rumor control--has SAAC lost its use of Shelby name?

[jmimac351]

Source: http://www.saac.com/press_release_112507.htm

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SAAC Press Release

November 25, 2007 - Sharon, CT.

SAAC is very proud of its numerous accomplishments over the past 33 years and is looking forward to a bright future for the many years ahead.


The strength of the club is its 5,000 loyal members and the dedicated staff of volunteers who share a passion for the exciting cars built by Shelby American. They all understand the value of an independent car club run by enthusiasts for enthusiasts, as opposed to a club managed by a company whose objective is to sell automobiles, parts, automotive services and merchandise to its members. The company- run club is always vulnerable to the inevitable changes in corporate personnel, budgets and marketing strategies. On the other hand, the independent enthusiast club is financed by its members’ dues and is only accountable to them. It always has their best interests in mind.

One of SAAC’s most important missions is to protect the integrity of the marque against the dishonest, the revisionists and the counterfeiters. Over the decades, as a result of tens of thousands of volunteer man- hours, SAAC has amassed a comprehensive data base of information on each Shelby vehicle. SAAC has assisted countless owners verifying the authenticity and history of their cars. The club has protected many Shelby enthusiasts non-members from being victimized by dishonorable and deceitful individuals and will continue to do so. The data is the basis of the club’s registry which is published every ten years and contains information gathered since the previous edition was printed. This ongoing effort is greatly responsible for the high values of the cars because current and future owners have confidence in the integrity of the history and authenticity of the cars.

Regrettably, Carroll Shelby has announced that he will not be renewing SAAC’s licensing agreement to use his name in conjunction with the operation of the club. SAAC has never been given a reason for this termination. Among other things, Shelby has demanded the handing over of all documents regarding the registry of all Shelby vehicles by SAAC since January 1, 1996. Please see the attached letter from Mr. Shelby's lawyers, M. Neil Cummings & Associates: http://www.saac.com/cummings.htm

Initial indications from SAAC’s legal counsel are that Shelby’s many demands are without legal merit. As a result, SAAC has no choice other than to vigorously defend the clubs’ and its members’ proprietary information, property and rights.

In order to properly respond to Mr. Shelby's demands, SAAC has established a legal defense fund. Make no mistake: the body of information on these cars that SAAC members have contributed and its registrars have compiled is all that separates the originals from the fakes. Without tight control of this information, it would be impossible for anyone to ascertain which cars were legitimate and which were not. Rather than causing all cars to continue to increase in desirability and value, they would all plummet. We have not worked for 33 years to suddenly allow this to happen. Likewise, for all SAAC members, this is not a tennis match where you can afford to sit on the sidelines and dispassionately watch the match. The club needs each member to assist in its defense by donating to the defense fund.

We know we are on the right side of this. Unfortunately, it takes more than just knowing you are right. You have to have solid counsel appear with you in court. And in our legal system that has a price. If you believe in what the club is doing SAAC needs your support by way of a donation to the legal defense fund. There is no minimum amount. Donations can be made by check (payable to "SAAC Legal Defense Fund") or by Visa or MasterCard (click here to contribute online): http://www.saac.com/LDF.htm

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is when good men do nothing." - Edmund Burke

SAAC will continue to serve its members through its national award winning publications, regions, member services, on-line forum and national convention. The club is greatly appreciative of the steadfast support and dedication of its members, volunteers and sponsors.

Ken Eber, Rick Kopec, Howard Pardee

SAAC National Directors

[dynoroom]

WOW! Who'd a thought...

This sure brings it back on topic.

[Excaliber]

While some have been in denial about this law suit, and it has been brought to our attention several times in this thread, with this latest post, there can now be no doubt.

I have always been a Shelby supporter, but forced to take a stand, and that clearly seems to be the case here, I will support SAAC. To wit, there is no way in hell I would join the 'new' Shelby Club.

Amy, with great respect I must say, I hope you are blushing over this dastardly deed of greed.

[Power Surge]

Wow.

[mrmustang]

Originally Posted by Power Surge

Wow.

DITTO

[CSX 4027]

CSX 4027 is on auto reply while on vacation.

....................In Switzerland

[lineslinger]

Looks like SAI's corporate power play turned out to be the proverbial turd in the punch bowl.
Let the thread continue. WOW.

[What'saCobra?]

With respect to both parties:

It is more than regrettable for SAAC to use the Burke quote in this context. It is a sign of an amateurish lack of negotiating skills. It hands CS all he needs to reach into the ever-deep coffers of FORD skills and funds to get all the legal and financial assistance he needs to "win".

It also makes wise men blanche when trying to decide which party is the more wise, honest or fair. SAAC ought not descend to the mud and name-slinging that will naturally flow from this disagreement if left to hot-heads.

Eventually, the parties must enjoin each other and find mutual satisfaction, or mutual suffering. It will happen. Money will flow from FORD to SAAC ownership to make this happen positively. It will not be larger if insult is added to the “injury”; it will likely be smaller.

The purchase price might hover between 3 and 5 million USD. Perhaps more, if insult isn’t a deductible.

It isn’t sensible to tempt FORD to spend one or two million on legal fees, by driving them to the pisoir. Recall that FORD’s lawyers are perhaps already on retainer. BIG retainer.

Let the “other” drive their audience away with ignorant slams and incompetent internal communications. Keep it clean. Never pick up a tar-baby.

It’s more profitable. It is also more honorable.

When we claim the other party is “evil” for perhaps not following the terms of a verbal or less than perfectly documented long past agreement about “materials”, precisely the same as we have preferred to remember it, honor is implied as valuable.

Resolve to act accordingly and with more common sense.

Perhaps SAAC have not spent 5 or more years in very expensive litigation during which it consumed much of their waking hours, just to lose due to simple and initial error.

[RedCSX1]

Ouch! Looks like a fairly tight contract. SAAC is certainly the underdog in this. I will say that I am almost certain that very few here know the whole story. With respect to both parties this is where I will make my exit.

[Power Surge]

I haven't really commented on this subject as of yet, but I would like to comment now....

I do not belong to SAAC, and I have not joined Team Shelby. I never joined SAAC solely out of laziness, because you can't join online. I was planning to do so in the near future. I was also planning to join Team Shelby. I really did not feel any alliance to either one. I am an enthusiast for the cars. I want to be part of something that joins other enthusiasts together.

After reading that legal letter from Shelby to SAAC, I must say that I am very dissapointed to see it. Honestly, it sends the message to people that Shelby really does not care about the owners/enthusiasts. If Shelby really cared about the people, they would work WITH SAAC to keep everything going, rather than to try to kill SAAC off for Shelby's own benefit.

And I can understand that this may be a business decision, but I think this decision is going to backfire on Shelby. I would gaurantee that you'll have WAY more people NOT join Team Shelby because of what they are doing to SAAC, than you will have members join.

I would have supported both entities no problem. Now, I am not so sure.

[dynoroom]

Originally Posted by What'saCobra?

It isn’t sensible to tempt FORD to spend one or two million on legal fees, by driving them to the pisoir. Recall that FORD’s lawyers are perhaps already on retainer. BIG retainer.

How much time and money did Shelby cost Ford in the fight for the Cobra name a decade ago? My how times change....

[daltondavid]

Originally Posted by What'saCobra?

With respect to both parties:

It is more than regrettable for SAAC to use the Burke quote in this context. It is a sign of an amateurish lack of negotiating skills.

Who are you to Quote Samuel Adams at the end of every one of your posts and then fail to apply his message to this very situation?? You are reading too deeply into the wrong part of SAAC's Reply.

[What'saCobra?]

Perhaps i am too stupid to see how Adams' quote applies to this situation. Shelby/FORD have at least two types of private property at risk here.

The papers and the protected logos/trade copy are both private property Adams would strive to protect both from the King and from conversion without compensation.

This does not mean the case is settled, for perhaps SAAC has theory better than the compromised issues currently visible.

SAAC have acknowledged both are Shelby's. In published writings.

i am reading the SAAC reply in plain English and see a foolish insult, which can be of no good benefit to SAAC in either the short or long run.

Which part of the reply would you suggest reading more carefully?

Insulting a FORD partner and then asking for a legal defense fund contribution certainly doesn't seem to be the best way to get people exactly warmed-up to the idea of compromise. With those antics, IMHO, the fund will be indeed necessary.

i had refrained from criticizing the Fund thingy, but it does seem rather Monica to me. Isn't the SAAC a for-profit corporation, mostly owned by the investor/directors? Rather than sending them money to support their use of lawyers to help them retain others property (to whichever items), wouldn't it be more helpful to advise them to restrain themselves, rather than risk any donations on perhaps preventable lawyer's fees?

You did note the part where i suggested that FORD has not competently communicated to their corporate partners, viz our dear Ms Amy? Hung out to dry, was she?

Should we similarly donate to the OJ defense fund, to help him keep the properties he removed, to which he may have had ownership at one time?
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Ps: only my more recent posts contain Adams' quote. The more pacifist/chicken-hearted/BHS's i see claiming we have lost this war, the more convinced i remain that Adams' comment remains appropriate to our times.

[daltondavid]

Originally Posted by What'saCobra?

Perhaps i am too stupid to see how Adams' quote applies to this situation.

Thats because you refuse to stand in my shoes for just a minute and see how they fit.

Which part of the reply would you suggest reading more carefully?

The Long part, just before the Quote that got you so upset you wasted a good $100 Dollars or so of your Legal knowledge in your response.

i had refrained from criticizing the Fund thingy, but it does seem rather Monica to me. Isn't the SAAC a for-profit corporation, mostly owned by the investor/directors? Rather than sending them money to support their use of lawyers to help them retain others property (to whichever items), wouldn't it be more helpful to advise them to restrain themselves, rather than risk any donations on perhaps preventable lawyer's fees?

Apparently SAAC's Advice given to them by legal counsel differs from your thoughts. Thingy?? Monica?? are you a Democrat??

You did note the part where i suggested that FORD has not competently communicated to their corporate partners, viz our dear Ms Amy? Hung out to dry, was she?

AHHH finally something we can agree on.

Ps: only my more recent posts contain Adams' quote. The more pacifist/chicken-hearted/BHS's i see claiming we have lost this war, the more convinced i remain that Adams' comment remains appropriate to our times.

Which War do you speak of??I am a Proud Philadelphian and do not Assume to know everything, butif it is the IRAQ war you make mention of, I still support our Troops and the mission they were sent on!

[Jamo]

Certainly a subject worthy of discussion, but we're going to be watching this thread closely.

BTW Whatthehey, I've been a negotiator for thirty years...what the he!! playbook are you reading from?

[What'saCobra?]

Good counsel advises me not to argue with a vastly experienced but occasionally distempered moderator/negotiator with a trigger-finger on the entry switch to this forum. Considering that sage admonition, i have frequently found the "playbook" of common sense worth consulting from time to time during more idle moments in the middle of the night.

Even occasionally, i perform better when i am closely watched.

A negotiator that would approve an out of place, somewhat obtuse but clear and scandalous reference to the "evil" of his antagonist in a public press release would rarely be considered judicious. Gratuitous insults are rarely signs of shrewedness and business acumen, but rather the product of impatience, lack of business judgement and temperamental incompetence. Like swearwords, insults are frequently documentation of fear, a loose-cannon attitude regarding public restraint and a cavalier disregard for a winning strategy.

i have previously commented on the considerable service to Shel's public image and that of his wonderful cars, caused though the good efforts of SAAC, that need not be repeated. It is worth repeating here, however, that he has graced their events in their favor as a highlight many many times for years. They have earned considerable part-fortunes on their automotive business dealings thereby, some more than others.

The parties have argued previously. At length. They have made-up when Shel' has calmed down and they have climbed down at least in part. They will argue again. i think it is one of Shel's hobbies.

But, this time is very different. FORD's many billions of "Mustang" sales weigh somewhat in the balance. Right or wrong, FORD will be right, just like in 1964, 1966, 1967 etc.

While Shel' and FORD have picked fights in the past that were Quixotian in their famously vainglorious posturing (such as the Angliss/FORD/Shelby affair of the "lost 427 chassis from AC"), this contest just doesn't strike me as one of them. Just my opinion, though.

There are far more than a hundred thousand new under-30 Mustang buyers out there that will prove FORD right. Shel' will help them achieve those goals.

Remember to whom FORD brought the newly completed FORD GT for his imprimatur. Remember whose jillions of photographs were published world-wide leaning on the car. How many SAAC members, investors, directors or owners can command 250 USD for his signature on a glove-box lid?

Which way do you think the media will fall on this issue? Do they wish to risk Shel's or FORD's approbation? Who has the clout and why?

Many (me) might think such a public insult was unfair to the old man, however a public figure and deeply argumentative Shel' might be on these and other issues. While Dame Fortune has not always showered her blessings on the man, she certainly does at the moment and he has rarely lacked Fame's heady kiss.

Will the other driver in this audience that has a similar winning record please step forward? Will the other businessman that produces inked copy to the multitudes measured in millions of square feet please weigh in? Will the other spokesman for the sale of perhaps several billions USD of performance automobiles (and perhaps several + more billions USD in the future) please speak up?

Implying Shelby's business affairs are "evil" lessens the SAAC from their "little guy against the billions" position and elevates them to the "little stinkers" level, for no risible benefit. The comment is gratuitous, ineffective, foolish, knavish and potentially costly. Remove it from the public press release and the tone of the release becomes far more a balanced and matter-of-fact presentation of their otherwise at least reasonably debatable position.

SAAC need not similarly play the Quixotian game-card. Do not expect too many owners to take a public distancing from the Shelby who "made" their cars. Us vs Them only works if SAAC have pristine-clean skirts.

The FORD PR and legal machine has only just barely begun.

But, against 30 years of experience, what does a young guy like me know?

Just my opinion.
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i worked and played for many years in offices on Rittenhouse Square in PHL, so i retain a warm spot for both the city and most of its citizens. (Eddie G. Rendell isn't one of them, though.) But, i like PHL mostly for its restaurants opened since the 1976 Bi-Centennial, when i lived on Locust Street, downtown.
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No electrons were harmed or even wasted during this brief presentation. They all remain happily spinning in their newly self-chosen Ort clouds.

[Mark IV]

Originally Posted by daltondavid

are you a Democrat??

Trust me, I get emails from V and he is NO Democrat!!!


The SAAC/SHELBY situation is rather like the "Cobra" name battle of years ago, I seem to remember someone being quoted in AUTOMOBILE magazine as saying "this is one of those rare situations where BOTH parties can come out looking like assholes"

Rick

[Don]

As a general reference to any situation, by either or both parties seeking a mutually acceptable resolution to conflict :

From an opinion article, Matters of Moment by Andrew Frankel, in December MotorSports, regarding the McLaren and Ferrari controversy:

"..........rarely has anyone ended up looking good while trying so hard to make someone else look bad. ".

[1ntCobra]

Well this thread seems to be suddenly back on track with its subject line.

What'saCobra? mentions money flowing from FORD to SAAC. For what purpose to buy out (and maybe shut down) SAAC for their registry information?

A while ago I thought that Amy said something like SAAC could continue to do their registry. Maybe SAAC could return the original documents, but keep copies for the SAAC's registry purposes? It does not make sense to me that the Shelby people think they should get access to the SAAC collected registry information since 1996 though. What would make the Shelby people think they would have any right to get that information?

I wonder what SAAC's intentions are? From their press release, it sounds like SAAC is concerned that Team Shelby could take over what SAAC has been doing, but could easily be shutdown and then where would we be? I agree. But what does SAAC expect to get from this? The right to keep their registry research (to me, I would assume Shelby has no right to that anyway). Maybe a license renewal?

And asking for all licensed items to be turned over to Shelby? That seems ridiculous. SAAC should be able to sell off all of their tshirts, posters, etc. prior to the license expiration. Or perhaps they could have a big bonfire. Instead of a fire sale, perhaps SAAC can sell their remaining items as limited editions.

I hope that Shelby and SAAC can find a way to get along and let SAAC continue to do their thing.

[imagine2frolic]

Shelby seems to have knocked any, and all replicas. Although he himself produces a replica. Yet he wants to sell not only his signature, but watches to engines to those who are enthusiast, for the Cobra. Knowing full well there are only a 1000+ owners of originals.

With so many enthusiast for what he has produced. I would think it beneficial to embrace all who admire his creation. It matters not that your son has divorced his wife. You can still welcome her with open arms. The benefits of welcoming all enthusiast will only be an asset to CS. I can only see benefits in making the family that much larger.