rumor control--has SAAC lost its use of Shelby name?

[1ntCobra]

Amy,

I was reading your magazine. I think I only saw one mention of the Series One cars so far. The Dodge cars were certainly mentioned for a few paragraphs in one of the articles. Did you just run out of room to cover the Oldsmobiles? I would have thought they would have gotten more coverage than the Dodges as they were the only Shelby cars built from a clean sheet of paper and had supposedly had supercar performance.

[csx700?]

SAAC is much like the "kit car" industry that shelby wants to run out of town. It wasn't shelby that kept the interest in these cars going, it was the enthusiasts & clubs. Thank you Carroll for being partially responsible for the cobra being produced but you left it for dead long ago..........others saw to it that it continued to live on. Look at it like a parent that put it's child up for adoption..........it's gone to a good home where it is being well taken care of!

[daltondavid]

Originally Posted by pipehunter

Another item is interesting as well. There was mention in one of the posts of Planet Cobra and a Mr. Stephen Becker of Atlanta, GA opening a Shelby dealership. Is that the same Mr. Becker mentioned on the NorCal SAAC website in a post allegedly attributed to Carroll Shelby? Am I wrong, or do I remember seeing this in the SAAC newsletter? Here is the quote from the Norcal SAAC website:

"Effective immediately I, Carroll Shelby, am no longer associated or involved, in business matters or any other activities, with Mr Steven G. Becker, LLC, self-described "Deal Maker" from Suwanee, GA. Further, I retract my letter of introduction dated August 1,1999 which he publishes on his website.

Signed, Carroll Shelby
October 10, 2001"


Amy, can you respond? Many thanks.

No she really cannot comment on that one....First off she was at Hot Wheels then. secondly as it is now, Stephen is Beneath her. But if Stephen ever gets hs way, that situation will change....Watch out for the Red Devil Amy, he's got his eye on you....

[Excaliber]

Just recieved notice I was high bidder on the new magazine from Shelby, cost me $31 with shipping.

...excuse me now, I gotta go shower, feel all dirty somehow...

[What'saCobra?]

Nedley
If i gave you the blueprints to the car for your use, i would certainly expect my blueprints back, unless i specifically said at the time you could keep them. But, nothing prevents you from making quality copies for your own use as the information is now public and that publication was accepted by CS et al. To further the objectives of open source availability of data to aid in preventing deceptions, you might separately publish those docs.

IMHO, you are the only person who has taken that Cobra raw material and created an important product and service with the use of same. Your work and imagination were important and the critical value-added to not only create both the product and service, but particularly to "police" the various frauds that continue to be foisted on a moderately unsophisticated public. SAAC certainly retains ownership of the publishing of that data, IMO; but that might be contended. My only point was that contention is more likely when one picks a public fight and uses charged language gratuitously.

i realize that others have managed other car histories in the Registry.

Turk
You may certainly criticize my lack of insider knowledge. Or anything else you wish. But, at some point this story will get a reality check and we shall see what we shall see. i see the lawyer's letter as only an initial attempt at getting what Shel' thinks is his own property back. Is there a previously initial letter and are you privy to it?

If it is true that SAAC have not even responded to two letters, have purposely avoided publishing a more conciliatory initial lawyer's letter and have firstly responded with this amateurish press release, SAAC isn't the good guy and won't be found such by most folks. Seeking defense funds from the public and not making all those communications available might be quite a further error of judgement.

It is often quite inconvenient to have to hold elections, just to prove the poll results. Legal cases are frequently similar, right up to the day of court.

Perhaps i haven't learned much about this issue yet compared to the more cognizant and inside informed amongst us. You seem certain, so i accept that at the moment, as a given. Hopefully you will keep us all up to speed with your insider knowledge, to keep us from going too far astray. Your forecast of the outcome of this contest will be read with interest by this plebeian.
--------------------

Just because FORD and Shelby have current "issues" doesn't mean FORD will let their one-man PR personality be "screwed-over", even by himself. Too much future at stake.

i watched the British side of the Angliss/Shelby affair from close near-daily proximity in Weybridge, as a valued frequent customer and friend and knew Shel' was blowing smoke from his asymptote. And so it came to pass. i similarly watched the Angliss/FORD argument and knew sufficient Brit law to be confident that Angliss would prevail in the UK. And so it came to pass.
i also forecasted that the British public and automotive trade-press would not support FORD's attack on Angliss. And so it came to pass. FORD came away looking very bad and they deserved it.

i caution SAAC again to get better PR advice on this (not me, i am biased both ways) and act with wisdom, sans smart-assymetry. The public will not smile on anyone that sullies their heros for no good reason.

For example, observe Hollywood's current attempt to denigrate our troops (and thereby the President) with the soldier's rape of a 14 year-old Iraqi girl using mega-star power and cubic money. Quite differently than Henry Nostrilitis Waxman's salivating spittle-mouth, the public are staying away from Hollywood's anti-war BullPuckey in droves. People do not want to see truly ugly, insulting and unfair behavior as cover for political lies and political purposes.

Raising the argument to stratospheric and public heights is not an effective opening strategy or gambit with a genuine hot-head. He will see your bid and raise it just for the excitement. Remember, he is a race winner that bet his life on the outcome of those races, with no quarter given or opportunity missed. Even his lawyers likely do not understand who they have as a client.

It will be interesting, to be sure, but i wouldn't take on anyone that can publish their point of view by the 55-gallon barrels of ink and megawatts of TV interviews, without serious supporting contractual & legal documentation, which has been at least unrevealed to date.

It is less likely to re-establish the status quo ante bellum if the antagonist is convinced we are grossly unfair or/and congenital liars-by-omission, not worth re-establishment.

[Excaliber]

Pssstt, Whatsa, I think your referring to JAMO, haven't seen Turk around these parts for awhile...

[What'saCobra?]

Serious apologies to Mr. Turk. And i suppose also to Mr. Jamo, somehow, for my attribution error. i need more rest. G'night EX.

Say, what are REAL's opinions about this new wrinkle? If the Registry is no longer published by SAAC (which i hope does not come to pass), will the "new" one be "REAL"?

[fsstnotch]

Ex, did you seriously pat $31 for that mag?! I could have had my wife send you a copy for about $9 maybe? I live in a small town! They still had maybe 4 or 5 copies when I picked mine up last week and they weren't going anywhere!

[amy B]

guy,
Let's start over, I did not mislead anyone. I am sai and CSL cancelled the license. I knew the license was not being renewed. But I didn't have the perticulars, just that letters were sent and never responded too, even today still no offical response just the public posts.

I am not Carroll I do know he has been unhappy for years and a licensee should consult a licensor on the like all thing, even some things , anything, or even ask if he is happy with the way things are. etc, Somewhere in this someone forgot to check with the licensor and make them part of the process. And when Carroll has said he was unhappy, maybe someone should have delt with it instead of ignoring him. I have said from the begining all it probably would taken was a return call .

If Carroll is asking for stuff he probably thinks he has a right to it. That's not for me to comment on.

On the other question,the new site launches injanuary and will include aswell as our new monthly newsletter will address in detail ss1,vintage shelbys, dodge, etc. The special book was in partnership with mustangmag

Now on other sites and clubs we are talking to some since we agree some are better and have been doing it longer, we want the best for our members, owners and enthusiasts.


If i missed any questions my apologies i am on my phone and its a bit hard I will answer the rest tomorrow

Amy

[Bill Kesner]

Blah....blah....blah.....

There are always (2) sides to every story for some reason or another. If everyone was a little more open minded to both sides between SAAC and Shelby, this thread would not be filled with one sided opinions.

Let the two parties work this out themselves. This is just a hobby for many of us, It is not our life. Businesses change and move on. Surely there are more important issues going on around us than this.

- Bill -

[RodKnock]

I haven't looked at the number of shares outstanding or the type of shares available to the public, but maybe SAAC can find some venture capital around the country and buy SAI and its subsidiaries at that paltry $0.26 per share and install their own board of directors and stop the lawsuit. Unfortunately, I don't see much upside for anyone out there.

Is it time for a reverse split? Sheesh, the lawsuit could bankrupt SAI.

[427sharpe]

Well, well, well. If it hasn't hit the fan quite yet, the poop is certainly in the air. I have a stake in this argument (albeit a small one) in that I am an original owner. I cannot begin to think what will happen if CS takes over the registry of the cars he abandoned when the cash spigot shut off. I am sure he would sell as many copies of the 60's registry as possible, but he would not suffer the pains to research, update and correct those future editions. And what of CS's lack of moral compass in the cars themselves? Remember all of those 'lost' frames?!?!? If CS controls the registry, will he find 'lost' GT500s? KR's? Cobras again? And when CS' interest wanes yet again, what then? Who will be there to guard the breed? What damage will be done to the original owners by CS? He doesn't give a rats patoot about us anymore UNTIL we mean some cash flow. I have had enough of the man, and wholeheartedly endorse SAAC in this contest. Sorry, Amy. I think you are an honorable person, but I cannot join CS 'Team'.
The $50 is better sent to SAAC's LDF. Perhaps it has come time for the little guys to enter the fray....maybe a class action lawsuit by original owners who may be damaged by the loss of SAAC.

[Jamo]

Whatsa...if you fail to distinguish between Turks and Armenians, you do need some rest.

I'm experienced enough not to opine as to what might occur at so early a stage and without knowing all that should be known. That is for uninformed talking heads, or tapping fingers, as it were. I'm also experienced enough to know that folks commenting on what tactics should be used by looking only at what is known, generally fail to tactically consider what might not be known...rather embarrassing at a negotiation table or before the bar at a later stage.

You can type for eternity as to why you think you know something because you saw a circle from a "near-daily proximity"...it's really not being a part of the circle, is it. And now Hollywood and international politics somehow affect the very essence of our appreciation of these little bastardized cars. You've really run out of tantilizing tidbits for pleading with folks to pay attention to your oft-repeated ramblings...and then, at long last, you finally suggest that you might be lacking a few watts to see what the dark hides.

When one realizes their zipper is down, it is best to proceed carefully so as not to catch oneself on the way up.

[1ntCobra]

Originally Posted by RodKnock

I haven't looked at the number of shares outstanding or the type of shares available to the public, but maybe SAAC can find some venture capital around the country and buy SAI and its subsidiaries at that paltry $0.26 per share and install their own board of directors and stop the lawsuit. Unfortunately, I don't see much upside for anyone out there.

Is it time for a reverse split? Sheesh, the lawsuit could bankrupt SAI.

I highly doubt that the number of publicly traded shares is a large enough percentage of the total shares to gain any sort of controlling interest or have any impact on the voting at the shareholder meeting. The publicly traded shares are probably not even the same classification as the shares held by Shelby and other major shareholders.

[Dan Stryffeler]

1ntCobra,

On the chassis blueprint example you posted, it would all depend on what conditions were agreed to at the time of the exchange.

I guess that I should rephrase my earlier questions... I have no experience in any type of licensing agreements. I have seen employment contracts and non-compete agreements that were not worth the paper they were written on, so...

1) Would a well written license agreement (typically?) contain clauses regarding disposition of merchandise after the license has expired?

2) If information, not in public domain, is lent for research would a agreement (typically?) be put into place regarding the use of the material?

I emphasized 'typically' because I don't know if there is such a thing as a typical contract - probably isn't...

- Dan

[Mark IV]

I just put $2.00 on 33 pages. This turkey ain't done yet!

Jamo, Whatsa probably confused you with Turk as he still is one of the top ten poster.....and he hasn't been here for two years! Trust me, Whatsa was close enough and properly connected to know the details about theAngliss/Ford steel cage match.

There are some people lurking here who have stories that could curl your hair! (assuming you have sufficent hair!)

Rick

[Buzz]

Shelby and SAAC had a protracted philosophical falling-out on how the registry should be run and what it should include. The license is up for renewal and The Old Man has had enough and is playing his trump card. Judgements? Fallout? Motives? I guess we'll just have to wait and see...

P.S. For those that are worried, relax - It's near certain that life will go on after all this is done.

[computerworks]

...ummm, Buzz...it feels like it's time for a sketch to lighten up the atmosphere.
:-)

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by computerworks

...ummm, Buzz...it feels like it's time for a sketch to lighten up the atmosphere.
:-)

Seconded. All those in favor? Motion carried.

Buzz...do your thing.

[Jamo]

Originally Posted by Mark IV

I just put $2.00 on 33 pages. This turkey ain't done yet!

Jamo, Whatsa probably confused you with Turk as he still is one of the top ten poster.....and he hasn't been here for two years! Trust me, Whatsa was close enough and properly connected to know the details about theAngliss/Ford steel cage match.

There are some people lurking here who have stories that could curl your hair! (assuming you have sufficent hair!)

Rick

Look at my ass...trust me, I have hair. Some of it has been curled by what I've seen concerning Vegas over the past few years...yet, I would not attempt to suggest it dictates what happens now.

I watched my wife give birth three times...I still don't know what it actually feels like (nor do I want to), and all three were somewhat different. From that, I am quite positive I cannot tell a pregnant lady what her delivery will be like other than there will evidently be pain involved.

My point has been and continues to be this...folks don't know everything that is involved, and yet they are boldly offering criticizms and suggestions to both sides of this dispute based upon inuendo and conjecture of what they think is happening. Yes...fun to speculate, but defending particular speculation is usually a fool's game.