CSX4000 roller for $39.9K?

[MotoCobra]

I, for one, am not going to sit here and let Evan try to tell me he wouldn't drive a '65-6 0r 7 if he had it...I know he would. Anyone that's had one of these cars (of any vintage) knows that they're made for speeding...er...I mean driving.

Personally, I'm hoping for a street 289...say '64 or 5...and...oh, yes...it'll get driven...a little.

I'm not trying to attack anyones postion here, infact, this thread just got me going on the subject of licensing/badging, that's all.

I still don't think there's any common blood or heritage between Shelby circa '60 something and "SAI" of this new millenium. This argument will be made for years...remember when "The Suits" took over Harley? It's kinda like that; however, in the case of SAI, I really believe it was a bunch of racers then and a bunch of "suits" now.

Heck, comments have been made that the whole thing (Shelby...the operation) lost it's soul when they moved from Venice to the Airport...

Just an Opinion...on a forum...again,

Manny

[foothills gary]

I would tend to agree with southernfriedcj on the Superformance issue.In fact it would appear that now would be possibly the best time to buy.Though I doubt we will see the predicted fire sale,I would expect to see the content at the existing price will go way up! One thing is for sure-I doubt we will be seeing any price increases by any of the companies soon!

[Dan Semko]

Ernie,

What we're witnessing is the start of a "manufacturers pricing war" where the consumers will be the victors. Think about this "outside the box" because that's where the market base is found. Outside of the informed cobraphiles, joe public has no idea about quality replicas, they only recognize the shape and association with Shelby. At a $40k roller price, SAI
has entered the ERA/SPF zone with the advantage of having a CSX number and Shelby endorsement. Will it effect every manufacturers market, you can bet on it because
everywhere SPF/Kirkham/FFR or others display, SAI will be there also with the sales pitch, "why buy a replica when you can buy a Shelby." The SAI/SPF lawsuit is predicated on trade dress etc...."maybe" want to see that case sink quickly? Try researching the history on The Mabee Drilling Company in Midland, Texas 1953 and the "Mabee Special" and the Victress body. Not only will it roast the entire premise that Shelby was the first visionary but it will provide complete insight into how aluminum came to play in cobras. The world's fastest sports car was the Mabee Special averaging 187.66 mph at Bonneville in 1954. Joe Mabee drove the car to 203.105 mph in 1953 at Bonneville becoming the first non-race car to reach 200 mph. Guess who they enlisted to drive the Mabee and guess who bought Shelby his first Aston Martin for European racing? Yep,
the Mabees...so Maybe creative competition will open an entire new avenue to cobraphiles. Shelby capitalized on a great idea and probably taught Trump the true art of the deal. He has the right recipe for continuation, the name, the public visibility and has the art of placing the fly in any given ointment, because it's his demeanor.
The fun is about to commence, so pull up your favorite easy chair, butter the pop corn and pour a cold one, THIS will make any Mike Tyson event look like a Boy Scout Jamboree.

[Great Asp]

Wow,

Posts flying faster than I can keep up!

Manny, don't take this wrong, but your first post made me dizzy

Evan, glad to see you are alive and kicking!

Good thread on the topic!

I have been thinking of "how I would sell" a SAI made in SA, or "how I would sell against" a SAI made in SA. Everything has to be sold, and sales people always find a way to "hawk" their product when comparing it to another similar product.

If I am SAI, I promote the fact that it is a CSX car. If I am another company, I use the method of comparison to sell against it.

I saw a post about Mr. Mike's ERA. Keep your car, it is beautiful! IMO, a car like Mr. Mike's is worth more than other cars, because you can see the quality of the assembly. If someone thought they wanted a Cobra, they would look at more than one brand regardless of name or price. Price and quality will still be issues for buyers. That will mean choices.

If the current distribution for SAI is used, how many more people will they sell to? Can they reach the "new buyer"? How does the purchase of AC by SPF fit in to the mix?

I am not picking a fight here (for a change... ), only asking the questions that only time will answer.

Eric

[427sharpe]

Boys, it looks like Shelby has discovered that he can DOMINATE the replicar Cobra biz, make a ton of green and never set foot in a courtroom. BRAVO! I really want to see one of the CAV Shelby cars. If the quality is there, which I think it will be, Shelby will trump both ERA , Superformance and all of the other 'mid=level' marketers. I can't see a reason in the world why someone would buy an ERA with a square frame when you can have a Shelby Cobra for equivalent cash. Hats off to Carroll, he has really put on the heat. Anybody wanna buy a well used EM?

[Dan Semko]

Got the drop on me Eric!
I think Ac can and will use the "original" approach while Shelby will utilize the "real" avenues. The bottom line is a rose is a rose, some are more expensive, while others are just as attractive. They'll all be expensive at the "right time" and like the rose, when the subject is handled without the proper reverence, it will always draw blood.

[foothills gary]

Let's not forget that Shelby allied himself with Chrysler(Crysler?) during the infamous "K-car" years,allying his name with some of their largely forgetable Dodge Omni and Daytona line products.Hopefully a mass market car won't contain any remnants of those DarkDays just for market share.In my opinion,it was only the groundwork done by the small replica makers that allowed Shelby to dig his chassis' out of storage and start to produce Cobras again.There would be no perceived value in a CSX number without ERA,SPF,etc.

[BANDIT 1]

What some people here don't understand is some Cobra owners (or projected buyers...) DON"T CARE about originality. As long as the car looks 99% like the original, they could care less if some people think a square tube frame, 5-speed (or 6-speed), non- FE engined Cobra "does not look right". Superformance uses a square-tubed frame because it is BETTER than a round-tubed frame. Superformance uses a Tremec TKO II 5-speed transmission because it is BETTER than a 4-speed Top-Loader. I have never seen a MSD electronic ignition come on a "original" Cobra. Superformance has the battery in the trunk because it is BETTER than having it behind the passenger seat.

I will make it clear how I feel about this "ERA, Superformance, etc..." companies now must be scared to death and "why would anyone buy a Superformance Cobra for $60,000.00 when they can get a CAV "real" Shelby Cobra for $70,000.00"? The 427 S/C Cobra is legend because it was the "fastest production car" for over 20 years. Some of us still want the Cobra to be the Fastest car around. If you take a $60,000.00 Superformance Cobra (557c.i. 700+ horsepower/Tremec TKO II 5-speed) and a $70,000.00 CAV Cobra (427c.i. 500+ horsepower/Toploader 4-speed) to the drag strip, road course, or on the street the Superformance Cobra will accelerate faster, stop quicker, turn better, and out perform the CAV Cobra in every category except the "crying" and "excuse" of why they paid $10,000.00 extra for that CSX plate category.

[Allan A]

I have owned both the SPF and the SAI, from my conversation with the dealer today the 4000 glass car will be identical to one made out of LV. This means fuel cell, Shelby suspension, leather, Shelby rearend, etc. All I can say is no way no how would I buy the SPF over a new 4000 car. Forget the nameplate, just the fuel cell alone would make me buy one. Well done Shelby!

If the cars look good when they get here SPF and ERA will be in trouble.

Allan

[Allan A]

Bandit you are so full of $%%^, I think you made the same comments before about the structural side of an SPF over a Shelby. Once again provide your calculations and I would be happy to review and comment. As for the battery, oh yes that is major problem with todays new cell battery's, just watch out for the flames from your SPF gas tank.

Allan

[KobraKarl]

Damn Bandit , you could at least wait for the gel coat to cure!

I know I wont buy one , I'm just going to wait until Evans car is worth 80k and buy his......

Any one really think aCSX/Shelby car isnt worth a $10,000 pedigree? How bout $5.000 , Id pay it .

KK

[Great Asp]

"If the cars look good when they get here SPF and ERA will be in trouble.

Allan"

Allen,

I'm not so sure of that. Not jumping on SAI here, but 10K is still 10K. You have owned a SPF and a CSX car, you know the differances. You might pick the CSX-SA car, but Dan Semko might still go with a SPF. It doesn't mean anyone is right or wrong, but I question if that many people will go to SAI from their current Cobra.

Has anyone seen the car yet? I would like to.

I saw another "roller" car this summer at the World Ford Challenge. It is 10K "less" than a SPF. They have buyers, but I would not buy one because "I think" the SPF is at least 10K better.

I am just taking the "wait and see" view. Not ready for SAI "World Cobra Domination"....

Eric

[Allan A]

Eric,

I agreee lets wait and see, if I did not already jump into the current car I would have puchased one without seeing it.

I can tell you have been busy with the KONE, DEMAG battle. In this case they are both KONE.

Allan

[Excaliber]

If you haven't seen THIS thread, PLEASE do so soon, that goes for ALL of us on the Club.

Thanks.

All Members... Please Read.

Ernie

[Allan A]

Ernie,

I am sorry. I will work on it

[CSX 4027]

When Shelby came out with the glass car most including myself believed that it would only cost about $10,000 more than A nocely done ERA. To many it wasn't even a passing thought. Most said why spend 10K more for the Shelby name when you are still getting a glass car?

I was in at the beginning and most know how much work and personal time it took to get the early glass car right. Many of the early glass cars didn't have the "Super Detail" because the builders realized the profits were going to go down the tubes. Then Shelby got more user friendly as time went on but still the issue of $$. The difference back then was clearly more than 10K.

Now, if they can deliver their current product at about the same price as the other replica's, I am not sure why one would go elsewhere at this point if the quality is good other than to just stick it to Shelby.

I have nothing against any of the other cars and even like the way their built but if all things are equal. then??

[MotoCobra]

I'll be in Vegas pretty soon...I sure hope they've got a CAV/SAI...I'd like to see how the finished product looks.

It'll be hard to take if this turns out to be a really nice car that I'd actually want to buy on value alone...oh man, I've screwed myself! (BTW, I was recently quoted a low $30k price on a very nice SPF roller outta Mooresville, N.C.)

Never mind....I didn't say anything!

Damn...

Manny

[BANDIT 1]

Allan:

I am sure you could contact the Olthoff's or Superformance and they would meet you at the track of your choice. It is the CSX crowd that is always saying how great their 35 year old suspension design is and how it just can't be improved. I have driven a CSX and several Superformance Cobra's and the chassis wasn't even close. The crazy thing is that the 427 Cobra was not liked by 99% of all of the professional race car drivers that raced it at the time and they STILL say they don't like it. All of a sudden 35 years later, the chassis becomes "worldclass" and "un-improveable". Don't shoot the messenger, ask ANY of the Shelby race car drivers of the past (that aren't on his payroll now...) and they will tell you the same. I am sure your going to tell me now that chassis for the new Ford GT is nowhere close to the "original" GT 40 chassis. It's time you all prove it...

What makes you think that the Superformance Cobra's can't come with a fuel cell, what car did you own?

[GregN]

I spoke to my local Shelby Dealer today. He worked the Shelby booth at the Monterey Historics this past weekend. He told me he knew of only two sales at that event.

He provided me with the latest cut sheet for the roller. The price will go up to $42,500 after Sept. 15th, 2003.

I never considered the Shelby due to the higher cost prior to the price reduction. I only looked at ERA's and Contemporay's. This price change has moved Shelby to the top of the list.

I feel this will hurt the price of the higher end "glass" cars.

I have been studying cobra's for about 4 years now. I have visited my dealers and Mfg's.

If and when I buy a Shelby roller. I will be able to say YES it is a Shelby. And yes it is in the "Shelby Registry"

Greg

[KobraKarl]

Bandit,

while i've read here or there that the 427 cars did not enjoy the favor of the 289 cars, these quotes apear to come from one or two different drivers , Its disfavor apparrently rising from its weight and the fact that it overpowered the design, surely you dont think those same drivers would embrace your 557 cid drag motor?

KK