Shelby not the first Cobra ACE Bristol

[normo]

There was a discussion a couple of years ago about Shelby originating the name Cobra for his AC. This is a little inaccurate.
An Australian sports car based on the AC Bristol used the Cobra name in 1958.

[TButtrick]

Holy sh!t. Now I have to send all these stupid Cobra books back

[Naumoff]

Originally Posted by normo

There was a discussion a couple of years ago about Shelby originating the name Cobra for his AC. This is a little inaccurate.
An Australian sports car based on the AC Bristol used the Cobra name in 1958.

Do you have any proof? Newspaper or magazine article with date maybe?

[Cal Metal]

http://www.ggw.org/~cac/Mighty_Tin.html


I think it may be a reference to the use of the name, Cobra, as a process for building engines and not a Sports Car. Check out the link below. Crosley was one of the first Sports Cars and this is where the allusion might have come from--the engine, not the car, itself.


http://www.conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z8120/default.aspx

[computerworks]

I remember that anecdote, too, Cal...but is was more for the 'name' of the car, than an actual car...

A popular story is that this name came to him in a dream, but more probably he remembered it from his early racing career when lightweight, sheet-steel copper-brazed engines were used (like in the Mercedes 300 SLR). Fellow American Powel Crosley was the first to take this type of engine into production in the early 1940s and he named it "COBRA" (short for copper-brazed). Engines manufactured accordingly usually had COBRA stamped on the valve cover, and that's where Shelby might have picked up the name.

[Don]

Additional info in support of the engine name:

" This article first came out in two parts in the Crosley Automobile Club Quarterly in December 1976 and March 1977. I believe this article by Jan Eyerman is one of the most complete general histories to be written in a short article. So with ony minor changes from the oringinal two part article it was repeated in the June 1981 Quarterly. "


" For use in the Crosley cars, the engine was detuned to 7.5 to 1 compression ratio (still the highest in the industry) and delivered 26-1/2 horsepower. It was christened the Cobra-from COpper BRazed. The entire block, of 125 stampings weighed only 14 pounds. The crankcase was an aluminum casting for ridgidity and the inside of the block was at first plastic lined and later zinc lined for resistance to rust. The block was held together by press fits, spot welds and crimps prior to brazing in a 2060 degree F furnace. "

[Nedsel]

Well, that settles it. If I want to have an accurate replica, I'm going to have to put one of them CoBra engines from a Crosley in it. And nobody better try to talk me out of it.

[trs900]

I always knew there was another side to the story

[Naumoff]

Well I'm not to sure but I think there is a snake with the name Cobra before Powel Crosely named his engine in 1950.

[Cal Metal]

Now....back to another topic: The Carroll Shelby, "I had a dream" speech.

[Excaliber]

...and he likely DID have a 'dream', quite possibly inspired by the copper brazed equipment he had no doubt seen and been around for years.

[Cal Metal]

I think the "dream" centered around the logo, which was already in existence, if memory serves.

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by Cal Metal

I think the "dream" centered around the logo, which was already in existence, if memory serves.

here's the first-hand explanation:

When the first car arrived in Santa Fe Springs, although it bore the designation CSX0001 (Carrol Shelby Experimental) we already had the name for it. While the machine was on its way from England a stange thing happened.

One night I had a dream in which I saw the name "Cobra" on the front of the new car. I woke up and jotted the name down on a pad which I kept by my bedside - sort of an idea pad - and went back to sleep. Next morning, when I looked at the name "Cobra," I knew it was right. This had to be it. But when I decided to call my car the Cobra, we ran into an unexpected problem while getting the paperwork ready to apply for a copyright.

It suddenly turned up that years before that Crosley had built an engine which they called a "Cobra," though for very different reasons. The little Crosley overhead-camshaft mill had been COppere BRAzed - get the idea? Fortunately, however, it had passed through nine different companies with the engine, rights, and patents, etc., changing hands each time, and not one of those nine successive firms had ever used the name, "Cobra."
It therefore turned out that the name Cobra no longer could be considered as a valid trade name insofar as Crosley was concerned, and we were able to copyright it.

-from The Carrol Shelby Story, November 1965

[mrmustang]

Originally Posted by Cal Metal

Now....back to another topic: The Carroll Shelby, "I had a dream" speech.

And here I was thinking you were alluding to CS dreaming about finding unused CSX3000 series frames in one of his forgotten warehouses


Bill S.

[normo]

I own a 1958 Buchanan Cobra. The compliance plate clearly has COBRA stamped on it. The engine was a simple 4 cylinder but the body was moulded from an ACE Bristol

[Bryan Wilson]

I am in the process of restoring one with my son.
I was built in 1959 in the land down under
Some links,
http://v8vantage.com/Buchanan%20articles.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buchanan_(car)
Cheers,
Bryan

[mrmustang]

Originally Posted by normo

I own a 1958 Buchanan Cobra. The compliance plate clearly has COBRA stamped on it. The engine was a simple 4 cylinder but the body was moulded from an ACE Bristol

Got any pictures

[JBo]

Guys, you might want to read Trevor Legates book "Cobra The First Forty Years" He has some insights into the subject of where "CSX" came from. Besides the pictures are incredible.

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by JBo

Guys, you might want to read Trevor Legates book "Cobra The First Forty Years" He has some insights into the subject of where "CSX" came from. Besides the pictures are incredible.

I don't think that is in any dispute...AC used a S/N convention throughout production cycles. "C" was the third ( as in a-b-C) generation..."S" was for Shelby and "X" was for eXport.

[computerworks]

Originally Posted by mrmustang

Got any pictures

I remember that story, now... thanks for bringing it up, normo.

The first Buchanan made news in the mid-50s with the announcement of a prototype sports car. The Buchanan was an attractively styled coupe with lines right up to date with the latest European fashions. The body was fibreglass and sat on a special chassis using the engine, gearbox and other mechanical parts from the Ford Consul and Zephyr sedans.
The prototype created great interest and generated the inevitable claims, rumors and speculation about production-soon-to-follow. But that was as far as it got...

...There had been rumours, of course, that Buchanan was up to something, yet it still came as a pleasant surprise for enthusiasts when in 1958 first details of the Buchanan Cobra were released.
Intended to be a relatively cheap sportster, the Cobra was designed to borrow as many mass-produced mechanical parts as possible and to be manufactured as a complete car.
The mechanicals were mostly of Standard 10 origin, including the engine, gearbox (with remote gearshift lever from the Standard Pennant model), leaf-sprung rear axle and the wishbones and coils independent front suspension. Not to forget the seats, steering wheel and other miscellanea.
The running gear was carried on a robust ladder-type chassis using box-section main members. Manufactured for Buchanan by Pressed Metal Corp (later involved with the Austin Healey Sprite) the chassis also supported the fibreglass body, which was a thoroughly professional job from nose to tail. The nicely styled shell was more than just a pretty face for it was functional too, and very well finished both outside and within the cockpit.