Brand Name Parts - Page 2

dscott · #21 (**permalink**) 08-10-2007, 09:40 AM

Good Luck to my competitors! For your information I had just driven 22 hours straight to and from Rapid City, SD. Sorry I was tired! I don't need to be here to greet every customer that I've met before. That's why I have employees. I knew you guys would try and switch this to look like my fault. I'm not the one who lies on this site. You guys are the ones that listed my response to your problems before I even had a chance to answer. Craven said things like "no help", "no luck" in one of his first posts in this thread. I never said that. It was his response to questions he didn't allow me to answer.

The reason we caught the grinding was because the rack looked like a Flaming River. Please tell me who in their right mind would grind off a name? You guys also need some new measuring calipers because the rack you brought back has the identical pinion shaft size as 2 other Flaming River racks I have here. The shaft on one of them is round, the other 2 have flats. You are correct in the amount you cut off, it is 7/8". Why did you guys cut off 1 1/4" then? Looks like you need a new tape measure as well.

I do not have a perverse need to be right, I'm the first one to admit to a problem. I do have a need to set the record straight when people lie about me and my company. I don't have a problem apologizing to anyone for problems. You both seem to have a need to find problems with us. We have tried and tried to make you guys happy and the only response we get are lies on this site.

I don't profess to be a savior to anyone. I only have 1 savior and I follow him and nobody else. I go out of my way to help people and I will continue to do so. The only reason you came to the shop was to trade some things. There wasn't anything to settle. I ordered you a new rack, I sent you a new u-joint. What was to settle? I agreed to give you what you wanted.

As far as you not recommending this company to anyone I totally agree. If your circle of friends lies and tries to cheat I sure don't need you. The Customer isn't always right and this is a good example why. I don't play kindergarten rules, I play God's rules, they're much better. Maybe you guys should check it out!

Take the quiz! Which one is NOT a Flaming River rack? Here's a hint, the one in the middle is the one you guys brought back. Here's another hint, 2 of them have flat spots on the pinion and one is round. Here's another hint, 2 of them have Flaming River stamped on them, 1 does not (it was ground off). Another hint, the pinion shaft is the same diameter on all 3 racks. Another hint, 2 of them have 7/8" cut from the tie rods, 1 has 1 1/4" cut off. Another hint, 1 ordered a new rack to replace the "off brand" (the one in the middle) even though I have 10 "other racks" in stock.

And the winner is........... nobody!

You are so right, I do know the truth and it's plain to see for any reasonable person. Life is too short to deal with people like you guys. Make sure you tell everyone about us but make sure you have them come to this site to read the truth. I'm sure that won't happen. Play your games, enjoy your cars!
Don

JAC · #22 (**permalink**) 08-10-2007, 04:13 PM

So send me the rack I supposedly cut too short, even though that was not the issue because it fit, with the $20.00 I gave Pete to ship the replacement. I will ship it to Flaming River and they can ID the rack. If it is theirs I will have them replace the pinion shaft and eat crow. If it is not theirs I will buy a new rack and move on. The rack was in the car all set to go, if the u-joint would have fit correctly, I wouldn't have even questioned it. I don't see in the pictures where the shaft is shorter on mine. I know I had enough threads in the tie rod ends. We even checked it before we cut to see if it was precut so we wouldn't cut it twice. Maybe the tech guy at Flaming River is a liar too, I don't know do I? He told me it wasn't theirs and I believed him. Send me the rack and I'll find out.

JAC · #23 (**permalink**) 08-12-2007, 08:59 AM

Why would you order another one if you have 10 in stock and at least 2 cut to length?

dscott · #24 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 09:25 AM

JAC, If you look at the other 2 racks you can see 1 of them is bent from an accident and the other is used. I have 10 of the "other brand" in stock. I ordered the Flaming River to replace your "other brand". I'm shipping your rack to you today.
Don

fsstnotch · #25 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 10:04 AM

IMHO... as an outsider looking in... anytime a part is advertised as a known brand, it should be included. or at a minimum the purchaser should be notified that it is not in stock and they have options A. or B. as a replacement.

Not to question CRII but since the original poster did not post pics of the rack in question, there is no way to tell that the rack you posted is the one in question.

My question... why didn't you just exchange the U joint if that was the problem? It doesn't amke sense from a business standpoint to replace the rack if the only problem was that the U-joint was too big???

Like I said, I'm an outsider looking in.. my observations from this thread are waht lead me to post.

computerworks · #26 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 10:31 AM

fsstnotch...

This thread concerns a pretty rough issue between the two parties.

I have been tempted several times to shut it down and suggested that it be resolved offline.. but since some strong statements have been made publicly, by both parties, I chose to let it run it's course and allow each side to have their say.

It appears to be coming to a close, with a resolution that might indeed satisfy both parties...publicly...then we can retire this thread.

Thus, I respectfully ask that those with questions for either party ask them off line. Let's leave the thread for the two parties to peacefully resolve their issue and not generate side trips, or prolong this incident.

It's a shame it got this far...but if it can be resolved in good faith openly...then the forum served it's members.

Thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator

dscott · #27 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 11:14 AM

We did replace the u-joint but JAC was convinced the pinion was undersized. We also offered to replace the rack. JAC decided that the original rack we sent him was not a Flaming River rack. That was possible and I did not question his desire to have a new rack. After he returned the rack to us we discovered that his rack was a Flaming River but the name had been ground off. He had also talked to someone at Flaming River and they told him all their racks had a round pinion, the one he received from us did not. The person at Flaming River was wrong because I have another Flaming River rack here and it has a flat on the pinion. He also stated the pinion was undersized but it is the same as 2 other Flaming River racks I have here. I always take the side of the customer and gladly send them a replacement if they are not happy. I ordered a new Flaming River rack for him.

JAC has posted many times that we would not help him but that is not true. We were always good to him and tried our best to resolve any issues that came up. I did not question him when he wanted the rack replaced.

I must also state that we have the right as a manufacturer to substitute parts of equal or greater value. I can't always get the parts I need in a timely manner so I order from different companies. This isn't to reduce my cost in any way and substitute inferior product. I buy from companies that I have wholesale accounts with to keep my costs down. I actually pay more for the other brands as a rule. We have kept our pricing the same on our kits since 1990. Everything we use in the manufacture has gone up in price. I can only reduce my costs by "buying in" to suppliers and purchasing in quantity. Many of these companies require a "buy in" minimum of $5,000 to $10,000. So my best pricing comes from these companies.

When JAC returned the rack and we discovered the name had been ground off my only conclusion is that they are for some reason trying to make us look like idiots by selling poor quality products and telling them it's something else. Why would I take a new perfectly good rack and grind off the name. I'm not in to wasting money to make a customer look wrong. What purpose would that serve? JAC said this rack was in a Flaming River box. I don't have any extra boxes for racks and you sure can't buy boxes from Flaming River.

Our frames require that 7/8" be cut from the inner tie rod. They cut theirs 1 1/4" . This rack is identical to 2 other Flaming River racks that I have here. The other racks I buy are totally different.

JAC has had the mindset that we are purposely trying to rip him off. We are not. We did have several backorders that took us some time to fill but these are all from outside vendors and unfortunately I have no control over them. As an example I had rear disc brake kits on order from Ford SVO for 6 months before we received anything.

JAC has received everything he ordered from us and we have tried our best to do whatever he wants within reason. At some point you say enough is enough. I got to that point when I saw the rack he returned. We just can't seem to please him.

JAC likes to post on this site before he even contacts us for a solution. Is that right? I should at the very least have the opportunity to resolve an issue before he posts and tries to make us look bad.

The one thing that I believe in all of this is that most of the complaining and accusations are probably coming from the person that's building his car. JAC seems to be a reasonable man but I think he is caught in the middle and reacting to other people.

As a manufacturer I would be stupid to loose customers based on a part that cost under $200. If you read my responses to the original post you can see I have tried to please them even though they posted lies which by the way were never retracted even though he admitted on the phone he posted in haste before he talked to me. So I just sit back and let him post over and over about how badly he has been treated, how he doesn't get any customer support, how we sell him inferior parts, and I don't get a chance to defend myself and my company. I think not. I have the same right to respond and show my perspective after all other options are used.

I don't like being called a liar and a cheat because I'm not one. I believe in Christian values and that means treating people with respect and honesty. I go out of my way to try and please people and provide a good product at a fair value. Do we have problems sometimes, of course, but all I can do is remedy the problems and move forward.

JAC has decided to send the rack to Flaming River and I think that's a good idea. That will resolve any question as to the origin of the rack.

I truly feel bad that this situation has escalated to this point but I couldn't see any other alternative. I don't like accusing customers of trying to cheat us but the facts seem obvious in this situation. I don't know why they would have went to this extreme to try and prove a point. I just kept trying to resolve the issue with him in a professional way. He just seemed insistant that we were trying to pull a fast one and decide the best way to handle the problem was by posting here. Unfortunate for all involved.
Don

Excaliber · #28 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 11:50 AM

It's fairly common in the business world to exchange one brand of part for another based on availability. It has happened to me numerous times over the years. While I prefer the 'name brand' I thought I would get I've never had a problem with a substitution.

I recently ordered a camshaft for a Healey motor I'm building. The substituted a later engine model cam instead of the one I specifically ordered. I talked to tech support and it became clear I was getting a product equal to or better than what I orginially ordered, I'll keep it.

I could have waited who knows how long for the 'back ordered' cam to come in if I insisted on having the one I originally ordered...

fsstnotch · #29 (**permalink**) 08-13-2007, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by computerworks

fsstnotch...

This thread concerns a pretty rough issue between the two parties.

I have been tempted several times to shut it down and suggested that it be resolved offline.. but since some strong statements have been made publicly, by both parties, I chose to let it run it's course and allow each side to have their say.

It appears to be coming to a close, with a resolution that might indeed satisfy both parties...publicly...then we can retire this thread.

Thus, I respectfully ask that those with questions for either party ask them off line. Let's leave the thread for the two parties to peacefully resolve their issue and not generate side trips, or prolong this incident.

It's a shame it got this far...but if it can be resolved in good faith openly...then the forum served it's members.

Thanks
ron
ClubCobra Moderator

AGREED!!!!!