FFR ebay $70,000 - Page 4

RACERAL · #61 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 07:18 AM

Turk is right one more time........

casaleenie · #62 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 07:19 AM

I'm watching a new FFR spec racer going together and I'm really impressed with the quality... It's not using the donor concept but rather mostly new parts... It's going to be an amazing car. Would have no second thoughts about the quality of the product based on what I'm seeing.. The FFR for sale on e-bay is probably a mid to high 20's car but that seems in keeping with what other cars are selling for at this time... It would be a crime if it went for the 70K. You want to just grab the bidder and slap some sense into them....

Ozona · #63 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 07:39 AM

It's almost not even worth explaining.

The comments about the elevated price are no biggie.

The relative pricing comments comparing makes is not cool and comes off as elitest.

mrmustang · #64 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 08:32 AM

The pricing comments are not even considered elitest. What they are considered are the facts. Supply vs demand is what drives pricing for one brand over another, or even one car over another in the same brand. I sold both of my FFR's in the mid 30's, does this mean that any other FFR could sell for that, yes, and no. it will all depend on the quality, and the details of one particular car. Use a base FFR build (donor, no options), then compare it to your own build/car. Then take your own, and compare it to another brand for which you feel the owners may be looking down at you (there are plenty of high dollar cars out there built poorly by the way, many others which are of a higher build standard than the best FFR built in the world, but, you cannot compare one to the other, only judge your car against yourself)....If you cannot tell the differences, you need to go out and educate yourself a bit more on the world of kit Cobras. If anyone has been having an elitist attitude lately, it is some of the folks who still own FFR's...................Perhaps that is one reason why I did not get a third FFR, as I am tired of the elitest mentality of some of the owners......We are all in the kit car world together, why do we need to pit one group against another to make ourselves feel better about our own personal decisions and choices in life. When is enough, enough.........

Bill S.

Quote:

Originally posted by Ozona

It's almost not even worth explaining.

The comments about the elevated price are no biggie.

The relative pricing comments comparing makes is not cool and comes off as elitest.

Ozona · #65 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 09:15 AM

"The pricing comments are not even considered elitest."

Uh, ok.

mrmustang · #66 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 09:39 AM

Remember, I am the person they come to when it comes time to judge vehicles at shows, I learned a long time ago that you do not judge one car vs another, but one car against itself................Perhaps you need to learn this very same thing.....So try to explain it to me from your point of view...I'm always open to other sides of any equation.............

Bill S.

Quote:

Originally posted by Ozona

"The pricing comments are not even considered elitest."

Uh, ok.

Turk · #67 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 09:47 AM

Why is it when someone comments about the rightfull pecking order for Cobras some folks get all bent out of shape?

The facts are facts. They are ALL good. They are NOT all the same.

Relative pricing is due to where in the food chain some of these cars are. People with GMCs, Buicks, Nissans don't have any problem understanding this. Even Mercedes Benz has models from $29,000 to $129,000.

I don't see the owners of those cars have a problem determining which is which.

Timex and Rolex
$5.00 bottle of wine and a good bottle of wine
Waterfront property, an apartment
Four Seasons and Holiday Inn
Mark Levinson and Sony
Pepto Bismol and Walgreen's Soothe

You se they are all good. Just not the same. Not elitist.

This is no more a put down of FFR that it is of Holiday Inn. Unless they want to charge $400.00 a night for a room.

Even Holiday Inn has Holiday Inn Express.

TURK

Excaliber · #68 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 09:57 AM

Recently we have seen in a few rare cases Kirkhams and Shelbys offered at what some people on this forum thought were "extreme" prices.

So your saying it's OK to analyze the prices of "other" Cobras but NOT politically correct to analyze a ridiculous price for an FFR?

I personally keep a very close watch on Cobra prices and the market. I stand by my former comments and repeat it here.

When HELL freezes over will ANY FFR bring $70K. That comment doesn't have anything to do with percieved or real quality of an FFR, it is simply the TRUTH!

If I offered my Excalibur on e-bay for $70K maybe folks would be "polite" and carefully suggest I was a "little high" on my asking price. Others would simply say, "Are you NUTS?" Both groups would be "correct".

If I was "offended" by such comments, then indeed, I would be "nuts"!

Ernie

cscott67 · #69 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 10:23 AM

Excal, there are certainly a few F5 cars that are worth 70k. I agree from the pics that the particular car in question is not in my opinion.

However, build an all aluminum engine, throw a couple of different power adders on, custom tranny, rear end, six pot brakes, and now you have a very expensive toy that out performs most cobras.

As for the percieved pecking order, it really depends on where you stand and what you want. Some people want modern technology with a race proven design. Others want a very original looking car. (or in some cases an exact copy of the original aluminum can)

There is quite a lot of F5 bashing on this forum, but I think that is because there are different values/perceptions here. Enjoy what you have, Scott

Ken Greene · #70 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 10:26 AM

bid was canceled
it was a BIG typo by the bidder
back to 20,500 now

Excaliber · #71 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 11:01 AM

"Percieved" bashing of FFR's I think is more common that "actual" bashing in here.

At risk of "bashing" FFR's do I dare ask this question?

Having $70K invested IN your car is different than being able to "SELL" your car for that amount.

Your suggestion they are a "few" FFR's worth that amount leaves me scratching my head! I have never seen ONE even come close to such a figure and can't imagine ONE would ever actually "sell" at the level. Asking and getting are two different things!

Heck for that kind of money you can get an aluminum Kirkham, maybe an SAI "real" Cobra on a distress sale.

Ernie

REAL 1 · #72 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 11:16 AM

What a comedy.

First the thread starts over the belief that someone is actually bidding $70,000.00 for a run of the mill FFR.

People here in general find the "bidder" to be in need of a good analyst.

FFR "folks" appear and indignantly challenge those who appear to "question" the sanity of the "bidder" and the utter insanity of paying $70,000 for a FFR and call or refer to those of us finding it hysterical that some putz is willing to pay $70,000 for a $20,000 car as being "elitest".

FFR "folks" have a documented history of bashing other brands and especially rabid as to Shelby's new CSX Cobra questioning and challenging their status as REAL Cobras and their value and sale price by SAI. Some of those people laughed at CSXs being offered for sale at and their buyers refered to as pigeons. Yet multiple CSX's have been actually sold for $160K+.

But some of these FFR "folks" now apparently want us to believe at it is apparently possible for a FFR to sell for $70K.

Then comes the "crushing" news that the "bidder made a mistake" and meant to only bid $20K.

What a scream!

While I like FFR's if done correctly and think they are a good product for the money they are not on the same level as some others.

Like it or not a FFR is not in the same category as a Unique, SPF, ERA, Contemporary, Midstates, Arntz, Butler etc.. It just ain't. Period. Like it or not there is a pecking order. If you want to be at the top, you ain't gonna be there in a FFR. And I AM NOT SAYING THE FFR IS NOT A GOOD CAR. IT JUST IS NOT ON THE SAME LEVEL AS THE OTHERS IMHO.

I'm not being an elitest. I'm just stating the facts. Just like there ain't no such thing as a standard build FFR with a 460BB worth $70K.

All that being said I plan of having a FFR spec racer some say for track work when I have the time.

ddimick · #73 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 11:27 AM

Humm... well, something is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it.

That being said, you'd have to be very uninformed to be willing to pay $70k for that particular car.

Can a FFR be worth $70k? I think it can be. Just not that one (nor mine).

All philisophical arguments aside about what is real and what isn't, there are certainly a lot of people that perceive value in having Shelby's name on their product. I don't think this is right or wrong, it's just something that some people think is valuable, and others that think is not. I don't personally perceive value in it, but it doesn't offend me that others do.

Does that make me a brownshirt? What does that mean, anyway? Anyone know the origin?

cscott67 · #74 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 12:36 PM

Ernie, just because you haven't seen one, or wouldn't pay that much doesn't mean it's not a reality. I personally wouldn't pay 60k for a Shelby/Kirkham copy. That doesn't mean they are over-priced. That's just not what I choose to spend my money on.

Evan, what LEVEL? Performance? (Uh, I'll get one for the track) Originality? (Got me on that one, your copy is the most correct.) Engineering? (Pretty much race-car technology with proven performane parts) Fit, finish, etc.? (All up to the builder, which is the same variable on all of the kits unfinished from the factory.) I think when you finally do get your spec racer, you'll have a full belly from all your own words.

You have a nice car, but I don't see it as the Holy Grail! Enjoy what you have, and let other's enjoy theirs. Scott

Excaliber · #75 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 01:06 PM

Ernie

mrmustang · #76 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 03:23 PM

Evan,

Let's face it, the only elitist here seems to be you....After all, you are indeed in a class all your own

Bill S.

Roscoe · #77 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 03:41 PM

I love pissing matches.....I think I'll just sit back and fire up a nice Rothchild and watch the action.

Roscoe

PSB · #78 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by REAL 1

FFR "folks" have a documented history of bashing other brands and especially rabid as to Shelby's new CSX Cobra questioning and challenging their status as REAL Cobras and their value and sale price by SAI. Some of those people laughed at CSXs being offered for sale at and their buyers refered to as pigeons. Yet multiple CSX's have been actually sold for $160K+.

Evan,

Please try and pay attention - I'm the one who got you all stirred up on that other thread by

at the CSX for $145,000. I'm not an FFR guy

Pete

RACERAL · #79 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 06:22 PM

O.K... My last bla,bla,bla...
Why can't a FFR be built as good as a SPF, UNIQUE,ERA and what ever else is at the "top" of the pecking order.. and please make it simple for me.... I'm just an FFR owner... Oh.. money no object..

PSB · #80 (**permalink**) 05-17-2003, 06:59 PM

Raceral,

It has nothing to do with the quality of the car. Even if you were to spend $70K building an FFR, you still wouldn't get access to the Superformance Owners exclusive website or get into the SAAC registry. It's kinda like the new Hummer H2 - it's just a Suburban with a Hummer body on it, but people will pay a bunch of $ for the snob factor.

Pete