Shelby buys CAV GT40 for 80th Birthday !!

[Super-Snake]

I wear multiple hats. I am an enthusiast first. I volunteer my time at my fathers shop which has included everything from ERA's, contemporary, everett morison, FFR, CSX, and currently SPF. I organize the long Island club with Jam1775. I work fulltime in the cosmetic industry. I club race every chance I get.

[JWheaton]

Turk,

You can get two hands in the bush?!?

[REAL 1]

I dont know when the ad was copyrighted but it was run in 7/02 on the back cover of Kit Car.

While the ad does "pepper" the word replica in it at various points it also refers to their cars as "Superformance Cobras" and then clearly states "We don't sell kits. We sell Cobras".

Maybe they feel that if they sprinkle the words "replica" or "replicar" in the ad in various places thats sufficeint to protect them from their blatent referral to the fact they "sell Cobras" when they don't.

In my opinion they have no right to refer or intimate anywhere that they sell Cobras. But, hey thats just my opinion based on the fact they clearly note at the bottom that "Cobra" is a registered trademark.

Seems kind of like an "in your face" action by SPF. Sometimes I understand why CS is so bitter and pissed off.

You can choose to identify whatever part of the ad you feel is the most important to you. I'm just pointing to parts of the clear text.

[captain]

Boy , oh boy, I go away for a few days and look what happens.
As usual, things are taken out of context and stretched around the world.
We were talking about CAV and SAI. Those who bought a csx4000 in good faith for approx. $95,000 hoping to enjoy a piece of history and maybe appreciate or hold the value, now are up against SAI considering a cheaper price to compete with SPF. If that is the intent of the CAV affiliation, useing CSX4000 numbers, what do you think will be the effect on the value of older cars? That doesn't mean you were a pigeon when you bought. It means SAI has MADE a pidgeon of you. Remember, you said they may make it better at CAV for a lower price. Let's see what happens.

[REAL 1]

Captain: I understand the premise of your statements. However the $95,000 figure for a glass CSX included a full boat aluminum block 427SO or original 427SO with all the bells and whistles.

I believe the cost of a glass CSX roller now is around $55K and $60K with paint. Although subcontracting CAV to build the chasis to spec and up to Shelby standards, which I'm sure CAV is capable of since they make a very nice GT40 which is sold through some Shelby dealers now might drop the price point to around $50K for a roller (I'm guessing non-painted) it won't affect the resale value of the original CSX 4000 (wow! an appropriate use of the word "original when referring to a CSX 4000. See its happening already! ) that much. This may be especially true with cars with special add ons or details.

But may I suggest this. If SAI is successful in droping its roller price by $5000, might SPF and others be forced to drop their prices alittle to keep their products attractive as an alternative? If so what happens to the resale value of all those original SPFs???

Boy this could end up creating a BIG pigeon sandwich right across the board for all current glass car owners, regardless of make, and everyone may end up having to take a bite.

Boy, just think. If that happens the bird droppings are really gonna start piling up around here!

Al u min i um cars are a different kettle of fish and may even become more desirable and valuable.

Just think'n out loud.

[CSX 4027]

Most of the early glass 4000 owners are in their cars for far less than one would imagine as prices have gone up and labor to assemble them has gone up.
If people really knew how much 4027 really cost, I think a few would fall out of bed. Some of the basics...The roller at the time was $38,900. That was no wheels or tires. Trigo's were $1900 and tires were $1000. That was FOB LV. Freight was $1000 to NY.
That's $41,800. I got a $2000 discount because the future was uncertain. So now I was at $39,800 delivered. Assembly price at HRE at the time was $5000 total to put the car together. If I were one of those guys where detail was not a major issue then paint and bodywork with stripes was $6500. My motor and most 427's of the day were $13,000 to $15,000 done. Add $5000 in misc. parts and guess what???? You were in the car for under $70,000. How much less do you think a 427 ERA was at the time $58,000 - $60,000. That was the case with many of the early 4000 cars. So even if one did trade on the resale for $75,000. how bad did the CSX owner really do? Better yet, how bad the the new owner do?

These are only the actual "original" facts, not a fight..

The other important detail is that the price of 427 motors has gone up because of their popularity and scarcity. Whether the motors are obsolete, primitive and not user friendly has nothing to due with this post other than to state that the resale buyer will not only pay more for the 427 motored car but will always pay more for the 427 motored car.

It seems many replica owners chase originality regardless of the manufacturer of their car. I can't tell you how many times I have overheard fender conversations around 4027. "Wow dad, that's a real 427". You rarely hear " Wow that's a real 351 Stroker!

So, I am not sure how any of this will actually effect CSX owners unless they must sell their car immediately but, that goes for anyone that has to sell anything immediately. You always have to take a hit in a fire sale unless of course you are selling caviar or drugs.

My theory was and still is. Buy the most expensive one you can for the least amount of money and while not guaranteed to do well, you might multiply your chances of doing well.

The other theory is to drive what you can afford and be happy with what you have and forget the rest. In the end, it's the one who has the most fun and it's hard to have fun typing on a computer but, since I am car-less at this moment, this is all there is.

When the Cup Car is done and the weather is good, you will see less and less of my posts. While that make some of you happy, I know deep down in the hearts of many Club Cobra members will miss me.
I have not only started wars but ended wars and helped many with detail and trivia on their car that they have only dreamed of.

[Jamo]

We'll "track" your ass down.

[CSX 4027]

Remember when Shelby was going to make Continuation cars for $500,000 with the parts that were supposedly left over sitting in a warehouse and the public was shown a photo of him standing next to a pile of un-used original frames. He was going to make around 50 or so S/C's to complete the series? Remember all the photo's of original parts in the parts bins? How many of those cars in the CSX 3000 series did he make? 3 or so? Maybe 5?
Where do you think all those real deal parts went after that program was found to be.....well I won't say......but you know..

ALL OF THOSE PARTS AND SOME VERY RARE WENT INTO THE EARLY GLASS CARS UNTIL THEY WERE GONE. THE FIRST 3 CARS EVEN CAME WITH THE ORIGINAL LEVEROL SEAT TRACKS THAT COULDN'T BE HAD FOR $500+ NOW BUT OF COURSE ARE REPRODUCED WITHOUT THE CREST. THE CAR CAME STANDARD WITH THE ORIGINAL BRAKE SET-UP THAT IS NOW AN UPCHARGE OPTION.

To some this might be meaningless, to others it was just part of a good deal.

[captain]

Steve,
Somehow, I think you got a deal. How much, if Joe average went to buy the car from HRE at the same time? I bet it was closer to $80,000 then and closer to $100,000 today.
The SPF roller is $36,900 today and seems to be going up.
Compare a CSX "roller" today WITH everything SPF gives at $36,900, and I bet it will be closer to $75,000. It sure as heck is not a $15,000 difference. Can you get a top and side curtains from SAI today? It wasn't available for CSX4027. Every car was so different, they would have to fit each one. One wonders why a fiberglass car from only one mold produces such different parts. Maybe SAI quality has something to do with it.
Anyway, I am glad for you that you got a great deal when you sold. Does the new owner love the car as much as you or has he "modified" your baby?

[CSX 4027]

True about the top and side curtain story. Most I have seen that have a top don't use it anyway but, I guess it is nice to have. I sold 2161 with it's original top and side curtains in ther trunk. They were in almost new condition becaused they were never used. I actually test drove the car on the rain. I asked the owner to help me put the top up. He looked at me like I was nuts and said just get in and drive.
True about I got a deal.
True about it probably costs $100k now.
$80K then is a stretch. I believe the first 6 or so went out for less but I am not 100% sure.
I know at least 3 others in the high 60's on their early car
SPF makes a fine car but has a different buyers head than a CSX buyer. We are all different.
When I sit down at a diner to order a hot turkey sandwhich, I have to have the AuJous gravy from the roastbeef not the thick gibblet stuff. No fries, only baked, salad, oil and vinigar on the side. The waitress usually asks me if I would like to go in the back and make it myself at that point. I am not the SPF customer. I am too picky but again. Great car for the guy who wants the easiest complete deal to get him on the street fast with the least headache.

When some buy a golf shirt, some like Izod with an Aligator others will only wear Polo with the Horsey not because it is a better shirt, it just represents the next level of desire, success and for some bragging rights. It's not about money, there are those that just couldn't think of buying anything but a Shelby.

When my car was under 70K done I could have got a Kirkham in aluminum for $45,000 painted then power to about $70k. The same price as the Shelby. ERA trailing close behind.
4027 became more civilized with its full windshield, muffled exhaust, new paint job and whatever. I have a feeling one day, it will be back under my supervision.
If a SPF buyer is looking at a new one for $55,000 with whatever motor and then sees a CSX under the CAV deal at 50,000 for a painted roller only needing a motor and trans. Which way do you think it will go? There won't be one answer. Time will tell

[JWheaton]

All this talk about 75K here and 100K there and nobody has tried to equalize it to the time frame it was spent?


Beyond that I had to put my 301 post on this thread, because the "embarassment" thread is way to long at this point.

[CSX 4027]

My time frame I am referring to is late 1996 early 1997.
This was when the CSX cars came with thr training wheel options

I remember standing around with the first car at HRE. I asked Billy to see the instruction manual. I had to then pick him up from the floor from laughing so much. MANUEL????What Manual???

[Excaliber]

Realy true about how individual we are about how WE want OUR Cobra to be "spec'd". I never seen any other car so complex in that regard. I KNOW exactly what features I look for in a Cobra, and can NEVER find them.

If you want it your way, you got to build it yourself or work closely with your builder. A roller is only the opening shot!

Ernie

[Blue66]

well after lookin at all these threads about "my car is better than yours" my next Cobra will be another original CSX3000 car... I can drive the piss outta it an give someone a car to restore when I am done

[REAL 1]

Hey: I have the Leveroll seat knobs with crest and the tracks too! Plus many other 4027 details.

Plesae refer to avatar.

[Dominik]

I wonder it there are any news...
Or is there another thread with the latest about CSX cars built in South-Africa?

dom