Urethane engine/tranmission mounts?

[Ant]

I am considering solid mounting the engine, but one thing puts me off and thats will a stroked windsor like chassis stresses going into it, and its harmonics going to metal - could be a problem. I dont have a problem with driveability as I have had solid mounted road cars before, but didn't have them long enough to see what if any bad effects might be.

Urethane mounts for Ford engines, this sounds good, but I reckon that will stiffen only slightly, as urethan ain't that hard!
Would like to know where good mounts can be obtained?

The other idea which would probably do more good 'would be to fit a urethane bushed rod or arm from the block , or better still higher up from the cylinder head out to the chassis, to reduce engine rock, as I am fitting pipes under the body and oval pipes through parts of the chassis (2.5" clearance but wide!) this idea does becomes a problem as the chassis is low and the rod would be on a 45 degree angle and not at right angles for maximum effect - compromise?

Any ideas and as usual I have my brain in gymnastic mode!

Ant

[Fred Douglass]

Several things:

1) Sorry about the 'Cup AND I MEAN THAT! Where the Hell are the Swiss gonna defend it? I prefer Kiwis to most humans---check the make of my car (Ron Butler's engineering went into it).


2) You are right about solid mounting---it does eliminate flex-stresses on exhaust systems, even wiring! BUT (as you also point out) it brings in problems of harmonics, high potential for fatigue---even from micro-vibrations (which the occupants
don't fee)l---so-o-o-o:

3) what I noticed a lot of race cars during in the 60"s and 70's (back when the public could view the cars up close in paddock areas and up on lifts) was---ALUMINUM! Repeat aluminum! Don't ask me how that works---it's just a tiny bIt softer. They used it on ALL flex-joints: suspension AND motor-mounts. It DOES eliminate any lean when it's used to replace suspension bushings---but I will leave it to more knowledgeable people---like Ron Butler about really using it everywhere. If you can borrow the boss's phone at work, call Ron at Butler Racing in VenturaCalifornia...(805) 649-6000. That call COULD actually be less expensive than your car!

G'luck.

[Hotfingrs]

I like the urethane mounts myself. With the torque monster engines I've had, a regular set of mounts will last a couple of months, before they are torn in two. I've used the urethane mounts for the last 3 or 4 years and have never had one go bad yet....knock on wood....

[Ant]

Fred:
The cup! yep we thought we had done the design and trials properly, or I think had a false sense of confidence, the workshop I use the guys son is an engineer for Team NZ, and I know there work load was tremendous in his dept. but oh well heres hoping NZ will look at the big picture and give it another go!

Aluminium is better than steel and would give a little bit softening over that!
will look at Ron Butlers website if he has one, or call them!

I see on the Net some outfits make a mount up with a simple small urethane bush integrated, I would emagine this would do a lot, but they appear expensive at $US199, I might contemplate making some, but by the time I get the right materials its sometimes better to buy, what I think most V8 Aussie Falcons, maybe Mustangs etc use!

Hotfingrs:

Thanks and urethane has done the job for you and lasting!

Ant

[Fred Douglass]

I can tell you that never has the Auld Mug been held more dashingly by fewer people! (Okay, I'm no Churchill!)

Ron Butler has no website, and I can't seem to find his e-mail address. However, next time I call him, I'll ask about motor mounts. He errs on the side of caution---he was Ken Miles personal mechanic but also race-car development engineer (we shared a lasugh ovcer that--he essentially took split butt-welds, etc. and built in triagular gussets (?) maybe better called "braces". He eventually made the frames stonger and stronger, bit by bit. He ended up being called "boiler-plate" for structural overkill.
If I get any news or recommendations from him, I'll e-mail 'em to you. One problem with ANY flexible engine mount material is that SOMETHING has to pay the piper. If you're lucky its exhaust mounts, etc. if not so lucky, fuel and oil lines etc. I have preferred hard-mount but only had one car with such a rig---of all things an old AH Sprite, the roll-cage assembly of which was heavier than the original car! The original owner had removed all the e-mount rubber bushings. He had aluminum "biscuits" in shock-mount areas and in the anti-rool bars (added on, I believe). With a decent race seat (the other was almost a burlap bag!), the bumps weren't too bad. Body roll=zero, steering was quicker, and vibrations more evident. Not a car for long road trips.

G'luck again!

[Ant]

Thanks for that Fred:

Information would be much appreciated - Ant