klayfish

Turk, I realize that this is a hotbed issue, and it could be argued for all eternity. And that's why I put that huge disclamer in bold at the start of this. Let's try, for once, to leave our personal issues behind. As Cobra owners, we all face the same situation. I want to help if I can. You know I meant no harm about Gasholes and Club Cranky. Hell, I'm a proud member of Club Cranky, and they scare me, so I certainly don't want the Gasholes after me! I actually can't wait until DVSFIII to meet everyone. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I respect that. But I really want to try to stay focused here. Getting sidetracked will only ruin what we are trying to do.

What did I say?
What personal issues?


TURK

[petek]

DV,

How do we limit the scope of the project? Should frame (materials, design) be included? Copper tubing for brake lines? How about the age of the equipment (for donor cars).

Does anyone know if state regulations are available on-line? State regs might be a good starting point.

[Excaliber]

The inspector in Hawaii wanted:

Outside DOOR HANDLES!
Heat shielding on the side pipes!
Among other things.......(they don't like Cobras here).

Ernie

[Double Venom]

Petek,
You are on the right track, but we do NOT want to become a governing agency by any means. I wouldn't dream of telling one of our manufacturers that his frame is built wrong, that the steel he uses is inadequate, his door hinges need fixed, etc.

You might laugh at "copper brakes lines", but I have seen it in my own shop! That has just now been added to our list. This is what we want to do, simply make the Cobra of your choice safer.


Please comment on the suggestions fellas. It is so important to all of us!

Proper gas caps

Door latches that will not simply pop open by bumping them or having your car twist on an autocross course

Columns that will collapse - BOTH ways.

Neutral safety switch - Clutch, trans., dash I.e, momentary switch

Fuel cut-off switch

Proper mounted seats

Proper mounted seatbelts

All brake lines will be solid steel core - flex steel lines will only be used for caliber connections only and will be kept as short as possible.

For example: We just unearthed this last year in our shop: ALL Calibers WILL be connected by a DOT approved flex line AND NOT HARD PLUMBED! Yes, believe it or not, we had a car in our shop with less than 30 miles on it, brand new and the builder had plumbed the rear calibers directly to the "hard lines"! The lines were already starting to show fatigue!

WE NEED THIS, we really really do!

Please add your ideas, approve ours, slam dunk ours. My flame suit is old and well used.

DV...yup, we really do need this!

[klayfish]

Turk,
You said nothing or did nothing. In a total moment of absent mindedness, I wrote your name instead of Jamo. I don't know how, don't know why. Sometimes my mind just goes up in smoke




Everyone, I don't want to flood the forum with threads, but I think I'll start another one so we can move forward with this. We're going to move forward and get this done. DV, just saw your post here. Do you want to move this to a new thread and new poll?

Steve

[mr bruce]

yes by all means start a new thread. Also ,start a bi*tch at lawyers thread, and a gripe about insurance companys thread and a.........

[Roscoe]

I have a question:

I would think that most, if not all, of the accidents occurring with Cobras are 'human error' or incompetence. Many Cobra builders really do not know the capabilities of the car they built. First month or two out they wrap it up into a ball. Others, after years of driving do the same because of over confidence. I doubt it if accidents occurred because the car fell apart due to a bad build.

SO, what is the purpose of the safety inspections? Why not require driving school instead? It seems by the safety inspection we are only protecting the driver, not his ability to wrap it up into a ball.

Just my observations,
Roscoe

[RACER X #99]

Roscoe,
Almost impossible to get guys to bring their Cobras to a driving school. For many reasons.

Don't want to risk damage.
Don't want to risk engine problems.
Don't want to risk being blown away by a 4 cyl powered real racecar.
Much safer to trailer to a car show. Set up signs and past show trophys. Open hood and display gleeming engine showing all parts listed on display sign.( these 500hp engines can last for years this way).

Much safer driving 50 MPH on two lane country road while passing cars in opposite direction and knowing that the driver of the other car would never cross over the 6 feet between them.

I could go on but what do I know? I'm just a cranky old fart.

Cranky

[klayfish]

Roscoe,
You're right. Most claims, perhaps almost all, are due to driver error, not mechanical failures. But remember, as far as insurance is concerned, we are dealing with the underwriters. They are not only concerned with driving record/experience, but to be sure the "kit" or whatever we call it is properly built. That is why we are creating the safety list. But nor will we ignore driver safety.

That said, our group will strongly encourage drivers to be responsible on the street, and to participate in driving schools or other legal high performance experience. This will definitely help, not only by teaching them how not to wrap their car up in a ball, as you point out, but by showing the underwriters that we know how to handle these cars. When they look at writing a new policy, they want to know if we know how to handle these cars and have experience with this. They specifically told me this and I know they ask for it. That's part of the reason they ask if you are a member of any type club. Well, they don't recognize these internet websites, they want actual clubs. Hopefully, it will save lives too. There will be a place to list and document driving schools/etc..., but it is not mandatory, as we can't force anyone to do that. I strongly encourage it and we would like members to encourage each other to drive responsibly on the street. Eliminate the driver error caused accidents.

Steve

[hound dog]

Cranky,
You forgot to add that most schools won't give you an instructor to ride with you unless you have two roll bars or one that goes completely across the interior (ref NASA HPDE). This eliminates almost all of the cobras on the road today. Not a bad rule, mind you, but just hard for the cobras to comply. I'm actually thinking about buying an older mustang or camaro to get some time with a NASA instructor before I go tearassing around an event in my cobra. Just to be on the safe side
h dog

[IntimidatorI]

Hello, I would like to add my 2-cents worth from experience and a quick learn.
I have been around fast cars all of my life and also have been with AAA for over 12 years (going to them when I bought my first turbo Porsche and was dumped by the previous carrier) I have NEVER had an accident (at least not on the street) and have always maintained a clean record. In Nov. 2002 when I "added" my 1967 Ford Cobra Replica, AAA dumped THAT car from my policy like a hot potato.

I then frantically went to all the "specialty" carriers and was astonded at the rates when I told them the appraised value and that I wanted to "DRIVE" the car. This was unheard of. You see, I was being very forthwright because if anything happened while this car was "out" I did not want the underwriter coming back and slipping out of making me whole.

Well here is the bottom line. Two weeks ago I got my car covered with full coverage and a stated value by State Farm under their "Classics and Collectables" catagory. No strings attached! That is with 5000 miles a year open driving and if I drive more they just raise the rate a little. NOW HERE IS THE INCREDIBLE PART. MY PREMIUM IS ONLY $122 FOR SIX MONTHS - THAT IS $244 A YEAR!! I asked the agent what the "downside" was and he looked me in the eye and said, "there is no downside, I can't believe it either but this catagory has never had a rate increase. It is a great bargin!"

I just wanted to pass along my experience and let you all know that insurance seemed to be the biggest obsticle for me until I called State Farm Insurance. If you are having a problem, maybe you should check them out. I have already sent a friend of mine to them and his Cobra is valued at almost double what mine is.

Please let me know if you have any questions. I will even fax you a copy of my binder (which I just got in the mail) IT IS FOR REAL!

Regards,
rick
kinziepuppy@yahoo.com

[IntimidatorI]

Hello, I would like to add my 2-cents worth from experience and a quick learn.
I have been around fast cars all of my life and also have been with AAA for over 12 years (going to them when I bought my first turbo Porsche and was dumped by the previous carrier) I have NEVER had an accident (at least not on the street) and have always maintained a clean record. In Nov. 2002 when I "added" my 1967 Ford Cobra Replica, AAA dumped THAT car from my policy like a hot potato.

I then frantically went to all the "specialty" carriers and was astonded at the rates when I told them the appraised value and that I wanted to "DRIVE" the car. This was unheard of. You see, I was being very forthwright because if anything happened while this car was "out" I did not want the underwriter coming back and slipping out of making me whole.

Well here is the bottom line. Two weeks ago I got my car covered with full coverage and a stated value by State Farm under their "Classics and Collectables" catagory. No strings attached! That is with 5000 miles a year open driving and if I drive more they just raise the rate a little. NOW HERE IS THE INCREDIBLE PART. MY PREMIUM IS ONLY $122 FOR SIX MONTHS - THAT IS $244 A YEAR!! I asked the agent what the "downside" was and he looked me in the eye and said, "there is no downside, I can't believe it either but this catagory has never had a rate increase. It is a great bargin!"

I just wanted to pass along my experience and let you all know that insurance seemed to be the biggest obsticle for me until I called State Farm Insurance. If you are having a problem, maybe you should check them out. I have already sent a friend of mine to them and his Cobra is valued at almost double what mine is.

Please let me know if you have any questions. I will even fax you a copy of my binder (which I just got in the mail) IT IS FOR REAL!

Regards,
rick
kinziepuppy@yahoo.com

[hound dog]

Two in a row, sorry, trying to get the post count up I suppose. Anyway, I got my cobra insured with Nationwide for a declared value and collision and liability are less than $500/yr. In fact Nationwide is even helping me get the indemnity bond required by the state of NC for the engine. Surprised me!
h dog

[IntimidatorI]

Sorry about the "two in a row" Just getting the hang of this "thread" thang! rick

[Cal Metal]

To All:

I can add to what Eric stated about State Farm. I think he will agree, too, that you had better have a squeaky clean record, including no moving violations, or no dice on the coverage.

[Ken Greene]

ok the Insurance companies don't recognise internet groups as clubs. Seeing that we come together at teh FLING and do great things there isn't that a "CLUB" gathering. sure its only once a year but its still a gathering in person. sounds like a club to me even if we don't charge dues.

[klayfish]

OK, let me rephrase. I wasn't at all making a knock on our website or group. The Fling is a huge event and counts as a gathering. But I think the insurance companies look for more "established" or "organized" groups with specific agendas, such as the NSRA or NCRS.

Steve

[REAL 1]

Cranky: You hit every reason underlying the decision not to take my car to the track. Thanks for reminding me.

I would like to point out ,however, that there are many guys who don't have time to get involved in track events as much as they would like too. It is a very time consuming hobby. When you have kids it is even more difficult. That includes me. Also most cars aren't covered for damage and liability at track events unless they are driving schools. Alot of guys don't want to risk the damage out of the shear emotional trauma of seeing their "baby" damaged and others simply can't afford to risk it.

We all have our outlets. For me, instead of the racing on the track I buckle my chin strap and stick to hockey. My fx rib, fx metatarsals in both feet on two separate occassions (hit with slap shots) and two concussions over the years playing hockey have all been covered under my health insurance and I'm happy to report that it has caused zero (0) damage to my pride and joy, 4206! Better me than 4206!

[CSX 4039]

Originally posted by REAL 1

I buckle my chin strap and stick to hockey. My fx rib, fx metatarsals in both feet on two separate occassions (hit with slap shots) and two concussions over the years playing hockey have all been covered under my health insurance and I'm happy to report that it has caused zero (0) damage to my pride and joy, 4206! Better me than 4206! [/b]

Could we conclude that those of us who take care of our bodies should be, when we get our health insurance premiums, as indignant as we have all gotten when hot rodders cause us to have unaffordable/unobtainable car insurance?