Bringing a Used Cobra Into California

[weselak]

I live in California and found a nice Cobra I'd like to buy. The car was registered in Pennsylvania in 99 as a special construction vehicle. After three calls to the California Air Resource Board I got three different answers on registration. The general feedback is that it can't be brought into the state if it has less than 7500 miles. Does anyone have experiance bringing a previously registered Cobra into California. weselaks@n2.net

Looking for my first Cobra

mark

[Excaliber]

No,,,but I knew a guy who was bringing in a couple of keys,,,,to Los Angeles.





einrE

[xlr8or]

Look into using SB1578 to bring the car in. I think it addresses getting previously registered cars reregistered properly under the same rules as SB100.

[SCOBRAC]

Better hurry... As of Friday Feb. 6th..


What is the Specially Constructed Vehicle Emission Control Program?

Existing law requires most motor vehicles of a model year 1974 and newer to pass a smog check, emissions control inspection, prior to initial registration or transfer of ownership and every second annual renewal.

Specially constructed vehicles do not have a manufacturer assigned model year because they are esentially home-made vehicles. In the past these vehicles were subject to the emissions control requirements applicable to the year of the engine installed in the vehicle and the regular smog inspections per the county where the vehicle was registered. The year of the engine was determined by a Bureau of Automotive Repair (BAR) referee during the initial inspection.

In 2001, Senate Bill 100 passed which allowed the first 500 specially constructed passenger vehicles and pick-up trucks presented for original (initial) registration to DMV to have the year model for emissions control equipment and inspection purposes based on the appearance of the engine or the vehicle as a whole. In addition, if the vehicle or engine does not resemble an established make or year model BAR is required to assign 1960 as the year model for emission control purposes. In 2002, another Senate Bill passed, SB 1578, which allowed previously registered vehicles to be allowed this special consideration by BAR in addition to initial registrations.

What is a SPCNS Certificate of Sequence?

A SPCNS Certificate of Sequence is a form issued by the DMV that is presented to a BAR referee inspection station identifying the vehicle as one of the first 500 eligible for the SPCNS emission control program. Applications for the certificates are available starting January 1 of every year. Once the 500 yearly allotment of certificates has been issued applicants must wait until the next January 1 to apply for a certificate.

Once you have applied for a SPCNS Certificate of Sequence at your local DMV (and there are still certificates available) you will recieve the certificate within 7-10 working days in the mail. The certificate must be presented to the Smog Referee at the time of your smog inspection appointment.

Note: Due to the limited number of SPCNS Certificates of Sequence available, you may wish to submit your application for registration in person at a local DMV office.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As of February 6, 2004,
407 sequence certificates have been assigned.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[SCOBRAC]

CARB is a regulatory body not an enforcement body. They do not control vehicles in this state, they set guidelines for which law may or may not be based. In the case of SB-100 and SB-1578 those are leglative actions which CARB has no say in, nor will they be qualified to give you good information.

The law on any private property (with the exception of firearms some of which MAY NOT be brought into California) is pretty clear. As far as your new vehicle goes please make sure it's a clean car, that is a car not one which left the state with a clouded title due to the former owner tring to pass it off as an "original" car.

Call the DMV with the VIN, and the present owners name. They are very good at telling you on the phone what needs to be done.

[Mike I]

Mark,
I'd very much like to hear whatever you find out as you research this. I may be relocating to the San Diego area (from FL) in the near future and I'd like to have some idea what I'll be up against in that eventuality. My circumstances are different than yours in that my car is currently titled to me here in FL as a '67 replica with no smog equipment (none required) and I would need to retitle it in CA. I have 10K+ miles on the odo, so the 7,500 mile min limit also would not apply. My buddy who lives in Temecula said that I could apply for a one-time exemption, but I'm not sure what kind of rules apply with that.

Please post any info you come up with on this topic, I'll do the same.

Thx,

Mike

[weselak]

I spoke to a guy at the Bureau of Automotive Repair today that understood SB100 and SB1578. Unlike the previous 5 people I spoke to at the DMV or APR. Looks like I need to be one of the first 500 like many of you suggested. Time to stop looking and start buying!

[RedBarchetta]

Mark, here's the deal. I just went through what you are contemplating so I'll spill my knowledge here.

I bought an out-of-state car (Texas) with a super clean title (titled as a '66 Ford with 11 digit VIN). My thinking was pretty simple...go to AAA and smooze the older ladies that work there. They do the car inspection, I pay the correct amount of taxes based on the actual purchase price (keeping things legit), they pass the paperwork onto DMV and ding-ding, the pink slip (Title) gets sent in the mail. Assuming too much was my first mistake.

DMV must have really gone over this one, 'cause they rejected the package and requested a "VIN Verification" with the CHP.
At that exact moment, my heart sank and I knew, I @#$%ing KNEW, that I was going to have to "go by the book" just like everyone else before me.

The CHP will first check to make sure the car isn't "hot", so buyer beware when purchasing a used one. I passed that sniff test and the officer promptly removed ALL underhood tags (including the nice Cobra plate attached by Superformance), and they rivited their own tag on the same place of the front frame crossmember. I might add, a clean installation and all I need to do is fill one hole and touch up with black paint. Oh, and the officer was kind enough to give me back the fire wall tag, though insisting that it should never be placed back there. Okay.... ;-)

Next I decided to "race" to the DMV earlier today, as my appointment was for March 1 and with less than 100 numbers left, I didn't want to chance it and wait. 4 hours later I had my sequence number. Now keep in mind that I had to kindly explain to the clueless DMV worker all about SB100/1578 and I even showed her print screens from the DMV web site to prove my point that this program exists (!). I also had to "hint" to her that it would require her supervisor to contact Sacramento to get the sequence number.

So now I await my certificate in the mail. Then I make an appointment with BAR, they look at the car, out their stamp on the certificate (along with a sticker or two under the hood somewhere), and then I take the whole mess (all the paperwork, about 15 pages or so) back to DMV and finish the process. It's not too terribly difficult, just a BIG FRICKEN HASSLE and you have to educate the DMV along the way. It was the hassle part that shied me away from it to begin with. It's not a tide worth fighting against...go along with the State plan and it will work itself out.

The long and short of it is this. I wouldn't base your buying decision solely on what is left with the 2004 sequence number allocations. I found many nice Cobras for sale in California that were already "SB100 compliant". It's just that they were either the wrong color, slightly out of my price range, or were too "rough" and were just not as clean as I expected. Find the right car and deal with the paperwork afterwards. If you miss the cutoff, just get your paperwork fine tuned and plan on spending January 2nd, 2005 at the DMV.

That's my advice to you. Good luck with your purchase and search!

Regards,

-Deano

[djseed]

Does the DMV still look at the original mfg date of the engine? In other words, if you have an original '66 SO engine installed in a newer roller, can it be registered in CA and exempt from smog?

[Kputz]

A crass observation:
My only experience (thankfully) with California was mid sixties; USMC boot camp, some San Diego bars, and the occasional trip to Tijuana. The weather was warm and pleasant, especially for a boy from Michigan, but there is no amount of pleasant weather that could ever entice me to endure the amount of governmental chain jerking and intrusion that you people seem to accept willingly. Give me any right to carry, Republican dominated, SUV populated, low taxed, **** hole state, below or above the Mason Dixon Line any day. And I can even say this at a time when the tractor bucket will no longer pile the snow any higher. Different strokes evidently. Do any of you ever consider moving??? Anywhere??? Ever?????

[Turk]

Always...

[RedBarchetta]

Originally posted by Kputz



Do any of you ever consider moving??? Anywhere??? Ever?????

To make a long story short, I'm a Florida boy who somehow ended up in So Cal. Unless I win the lotto, I doubt seeing myself retiring here in 15-20 years.

To answer another previous question regarding how the CA DMV works (i.e. VINs), all out-of-state cars brought into CA require a visual vehicle inspection. So whether you go directly to the DMV or a registered affiliate (AAA - Auto Club), they will still fill out their form. My car came with a 17 digit VIN, though only the last 11 digits of that 17 digit stream were reflected on the Title.

According to CA DMV, pre-1982 cars did not have 17 digit VINs. If you look up the VIN for a 1966 Ford Fairlane (or any other Ford car), it will be 11 digits with a specific alpha-numeric sequence denoting point of manufacture, build date, body style and build sequence number.

So the AAA (or DMV) lady will pick up the full 17 digit VIN on her form, and then make you sign a "Statement of Facts" denoting that you are aware of the 11 vs 17 digit discrepancy! That alone triggers the CHP verification. I also believe (my hypothesis) that the CA DMV runs each VIN through an algorythm to determine if the VIN actually fits the car. Using my Ford Fairlane example previously, if the first letter of the VIN for a 1966 Ford does not start with (for example only) a C, F or G, then their computers will kick it out for a VIN verification.

Also, once the DMV sees the car, they will start asking questions ("This is a kit, right?"). Before I started the whole process of buying a Cobra, I convinced myself that registering it outside of the boundaries of SB100 wasn't going to be too much of problem, so long as I had a clean title to start with. Well, I was wrong and I freely admit it. Unless you know someone on the inside (at the DMV), forget about it. Just get in line and get your 1 of 500 sequence numbers, go through the process, and move on. :-)

-Deano

[ava8r]

Originally posted by RedBarchetta


Mark, here's the deal. I just went through what you are contemplating so I'll spill my knowledge here.

Regards,

-Deano

Deano,

Very nice wirte-up. Glad you found the car you were looking for.

See you out there.

AJ

[RedBarchetta]

Originally posted by djseed


Does the DMV still look at the original mfg date of the engine? In other words, if you have an original '66 SO engine installed in a newer roller, can it be registered in CA and exempt from smog?

AJ, thanks for rthe kind words!

djseed, I realized that I didn't quite answer your previous question in full. Speaking for my experience, the DMV and the CHP didn't care about the engine (it was built in '99 or '00 with all new parts). The fact that you are going after complete smog exemption status (the core essence of SB100 and SB1578) is the primary issue at hand. So long as you're not burning lumps of coal in the combustion chamber, BAR is not going to have any issues. All I can say is I hope they enjoy the scent of exhaust vapors from Sunoco 110 racing gas.

[Edley Rondinone]

Originally posted by Kputz


A crass observation:
My only experience (thankfully) with California was mid sixties; USMC boot camp, some San Diego bars, and the occasional trip to Tijuana. The weather was warm and pleasant, especially for a boy from Michigan, but there is no amount of pleasant weather that could ever entice me to endure the amount of governmental chain jerking and intrusion that you people seem to accept willingly. Give me any right to carry, Republican dominated, SUV populated, low taxed, **** hole state, below or above the Mason Dixon Line any day. And I can even say this at a time when the tractor bucket will no longer pile the snow any higher. Different strokes evidently. Do any of you ever consider moving??? Anywhere??? Ever?????

NO. Born and raised here. I am less than an hour from snow-capped peaks, Malibu, Balboa, the Mojave Desert, the Central Valley (well, a LITTLE more than an hour!). I mean, sure, the SB100 and 1578 seems like a hassle, but once you're through, YOU'RE DONE!!! I may be biased, or have lower expectations, but I drove my Cobra today; could have driven it every day this week, and for the next week, too!! In shorts, even!!!

[SCOBRAC]

The DMV doesn't look at squat. They push paper. The CHP verifies the VIN, looks for stolen parts, unsafe, loud or other potential infractions. If none are found you go to the BAR. My BAR (state of california bureau of automobile repair referee) was pretty knowledgable about SB 100 and was polite courteous and well mannered.

That said my 1966 428 somehow got listed on his computer as a 1960 7 litre FERRARI... So no they do not (in all cases verify your engine) they don't need to...

If your car resembles a 1965 ford cobra it is smogged (not titled) as a 1965 ford cobra, regardless of engine. He may use the year of the engine as the basis for his smog test, but as likely as not going to list it as a 1960 FORD (1960 is the "default" year if the BAR guy doesn't look or cannot determine the engine you have)

[SCOBRAC]

This all seem pretty tedious but in the long long ago time the only way to register a component car was to get it inspected as described. The BAR would verify the engine year make and model and you were REQUIRED to have all smog devices installed which came on that engine. e.g. a 1990 302 engine needed EFI, catalytic converters, air flow sensors, 02 sensors etc. You were also required to have your car reinspected every 2 years. Now you don't

Now if you ponied up the cash for a 1965-1968 FE back then and now have to jump through this hoop it sucks a$$. At least you won't need to get it reinspected (until you sell it)

Regards,

[RedBarchetta]

Michael,

Can you briefly tell me what exactly BAR does during their inspection? Are there any prep items I need to handle prior to making an appointment? Appreciate the inputs! And finally, will I still need to have some form of light and brake inspection at a different facility? I just want to know what to expect going forward (FYI, I've already been to the CHP).

Thanks,

-Deano

[Turk]

Deano,
Under SB-100 what BAR does with our car is a joke. At first I thought it was all for money. I thought I had to go there so I pay them their fees. There is NONE. They don't charge a dime.

The car can NOT fail the test! You could be spewing raw gasoline out the side pipes, you will still be getting a green light and will complete your process.

It can't be for any other reason than to gather data, and help down the road to make a case against all the gross polluters.
Otherwise, it is absolutely silly to go to get tested for something you can NOT fail.

TURK

[RedBarchetta]

Turk, thanks. I'm running a mix of 91 pump and 110 Sunoco, so I figured the sniffer test was a moot point anyway. But do I also have to go to a different station for a light and brake check? I bought a used car, so I'm not sure if that still applies. Thanks for the inputs!