Substituting Shelby block for Iron SO - Page 4

SFfiredog · #61 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turk

SFfiredog
Stop this madness. Stick to something you know something about. Engines!

TURK [/b]

I thought I was talking about engines... Oh, I get it!
I can still build you a Shelby aluminum block and then we can fill your footboxes with melted down lead fishing weights, or I have an old railroad tie at work, we can bailing wire it to your front quick-jacks, or hell if you really want weight I have a '75 Mark V Lincoln Continental that we can sawz-all the roof off of and bend up a roll bar out of muffler tubing...
A World War II era P-51 Mustang flew over my house yesterday afternoon. The aluminum block in that beautiful bird didn't drop any coolant or engine parts on my head as it passed over, so 60 years later I'd guess it's still working fine...
42 gallons of fuel? Your last engine got a little better than 14 mpg.
Even if your new engine gets 10 mpg... Hell I love Cobras but I don't want to sit my ass in one for 420 miles at a time

The 42 gallon fuel tank is as much of a full racing item as open headers or removing the windshield and adding the small fairing. Actually worse because it can drastically reduce the handling of the car from full to empty making the car dangerous.
The race Cobras of the sixties did it out of nessessity. Stops for fuel wasted more precious seconds than the ill handling effects of, what in effect is carrying around an assembled 289 short block in the back of your car. Why does a street Cobra need a 42 gallon fuel tank? That's more fuel than BOTH tanks held in my last full size pick up truck!
Now that I bad mouthed your car, when can I come and see it, you lucky bastard

--Mike

Excaliber · #62 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 11:36 AM

Well,,,,,,,,I could see myself with a 42 gallon tank. OK, at least a dang 20 gallon. I could only go about 120 miles before stopping with the Excal and that was with a 302!

Ernie

Jamo · #63 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 11:43 AM

GayBayFirePooch

Imagine my concern--arruminum block up front, 300lbs in the driver's seat and 42 gal. tank out back. Call me Mr. Wheelie!

PatBuckley · #64 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 12:45 PM

Jamo -

Being that you are going from a 5 gallon tank in your Butler to a 42 gallon tank - what are you going to use as an excuse to stop now?

Jamo · #65 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 12:48 PM

Pistachios the night before.

SFfiredog · #66 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jamo

GayBayFirePooch

Imagine my concern--arruminum block up front, 300lbs in the driver's seat and 42 gal. tank out back. Call me Mr. Wheelie!

It's OK Hammo,

I have an extra railroad tie for the front of your car, but I am running low on lead. Can I interest you in that Lincoln?

And another thing. Just because I like men and live in SF...

No... wait... Just because I live in SF doesn't mean I like men

....not always anyway....

--Mike

Turk · #67 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 01:24 PM

Jamo,
I wish I was lucky like you and weighed 300-400 lbs.
I would not be looking for weight up front. Man, some people got everything.

I have to settle for picking up passengers to keep the damn thing down!

TURK
Unfortunately,the ones I keep my eyes open for, don't weigh much more than pistachios!!

Turk · #68 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 01:30 PM

Mike,

Last I checked they will let me put 20 gallons of fuel in my 42 gallon tank.
I am not sure it is possible to do the reverse.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO FILL THE DAMN THING!!

Come on down, anytime. I am all alone and my wife is out of town!

Wait... You are from the city, right? Why don't you come by next week. My wife whom I have been happily married to for 35 years in a heterosexual relationship will be home by then. I love her so!!

TURK

southernfriedcj · #69 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jamo

GayBayFirePooch

Sooooooo close Jamo, it shoulda been GayBayPyroPooch. BLNT!

REAL 1 · #70 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 08:59 PM

SFfiredog: Ok. I understand. Thanks for the explanation.

PatBuckley: Who said my car was original? Wasn't me. REAL yes. Original no.

Southernfriedcj: I also didn't say the Aluminum engine wasn't a "correct" engine for the CSX. It clearly is. I think the alumium block is a really nice peice.

Its a choice between newer technology or staying with original equipment. Each has their pluses and minuses IMHO. I wanted to stay with original equipment wherever I could because I wanted my Cobra to be "as it was". And it is.

As far as strength and durability maybe the arruminum block is stronger. But I'll say it again. An engine that was chosen by Shelby for FIA competition and which powered the Cobra 427 to 5 SCCA A production titles is good enough for me and can offer more performance and power than 99% of us here can handle or use given a good servicable block, good parts and a good build.

I also know that I don't have to grind any stamping off my block and paint it to desguise it as a REAL 427SO because it is a 427SO. No explanations needed.

Jamo · #71 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 09:07 PM

Who's grinding and painting--Mike simply said one could if they wanted to...

Evan, Dick Smith agrees with you. Our mutual engine builder tried to talk into going arruminum when he saw my block since Dick is having a new engine being built. Dick's comment was that he knew how to drive the "damn thing" with the iron block's weight and doesn't feel like learning all over again.

Course--that's in an original.

REAL 1 · #72 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 09:19 PM

Of course Dick Smith agrees with me. He knows I'm right!

I know Mike said if "you wanted to". I also know a Fruedian slip when I see one too!

SFfiredog · #73 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Turk

Mike,

Last I checked they will let me put 20 gallons of fuel in my 42 gallon tank.
I am not sure it is possible to do the reverse.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO FILL THE DAMN THING!!

Come on down, anytime. I am all alone and my wife is out of town!

Wait... You are from the city, right? Why don't you come by next week. My wife whom I have been happily married to for 35 years in a heterosexual relationship will be home by then. I love her so!!

TURK

Oh yeah, Well I can put a plastic tarp in the trunk of MY car and fill it up with gasoline

But all you can haul in your tiny trunk is Jamo's pistachios!
Oh well, I tried

You got me

--Mike

weekendwarrior · #74 (**permalink**) 02-22-2003, 10:06 PM

Thanks, yes the hydrofoil does put a silly little grin on your face, good for clearing the cobwebs out, the need for speed.

Your alum engine. Have you gotten far enough along with the FI project to determine it's weight compared to a alum intake and a single carb. I am a FI fan, original or not, precise fuel metering surely improves HP.

I assume it's electronic and not mechanical?

Don't tell me your a computer wizard as well?

Gary

P.S. Enjoyed your pictures on the alum oiling journals.

Randy Klein · #75 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 02:52 AM

Gentlemen,

Sorry I missed so much of this conversation. While at the Monterey Historics this past August, I took some engine pictures at the Shelby booth. The Aluminum BB with air-to-water intercooled supercharger(s) was selling for around $30K and produced lots of HP. Depending upon the setup, obtainable HP was between 800 and 1500...at the fly wheel no doubt!

I've also taken some pictures at the Shelby Factory in Southern Calif. There were pallets of Al BB's there ready for building. I'll look around for the pictures of them. I think the labels had "Buddy Bar castings" on them, but don't trust my memory, I sure don't.

Anyway, I've also driven a friends Al BB that is naturally aspirated. It put out near 600 smooth HP and made my heart skip! Here's the Shelby Engine block website address. Notice the reference to over 1500 HP!

http://www.carrollshelbyent.com/engi...inum_block.cfm

All the best,
Randy Klein

Sizzler · #76 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 01:43 PM

Weren't these rated at 640HP (but they cut off the dyno run early so as not to scare the NASCAR guys, the curve was still rising). The benchmark. If you can't beat 640HP with your all custom $30,000 engine, then what exactly was the point?

Gotta have comparisons.

Cost of engine in real world, $25,000 FOB Larksville, Pennsylvania (570) 779-7843:

For substitutes, this place provided me with an excellent 390 longblock: Thunderbird Ranch

It's all about what YOU want, build, buy, drive what makes you happy. My opinion.

SFfiredog · #77 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 02:46 PM

Hi Sizzler,
The Cammer is the Holy Grail of FE religon. I have been lucky enough to build two if these beasts (both ended up in boats)
I would love to have one now. Very rare, very cool. They are very expensive and difficult to locate good ones as cammers are even more specialized to build than a 427 wedge.
The main liablility with the SOHC is, unless you have the extremely rare aluminum heads (almost all were cast iron) a complete cammer weighs in excess of 700lbs. In NASCAR, where this motor was originally developed for but was banned, weight wasn't a major concern. The top fuel dragsters weren't as worried either because the power they could generate would more than outweigh the additional heft. The cammer was just too big and too heavy to be considered in road racing, Can-Am or the GT-40 Le Mans programs. A cammer won't even fit without major modifiactions in most replica Cobras. In my case. I did some measuring, and to fit one in a Superformance would require relocation of the clutch, brake and gas pedal assemblies, foot boxes and the entire steering assembly. But if I had a cammer in my garqage...
--Mike

Turk · #78 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 04:57 PM

This is how rare they are.

Good luck trying to build one for $30,000 anymore. This auction ends in 3 hrs. It is already over $22,000. There are 27 folks wanting that engine.
The condition described leads to believe, with missing parts and new chain and complete going over and machining it all, to accept new pistons, rings etc . (barring any surprises)....
You are probably looking at north sideof $40,000 before it is all done.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=34202

TURK
Too rich for my blood.!

weekendwarrior · #79 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 06:49 PM

Please excuse my brain fart, found your specs on the efi tunnel port.

Gary

SFfiredog · #80 (**permalink**) 02-23-2003, 06:54 PM

Hi Gary,
Yes, my engine will be EFI. I wouldn't say I'm a computer expert but I got plenty of factory training during my time as a Ford dealership mechanic and I know which end of the wire to plug into the computer. I have set up aftermarket engine management systems on other engines. The injection set up will weigh more than a single carb set up by the time you add in all the sensors, wiring harness, return line fuel system, and processor but it should be minimal, maybe 5 to 10 pounds. I have most of the hard parts for my injection set up but I'm waiting to buy the management system untill I absolutley need it. Just like any computer system, there is constant changes and upgrades being made by the manufacturers. If I buy a system now, with my luck a few months down the road a better and less expensive system will be available. The 2 systems I'm considering now are made by Electromotive and F.A.S.T. I'm waiting for the wide band O2 option to be introduced by Electromotive. I'll post photos as the system comes together.
--Mike

Quote:

Originally posted by weekendwarrior

Thanks, yes the hydrofoil does put a silly little grin on your face, good for clearing the cobwebs out, the need for speed.

Your alum engine. Have you gotten far enough along with the FI project to determine it's weight compared to a alum intake and a single carb. I am a FI fan, original or not, precise fuel metering surely improves HP.

I assume it's electronic and not mechanical?

Don't tell me your a computer wizard as well?

Gary

P.S. Enjoyed your pictures on the alum oiling journals.