Auto Insurance advice needed - Non Cobra

[GASKETBOY]

Need to know if this is possible.

On July 3rd, I purchased a 2003 BMW 330CI. That's the good news.

On Saturday, August 9th, while my girlfriend was driving it home from her job she stopped to yield to traffic entering the freeway. Unfortunately, the driver behind her did not share her opinion and planted his 2003 Hummer into the trunk. Well, it wasn't really his Hummer - it belongs to the local dealership where he works. Good news is that there were no major injuries and everyone was insured.

My girlfriend is ok, a bit rattled and sore, but what can you expect from that much mass impacting from behind.

I am not certain if my request is feasible, and this is where I need some feedback:

Right now in my garage, I have a one month old ride that I have yet to make my first payment on. The damage affects the rear bumper and related hardware, both tail light assemblies, trunk lid, trunk pan, both quarters, rear window trim, and just about every part aft of the doors. Not a pretty picture by any means.

We decided last night that we do not want this car repaired and returned - we want his insurance company to take this car away, pay off the loan, and send a check for our original down payment. All I want from the automotiove side of this accident is to have a new car again - I really do not (will not) pay new car money for a rebuilt, repainted, pieced together car.

I have heard the term "diminished value", but not being in the insurance business I do not know how ins. compnaies work. If fixed, I will have a new car that has a black cloud looming overhead - considering services such as Carfax etc. the car is now worth a fraction of its former self.

Is my request reasonable? I fully understand that the insurance adjuster does not represent my best interests so I am looking for some insight from those who may have been here on how best to proceed. Right now I am dealing directly with his adjuster.

The accident was just reported Monday, so no action has taken place yet. The car is at my house, although it was driven home, it is not a driver - too many parts hanging off.

I do not want to play the "hire a lawyer they have deep pockets" game. I just want what I paid for a month ago - a new car. How should I proceed in my dealings with the adjuster so they agree to buy the car outright and send me a check. Wishful thinking right?

Help!

Jeff Guisto

private email at: jguisto@fenderusa.com

Thanks.

[TonyMadrid]

I don't know what the Insurance Department Regulations are in your state, but it may not be a bad idea to find out. You can probably find out by doing a google search for the department of Insurance for your state. That may not be a bad starting point.

You should also look at your own policy, under the Physical Damage and Collision portions to see if they'll pick up any excess.

As for your specific question I'll provide some generic information. In general, when insurance companies look at damaged metal they perform an appraisal to determine what the cost would be to repair the car. If the cost meets or exceeds 75% of the car's ACV (Actual Cost Value), they will total it. Insurance companies don't want to be married to a car. The last thing they want to do is to repair a borderline car and then have the owner continuosly calling complaining about "this isn't right or this is still wrong or not working properly".

Now, if they decide to total the car, the problem is the ACV. Most companies (based on what State Regs tell them to do) figure the ACV of a car by different means. Some will use valuation services that provide market analyses of the current value. Or they may use valuation guides such as Kellys Blue Book or NADA books. In some states they are required to use an average from different sources.

The biggest problem it seems that you may be facing is that even if they total the car, you may not get enough to cover to cover what you paid for the car. You may have to eat the difference.

Regarding Dimished Value I've attached a link to a site that may be helpful.



www.ican2000.com/dvfaqs.html

Good Luck,

Tony

[Roscoe]

Also bear in mind:

At least in NJ, if you rear end someone you are at fault...period!

Whatever the difference, you can sue the dealership and the other driver for the difference.

Roscoe

[Turk]

Insurance company will do what the two of you agreed to at the time you bought the policy.
That agreement does not include," in case of an accident I want a new car". clause.

I believe most insurance companies will repair the vehicle at a place of your choosing for damages up to 80% of the value of the car. Over that amount they may elect to total the car. THEIR CALL.

The body shops are full of cars like BMW's and better (including Cobras) that are in the process of getting repaired.
If it was up to the owners, we would shut our collision and paint facilities and everyone who don't want a car that was wrecked, would get a new car.

I don't think you should waste your time and money getting a lawyer. I don't believe you'll find who could help you. Insurance companies have lawyers also.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your best bet is to find a facility that can do excellent repairs. The car is yours.

Sorry.
TURK

[Dsprint2000]

Working for an insurance company, I ditto Turk's remark that you did not obtain a policy that says in case of accident, buy me a new car.... BUT, in your case should they total the car, I think that you may luck out as the car is brand new. The only forseeable problem may be the value (ie - did you pay too much). For example, say you bought a Yugo from Turk for $20,000 brand new yesterday. Jamo being the safe driver he is (heheheheh), rear ends you and totals your car. The insurance rep comes out and sees your new Yugo, does his calculations, check with dealers and finds that the value fo the Yugo is $12,000. YIKES, now what... that's right, your on the hook for the unpaid portion. Insurance companies are not responsible if you overpay for a vehicle. One other thing before I sign off, when you buy or lease a new car, check if your company offers 'loan coverage'. That way, if your loan amount is higher than the value of the car (see example above), the insurance company will pay the loan off. You can only buy this coverage on a new car.......

Good luck, hope all works out for you.....

David

[PatBuckley]

Gasketboy-

I think the answer is obvious - your girlfriend, knowing how much that car meant to you, should make up the difference.

After all, she was driving it and she should make out real well from the lawsuit she is going to bring against the owners of the Hummer...so there will be enough funds to do this.

If this was my car and my girlfriend crashed it - no matter who was at fault - I would feel terrible. (Explaining it to my wife would be the worst part, probably) I have always felt better crashing my own stuff.

Pat

[GASKETBOY]

Thanks for the input guys,

When I bought the car I did opt for the GAP insurance so I should be covered on the difference, if any, between cost and value.

Turk, good idea, close the shop and give all the owners new cars. Me first, but I'm not going to pay a penny more that $18,500 for that Yugo.

This is so damn frustrating.

jeff

[Turk]

It is always more difficult to explain to the owner of a recent purchase, than it is to someone who have owned the car for say 15,000 miles.

Then again, the owner for a year or two may have an emotional attachment to the car and he could sue for pain and suffering to see his/her baby get an "ouchie".

Legally you are not entitled to any more than they are, just because the accident happened "so soon after you bought it".

The GAP insurance (which by the way is a good idea especially in the case of a lease) will come in handy to make up the difference between what you owe the bank and what the insurance company pays to settle the claim in case of a TOTAL LOSS.
Without it, you could end up having NO CAR and still owing the bank as much as $10,000.

It won't help to make up the difference between repairs and your desire for a new car.

TURK


This is why I don't spend my money on insurance.

[Dsprint2000]

Having to pay for his insurance......... leaving him more mooolah to spend on that CSX...... .


Gasketboy - be prepared to spend a minimum of $19,000 on that Yugo. There a classic now........

David

[DAVID GAGNARD]

Jeff;

You have e-mail............

David

[TonyMadrid]

Great Comments by most of the guys!

However, I just gave your dilemna some thought and the following came to mind.

Insurance is protection against specified hazards. Basically, all an insurance company's responsibility is, under just about any policy, other than a stated value policy, is to make you "whole again". This is a basic tenet of insurance. You may have to argue that all you want is to be placed back in the same position you were in prior to the loss occurrence.

Tony

[Dsprint2000]

Correct, the 'basic' tenet is to place you whole again after a covered loss. However, in my example above with the Yugo, your insurance carrier is not responsible if you overpaid for something. If you paid $100,000 for a Ford Festiva that was actually only worth $100, why is the insurance company responsile to make up for the difference in value? Your premium paid was based on a $100 Ford Festiva......

David

[Art Burtt]

Sounds like cosmetic damage at best. This shouldn't cost you a penny and most insurance companies won't approve fixing a car if it's structure is in queston or repairing it would make it dangerous to drive. The only way you'll get a new car will be if it's "totaled"

[klayfish]

Tony and David,
Where are you getting your info?!?! You're making this stuff up, right? Insurance companies are just out to get you, they don't care about making anyone whole!

Seriously, I think they have said it all. Unfortunately, they won't just buy your car because you don't want it back. If it is fixable, then they will pay to fix it properly. It is important...let me rephrase....extremely important for you to find a good body shop to make sure the job is done right.

That said, if your car is close to being totalled, you may be able to talk to the adjuster and insurance company and convince them to total the car. Nothing underhanded or illegal, just ways to pursuade them. There are plenty of people here, including me, who work for an insurance company and can help you with that.

Steve

[Turk]

If they total the car, it won't be because the owner does not want a car that has been in an accient.

You find me a carrier who is doing that, Iwill give all my insurance business to them.

Why should someone who had a accident a wek after the purchase of a new car be entitled to specail coverages, as compared to someone else who bought their car 8 days ago instead of 7?
Where do you draw the line?
What if the guy who bought his car 7 days ago put 3300 miles on it, and the other who bought it earlier has only put 12 miles on his.

You are not suggesting that insurance companies would take those into account and give one guy a new car and the other directions to the nearest Maco. Are you?

TURK

[DAVID GAGNARD]

Turk;

A little something about totaling cars; The industry standard is 75% of the ACV,but I have totaled cars and trucks for as little as 50%. A lot of things go into doing this.

We may total an auto at the owners request to help avoid an injury claim,for instance if the owner requests that we total his auto and he will forego an injury claim and sign all wavers,we may total a vehicle that is not technically a total,it is just cost effective.... Looking at the claim as a whole,the insurance company may settle the claim quicker that way than going thru litigation with a personal injury attorney that will drag it out for months....

Remember when an insurance company totals a vehicle, they are basically buying it from the owner at the ACV,then they take possesion of the vehicle and sell if for salvage and recoup what they can....

In cases such as with one to two year old vehicles such as Z-71s-most all large 4X4s-Corvettes-Mustangs-Camaros-Beemers and the like,we get an unreal amount of salvage back right now,so we will total them at a lower percentage because we will recoup the money on the salvage....

Case in point,just recently I totalled a 2003 Z-71,hit a large cow dead center in the front,radiator was on top of the engine.... The repair estimate was exactly 50% of what the owner paid for the truck six months before,he requested we total the truck as he did not want it anymore....I called our guy that handles the totals and gave him the info and e-mailed him the photos,we totalled the truck,re-imbursed the owner the purchase price less 25 cents per mile for the mileage he put on it and sold it at a salvage sale and received 55% of the value back when sold!!!!!!!!!! It was actually cheaper for us to total it than fix it and it also avoided an injury claim with the owner,claim settled in less than a week,owner in a new Z-71,everyone happy...

We have seen some specailty cars go for as high as 60% of the ACV at some sales,so that is something else we take into account when settling claims with certain autos and trucks....

There is nothing written in stone about totalling vehicles other than at 75% of the ACV,state law says you HAVE to total it,but we can deem an auto a total at any lesser amount we chose...The circumstances of every accident or claim are different and we make our decisions on each claim on the basis of the accident and circumstances,so each one will be somewhat different from the last....

I know the company I work for is a national company and in your state Turk,I'll keep their name off the internet,but in the south here they are in the top five of insurance companys....So you may just have to change your insurance carrier soon!!!!!!!!!!

David

[Dsprint2000]

Re-read my posts and they make sense. Have been in the biz for 20 years, last 8 as underwriter. But then, I always knew you claim guys were doing some 'black ops'.

Have a great day....


David

[klayfish]

Yeah, yeah....you underwriters always give us SIU people fits! I actually find it is always a fine line trying to balance the needs/wants of underwriting, the agents, marketing vs. the needs of the claim department, including SIU.

Yes, your posts did make sense, I was just yanking chains.

Steve

[GASKETBOY]

Steve,

There was a very noticeable absence of one party in your post - the victim.

Jeff

[Dsprint2000]

Always wanted to do SIU - you guys have all the fun!!


Jeff - we're all victims.


David