While I won't have my new SPF by January, I expect to pay for and receive my MSO (requested [and to be paid for] in order to register under SB 100 in 2004). I don't expect to install my drivetrain before going to the DMV or for that matter have serial numbers for the engine or tranny. Some questions for those of you with experience.
1. Besides the MSO and a fat wallet, what else do I specifically need to take to DMV in January (I have read many threads but want to be clear since I am quite dense)? I don't know what SPF will include with the MSO but the only other thing I currently have is the original sales order from Dynamic to show what I am paying for the roller.
2. DMV form 256 - Misc. Statement of Fact - since I won't have been to the CHP, do I provide the SPF chassis number as my VIN or will this eventually be filled in after going to the CHP? This would be true for all SPF's as no one at this stage has their actual VIN without going to the CHP.
3. What year and make do I put down on this form #256?
4. They ask if the vehicle was constructed BY ME or FOR ME BY: _____. Since this is a SPF roller, how is this one answered?
5. In this same paragraph they ask for BILLS OF SALE for the engine and tranny (I will have the info on the body/frame = MSO paperwork). Since these have not been purchased, do I just leave them blank? Do I then just estimate TOTAL VALUE OF VEHICLE at the end of this section based on the engine and tranny plus their installation cost plus the cost of the roller, predicated on the drivetrain I expect to install? Do I leave this blank?
6. DMV form 343 - Application for Title or Registration - same question regarding VIN as I asked in above item #2. They also ask for MAKE OF VEHICLE - is this the same answer as my #3?
Any thoughts on timing of insurance - since I will have paid for the roller even before I get it, one assumes that I should have my insurance commence when I write that check.
I ask for your guidance so that I don't waste time in line and I register it properly. Am I missing anything else. Thanks for your help. The excitement is building!
Tom,it's my understanding that you can't really even begin the process without all your receipts for everything necessary to make this a complete car.The"use" tax is based on this(equivalent to sales tax),and is collected at the time(or before)the SB100 number is issued.Superformance offers a great package price on all items necessary to make this a complete car,except the engine,and they can usually refer you to someone reputable for that.There is also you friendly local Ford dealer for a crate engine as well.The only reason I mention these options is that it appears that time is of the essence if you are going to meet the January('04) target.The car doesn't have to be running,only having all parts purchased with receipts.DMV knows your car will probably come in between $50k-$65k,so don't even think about leaving out anything.My car is still about 1.5years away,and I am not looking forward to this step,but I have been through it before.I hope this helps,and I'm sure others will soon be checking in with their experiences as well.Also,your insurance company may not cover your car until it is complete-better check on that one!
I made my appointment today for January 2 to begin the process. You need MSO, complete receipts, etc, and are given a window of time to complete the process (certification, safety check, etc), so the car needs to be complete, or real close to it.
500 vehicles per year in a state the size of CA is absurd, but it's all we got. I've been waiting since August.
Not exactly!
There are some modifications to those instructions (since they were almost acurate for registrations in 2003). DMV is far more versed with different kits, replicas, rollers, turnkeys etc. By make and brand. They now have a binder with photos of different kits, pallets etc.
You can no longer buy and FFR for $11,000 and do all the work and show up and insist on paying taxes on what you have recepits for. Even if you did all the work yourself.
The new registration application is diferent this year and I belive it asks for the value of labor to finish. Makes no distinction betwen yours or someone else's.
Towards the top of the page under VEHICLE REGISTRATION there is a link marked "click here to proceed". Click there.
That will open another page labeled "VEHICLE REGISTRATIONS AND TITLE INFORMATION" Third one from the bottom is "Home-Made, Specially Constructed, or Kit Vehicles" Click on that.
You will be where you can get all the information first hand.
When speaking with the DMV it sounded like all that I needed was the MSO and a check. The drivetrain paperwork was not critical as I will be registering it as a 1965 body and that is what SB 100 is all about. Then again, you get what you pay for when speaking with a voice @ the DMV. Do you register it as a Cobra or as a SPF? What about a VIN as it has not gone to CHP?
I have read the cobratrader and DMV threads but they don't really address my questions - this is what I was hoping you guys could help with. Can I get a SPCNS with just the MSO?
I know what engine and tranny I will put in - I am finalizing selecting the installer and what his labor cost will be. If I get a firm estimate from him, do you think that will work - or should it be in the form of a receipt. I am not looking for a short cut, just the right way to do it. [Labor on a SPF is limited primarily to the drivetrain installation - correct?] I am hoping for a late January delivery to Reno and then a few weeks for the install and delivery to the Bay Area. The key, as we all know, is getting that SB100 number and not having to go back to the DMV after the first appointment.
Tom...I would order the engine and tranny now if you can.
I have a question as well....On the Statement of Construction form what would I enter in the section that asks when you took possession of the completed vehicle and from whom?
I will not have possession on Jan 2nd ... it will probably be Feb ...then I need to drop in the engine and tranny so it still isn't a "completed vehicle"
__________________
"There are 10 types of people out there....the ones that understand binary and the zeros that don't."
Cobrasnake,
If you just show up with an MSO (which normally does not show what you paid) you will NOT get an SB-100 number.
They don't care if the car is running or not. They want to know how much you spent, or how much your or someone else's labor is worth, and they want the taxes on a completed car. It doesn't matter that it is NOT completed yet.
What is the car worth with all major components, and value of the labor that went into it.
Since I don't believe SPF MSO shows what you paid for it, they will need a Bill of Sale.
If you present that as if that is all the car is worth or all it will be worth by the time you get done,that WON'T fly.
Especially in the case of SPF, because it is a popular brand and one they are familiar with. You must declare the full value. You will probably get away with less taxes on the labor portion, becasue SPF comes damn near all done. There is no body work, no paint, no installation of components, other than engine and transmission. You don't have to wire the car, finish the interior etc.
So, if you don't even have the engine done, or haven't bought the transmission yet, I recommend you have the receipts for them.
You will only be given a limited time to have the car completed and taken to the CHP.
On January 2nd. if all you have is a car and pay taxes on $40K and got away with it, you have 30 or 60 days to get it finished and taken to CHP. Otherwise your temporary sticker will expire. You may have to trailer the car to CHP and then to referee station. Your SB-100 number won't expire, but your priveledges to drive it (the temporary will).
In my case my car was functional, and even without the CHP or the smog inspection, I was permitted to drive the car legally with the temporary stuck to the window.
Like I said earlier, they were only looking for taxes on the main car (kit, or the roller) and some additional taxes on the other major components. No more. Now they want to know what did you spend in labor too now. This is all new for this year, and actually went into effect sometime in 3rd quarter of 2003.
Turk is far more up on the latest developments than I am, but you would use SB-1578 for a used completed Cobra bought out of state. This bill also uses the same 500 numbers allotted by SB-100, but was written to let people legally buy and register Cobras from out of state so they will be legal. Also to make sure you pay all the taxes on them. If you bought a Cobra from Texas for example that was registered there as a 1965 Ford whatever, by using SB-1578 you can register it in Calif. as a 1965 Replica and the rest is mostly the same as doing one under SB-100. As for the proof of insurance question. I believe that you will need it before the DMV will give you a license plate. I am not sure if you have to have it just to get the SPCN number. Turk has been through this lately so he is the one to talk to about the new things. People trying to avoid taxes on a $50,000 dollar car by declaring it's value as $20,000 have kind of made a mess of things. I can't say for sure, but I believe the DMV here not only looks at all the receipts and adds them up but then checks with your insurance company to see what you have as a declared value. The woman that I talked to told me they would prefer all the receipts be together and not a seperate one for each nut and bolt. Mainly all major components and what they cost when finished. And now of course the labor. Turk, just how do they arrive at a number of hours for that as some people can put a car together in a fraction of the time it takes others. As for the tax issue that is a mess. Better to just pay them on all components than argue that you have already paid them on some things you bought. Just my opinion based on what I have seen happen here the past year.
Ron,
I can't speak for the DMV but I guess they could compare what one person claimed they have in the preparation of their car against someone else. I think if you buy a FFR and claim it took you 20 hours to put it together, they can easily compare that against someone else who claims it took them 100 hours. Then there may be someone with an SPF claiming it took them 10 hours for the engine and transmission.
The 20 claim to put together a FFR would be scrutinized. They DO know the differences between different manufacturers.
By the same token someone paying taxes on a CSX on $100,000 could easily be the guide against someone claiming they paid only $15,000 for theirs.
These are nothing other than speculations on my part. Having seen the binder with all those pictures of cars and kits etc. I would like to err on the side of being up front and paying them what is due to them.
They do have a way of establishing value by asking your insurance company to see what you have your car insured for.
As for the insurance...When I went to get my SB-100 number, they did NOT! I can't say if I had to produce one before I went the last time after smog and CHP.
I have to agree with you completely about erroring on the safe side. I would rather pay a little more in taxes than have them come after me later with fines and all kinds of other stuff. I actually gave them a value that was more than what mine cost and is more than my agreed to value with the insurance company. I talk to the girls at the Redding DMV from time to time and they really don't seem to have any set standard here for how they figure things. They did tell me that instead of bringing receipts for the frame, wheels and tires, and suspension all in seperate papers, they would accept them on one paper as long as everything was listed. As the one woman told me, "We have enough paper work now, we don't need any more." But things seem to keep changing from car to car. One person had to have wipers, another didn't. Some had to have brake and light inspections, others didn't. Very confusing for a simple minded person like me. I do understand the 500 number isn't enough though. It is better than none, but a small carrot.
Cobra Make, Engine: Compomotive. 351w, close ratio four speed, live axle, 4wdb.
Posts: 226
Not Ranked
Just my 2 cents worth,
I registered under1578 as an out of state purchase, licensed and titled in Texas. I did not qualify under sb100...long story.
When I went to the have the car tested for the bar # (first trip),
I was told that I had a truck engine in the cobra??? and that it was not going to be approved based on that fact. I asked him how he determined that and he told me: "I can tell".
So be careful about the engine type that you have in the car. There are laws about transplanting truck engines into cars.
After waiting for a year for sb1578 to become law, I reapplied for registration and title, had the engine tested ( same "truck engine") and had no problems at all.
Extremely frustrating for well over a year!!
Bottom line sounds like I need to have the MSO and Bill of Sale from Dynamic and an invoice from the installer for his labor and cost of engine and tranny. SPF makes it easy since the labor is so limited. Hopefully DMV knows how complete the roller is!
Do you think a copy of the installers invoice is adequate - does it need to give the engine and tranny ID #?
Does anyone have the answer to "date of possession"? I guess one could argue that when I wrote the check to Dynamic I had possession - well at least it gives them a date - thoughts?
Does everyone register their car as a 1965 Cobra or do I say it is a replica or SPF?
Cobrasnake,
As I have said it many times, I am just rendering an educated guess having gone through this and having watched friends do the same.
I would guess a bill of sale and a separate invoice from your installer for engine trannie and his labor should be all they need to issue you, your SB-100 number which is the prize you want to keep your eye on.
If you wait until the installation is complete and then get all the invoices I guarantee you it will be too late!
Yesterday I decided to book an appointment on line for January 2nd. There were NO appointments available that far out. I doubt it seriously others already booked those days to renew their driver's licenses.
Not surprisingly even though the January 2nd. is booked, there are plenty of appointments available in December!!
You can figure out what this means...
SO I went ahead and made an appointment some 75 miles away.
Why do I think all 500 numbers will be gone on January 2nd.?
AS for engine numbers and such, I doubt it dhoti DMV will ask for those. If anyone does it would be CHP and smog referee..
But again, there have been so many variations from one registration to another during 2003, please do not take my word for anything I have posted on the subject.
Turk: I phoned DMV's 800 # today 04 Dec at about 12 noon and recv'd. an appointment on 02 Jan at 9:00 AM for the Simi Valley office. First tried for 0800, then 0830 but they were unavailable; BINGO for 0900. Howard
CA Registration details with a SPF
Linear Mode
