Team-c-racing

[studduck]

Does anyone know or can make a comment about the Venom 427 advertised on E-Bay and offered by Team-c-racing?

[cobra2000]

Have you seen the two Venoms that Team C Racing has on E Bay
and check out the Price.

[vbdig]

Team-C-racing? Good guys. I bought a silver venom from them on E-bay. Everything was as promised, and the car is flawless. I belive impossible to build a car from scratch with this quality for less money.

[Gatorac]

Ebay Auction

You may want to do some more searches on this company. Although I have had no personal dealings with them, I have hears about issues with the company itself.

Some of the Backdraft owners were claiming that the pictures of the Venum427 were actually a Backdraft car delivered by Reg Dodd to a client.

Heresay and rumor often has it's roots in the truth. It's certainly worth more investigation before you give up your hard earned money.

Good luck.

[vbdig]

Truth is, Backdraft and Venom started at the same factory. Exactly the same. Now I understand they have split, and there are some differences. (Performancecars.com) (Russ Sinclair). But I do have experience with team c racing and I would not hesitate to recomend them to anyone. Their product is great and their customers are important to them. I researced almost all models before buying my Venom, and remain very happy today.

[Venom 427]

Thanks Vince for pointing that out and for the good words about the product and Team-C Racing. They are great people to deal with.

In answer to Jim and the issues he has heard regards Performance Cars, I have quoted a reply below I made on the Cobra Forum when these rumours were raised there. I must add that heresay and rumours are just as often unfounded and malicious. This is the response :

"We at Performance Cars want to take the opportunity to set the record straight regarding the history, products and current status of our company. Firstly we would like to wish all the forum members and their families a happy and prosperous New Year. We look forward to meeting all of you at the various events and meetings through the year.

We will begin with the history behind Performance Cars. The company was started in 1997 by Archie Sinclair as a division of his Chrysler and General Motors group of companies to research and develop the conversion of American cars to Right Hand Drive. The vehicles converted and marketed included the Mustang 5.0 and 4.6, Corvette C4 and C5, Ford F150 and Dodge Ram. In 2000 John Scott, one of the developers and originators of the Birkin Super 7, joined Performance Cars. This replica of the Lotus Super 7 was successfully marketed around the world as a turn-key minus kit car. John Scott has 17 years of experience in charge of the design and development of the Birkin and various other kit car, and race car projects. Prior to that he has years of experience with Toyota and VW. In January 2001 a joint venture between Performance Cars, Tony Martin and Reg Dodd was started to develop and manufacture a LHD Cobra replica for the US market. We had the manufacturing facility and licenses to manufacture and export in South Africa, while Reg Dodd had the facility in Florida to prepare and retail the vehicles. Ross Sinclair went back to South Africa during the development phase to assist John Scott and Tony Martin and then moved to Florida to jointly manage the US side of the operation. After 6 months of development the first cars were shipped to the US on 15 June 2001. In February 2002 due to differences of opinion, it was decided to split the joint venture from the then Backdraft organization. At that stage it was decided to develop the retail side of Performance Cars in the US with a strong distributor that had a good presence in the replica Cobra and kit car industry. We took our product to Carlisle 2002 and secured a distribution deal with Team-C Racing and Shell Valley.

After a number of meetings at Carlisle, here in Florida, at Run & Gun and in Nebraska, all involved agreed the relationship, future plans and strategies were a good fit. Shell Valley has a solid, successful and long history in the manufacture and marketing of replica Cobras - www.shellvalley.com . While Team-C Racing has been building turn-key replicars for select clients and corporations for several years. Their staff has countless experience in the construction of street and racing machines. In addition, they also market four unique kit car offerings of their own - www.team-c-racing.com

The first 15 cars that Performance Cars built were done in partnership with Backdraft. We continued to build cars for Tony Martin after February 2002 through to 7 June 2002 when they started their assembly facility. Therefore there are early Backdraft cars that will be identical to our Venom 427.

The 16th car we built was our Carlisle show car and the 21st car was the first car completely produced from our own molds and chassis jigs. Thus the first 20 cars produced were purchased from a Factory 5 type operation in Johannesburg, South Africa and Performance Cars was operated as an assembly plant. We have now progressed to a full manufacturing plant, manufacturing our own bodies, chassis’ and with in house painting facilities. Performance Cars has now been joined by 3 of the top people from Birkin and have an unmatched team in the manufacture, design and development of replica Cobras. We are a registered vehicle manufacturer and exporter in South Africa and have a 17 digit VIN that is internationally registered on the WMI (World Manufacturer Identifier).

More recently as each company has developed and improved their own product independently, you will notice differences in all areas. This is even more evident with Backdraft changing their body and each company now focusing on different markets. Our aim with the development of the Venom 427 is to retain the originality of the vehicle, only making compromises for the comfort and safety of the driver. We are focusing on refining and making improvements to all detail and function areas. These refinements and improvements continue to increase the level of fit, finish and integrity of the car. Everyone agrees that in terms of an investment, a replica cobra that is closer to original will hold a stronger resale value than one that appears modified.

Here is a list of improvements we have done to the cars:
· Better paint job carried out by an in-house painter.
· Improved rigidity of chassis.
· Un-welded stainless steel quick-jacks.
· Modified front strut towers for more height adjustment.
· Improved wire harness with easily accessible fuse box.
· Door hinges laser cut - stronger, more accurate and much neater.
· Door hinges redesigned to allow for more opening.
· Trunk and hood brackets redesigned to allow for more edge clearance when opening.
· TIG welded Stainless Steel gas tank.
· Brake and fuel lines rerouted for neatness. Fastener spacing set to meet certain State titling requirements.
· New brake booster and master cylinder for more efficiency and better availability.
· Cross brace on bulkhead, which will improve steering column, windscreen and dashboard fitment as well as strengthen the doorposts.
· Doorposts have been redesigned to allow for far more adjustment.
· New positioning of front stabilizer bar brackets.
· New rear floor in the trunk, which has a better shape and also allows for the rear shock tower.
· New improved Stainless Steel radiator header tank.
· Rollover bar re-shaped for authenticity and repositioned to allow for easier fitting.
· Trunk catch redesigned with laser cut brackets.
· Brake and clutch pedals set with better spacing.
· Exhaust headers made from Stainless Steel and redesigned for better clearance as well as aesthetics. Slip joints used as opposed to a flange.
· Side pipe quality improved and personalized shield added.
· Lockable fuel cap.
· Standard tonneau cover.
· Optional wider drivers seat.
· Cockpit designed to accommodate a 6'3" driver.

John Scott and his team will continue to bring our customers more improvements throughout the year that will set our car apart from the competition and make the Venom 427 unique. We will keep the Forum posted.

To answer some of the questions raised about our company and the Venom 427:

The Venom 427 is also BMW suspension based. This is an evolution of the car developed by John Eckhout and Kit Car Center of South Africa, and marketed in the US under the name John Speed. All of the South African bodies are believed to be an evolution of the Dax from Europe. We did not purchase the old body style from Backdraft, but have our own body and tub molds that are unique from the Backdraft product.

With respect to the photos of the various cars used in our brochures and on our website, we have only used photos of cars that have been produced in our factory. The pictures used were those supplied by Reg Dodd to Performance Cars while we still had an association. If an owner of a car that appears in our advertising is unhappy with us using his car for that purpose, he need only contact us to request it being removed.

Thank you,

Ross Sinclair
Performance Cars USA
www.performcars.com

[khall]

Ross,
What is the numerical ratio of the BMW rear IRS? How much torque can it handle?

[Venom 427]

Keith,

Oddly enough that was also the very first question that was asked on the cobra forum after my reply was posted there. So if I can quote my reply there again :

"The rear end we use is from the E36 3 series BMW through years 1992 to 1999. We do not modify any of the BMW rear end components including the control arms. The ratio we use mostly in the rear is a 3.15. The following ratios are an option depending on availability:
3.46:1 ~ 4.44:1 ~ 3.45:1 ~ 3.91:1 ~ 2.93:1 & 3.64:1

With respect to the horsepower and torque rating on the differential, after much research no definitive limits were discovered. What we can draw on is the experience of others with the differentials. A BMW suspension based Cobra runs on the 1/4 mile in Johannesburg SA with a 350 Chev engine, a 150 shot of Nitrous and on slicks. He states he has 500bhp, 600 ft/lbs of torque, does a 10.5 sec 1/4 mile and has never broken the BMW differential but has broken 2 T-5 transmissions. The question of how much torque the BMW rear end can take is very technical.
When will it break (not necessarily how much torque) depends on many factors including, tire diameter, tire width, diff ratio, coefficient of friction (traction), weight transfer to mention a few. Of course it would be interesting to know what is the weakest link as well - the c.v. joints, gear set or side shafts!

Having said that, the set up of the Venom 427 will handle the majority of applications required by customers. Our car is focused on the majority market satisfying drivability and a low entry price point, as opposed to the small fringe market of high torque applications such as drag racers. Over time we will develop a database of applications and the performance of the BMW rear end, and keep the Forum posted. I think the knowledge about Ford 9 inch rear ends and their limits was gathered in a similar way, through years of use in racing and street performance applications and the size of the US market for these products.

The article below is from a transmission website and does confirm a few factors involved
in drive-train design. I hope it helps.


Taken from http://www.gearzone.net (without permission)
When the concept of putting a 5 speed in an E-TYPE Jaguar was put in front of me I thought of many base platforms. I picked the T5 base simply because it could handle the power and torque of 6 and 12 cylinder Jaguar engines and yield a good life factor. It also was one of the finest shifting transmissions ever built. Many people advertise gearboxes that can handle 600 horsepower and 500 FT lbs of torque. The T5 is rated at 330 FT LBS and the Tremec is now rated at over 400 FT LBS. What does this mean? Even Tremec's test on the T5 and 3550 are not done under the same time / load frame. Gear boxes are rated on what the manufacturer's idea of how much torque a transmission should hold over a specific period of time. If no two tests are done exactly the same it makes it difficult to really say what a rating means when comparing gearboxes. You can apply more torque to the transmission above it's suggested rating but the life factor of the gearbox will decrease. Generally torque ratings are based on what torque the transmission may see in its life time. Most manufacturers will also fiqure on 150,000 miles as a life time. Holeshots or clutch dumps decrease that life factor. It is not uncommon to see a 400 plus horsepower Mustang GT run a T5 at the drags but break it weeks later. The box was never designed for this nor should it be put in that class. Put the same box in a 450 hp road car with little shock loads and to your surprise the T5 doesn't break. If your engine produces 400 FT LBS of torque at 3000 RPM that torque load is split between the transmission and rear. If you have a 1 to 1 rear axle ratio, most of it is absorbed in the gearbox. If you have a 4.56 rear axle ratio the torque load shifts more towards the rear axle. That is why most gearboxes break in cars with "dead rear end gears" such as 2.76 or 3.08 ratios. (Stock Mustang GT'S) I did not see a need to compromise quality shifting for a highly rated torque load that would never be exceeded in almost all of the conversion applications.

Regards,

Ross Sinclair
Performance Cars USA
www.performcars.com"

[Bumpster]

My question to Ross Sinclair would be that after reading the list of improvements made since the cars were first introduced, I have only one thought. Why did a Cobra designed by so many people with so much experience and with so many other Cobra replicas out there to look at, have to make so darn many changes in such a short time? Suspension, wiring, door hinges, floorboards, I mean come on! How did you sell the first ones if they needed so many changes? You're building a whole different car than you started out with.

Bumpster