west coast cobra running hot

[Gerry K]

Brent:
Do you have the aluminum radiator with a single fan and aluminum shroud? I had
the same problem with my West Coast (533 cu.in. BB engine). The fan supplied
was pulling air thru the radiator but the pitch of the blades were turning in the wrong
direction for max air flow. I reversed the wires causing the air to blow thru the
radiator backwards. The air flow in this direction was much greater, however not good
for driving. I removed the shroud & fan & replaced them with two 12 inch fans from
Summet Racing (PN MRG -1986) . After the engine broke in, I have never been over 200
degrees even in stop and go traffic with a 160 degree thermostat. I don't know if this
is your problem, but it cured my overheating problem.

Gerry

[Tom Wells]

Brent,

On the 460 there's a thin metal plate that goes between the water pump and the block. Seems to me there was a thin gasket on either side of that thin plate too but it's been a while.

If you leave out the plate, overheating will happen.

You shouldn't need bungs for the A/F ratio but you may need a friend with a sniffer that can be put into the ends of the side pipes. One way to tell if it's extra lean at idle is "do your eyes water?" If they do, it's often because it's too lean, not too rich. Also, if the header pipes are glowing (at night) near the exhaust ports it's likely too lean.

Burping is best done when the engine has done a heat cycle - heat it up really well, then let it cool. If you have a radiator overflow tank (which is a good idea anyway) make sure it's full before you heat cycle. Then after it's cooled off, take off the radiator cap and see if the radiator's full to the top. Even if it looks OK, see if you can squeeze a hose to try to make an air bubble emerge. If some air bubbles come out, keep squeezing and adding water in between squeezes.

Also check the overflow tank to make sure it has some water in it - water expands when hot so the overflow should be higher when the engine is warm, lower (but not empty) when cool. The idea is that if air comes out as the engine heats up, the overflow tank will provide some water to be sucked back in when the engine cools off.

If everything else is OK (no air, plate behind pump is OK, idle A/F ratio OK), then try a better fan and shroud assembly.

Tom

[Snakebit]

Are you running under drive pulleys? If so they may not be turning the water pump fast enough for proper coolant flow.

I always thought if your eyes were tearing you were running rich not lean?

[bulletbrown]

What is the quart capacity of your radiator? Most radiators that come with the kits will never cool a big block 460. What is the CFM of your fan ? Check with the manufacture of your radiator , you maybe surprised at what you fine out , it maybe just plan to small to handle a 460 . Been there , done that.

[SuperHart]

You say that you have a 16" puller fan which should be adequate when installed on the size of radiator you have. Just because you have a 16" fan doesn't mean you can assume it's adequate. You need to know the airflow rating of the fan you have. If it came with the car kit, chances are it is a lower performing fan and you might be smart to choose a SPAL replacement (#2082) which flows 2400 cfm and mounts directly to the rear of the radiator. I know that SPAL offers 16" puller fans in several different air flows, 1300 cfm up to 2400 and 3000 cfm (race only) models. Another thing is, how many rows of tubes does your radiator have? In my opinion, you should have 4 rows for a big block motor. If your radiator only has two rows of tubes (standard kit car issue intended for small block applications) you might have to end up recoring the radiator with a 4 row insert or simply replace with a 4 row radiator of similar dimensions in order to cool your beast.

Another issue is these underdrive pulley sets that some guys like to use. They are intended for race applications and actually underperform on the street.

Also check your distributor advance. One of the benefits of vacuum advance is a cooler running motor but too much advance does cause overheating.

Of course, I can't compare your 460 to my 351W stroker (392 cid) but I have a 4 row radiator (1968 Mustang 428FE size) in my Cobra with the twin 10" decorative fans up front and a SPAL 2400 cfm 16" puller fan and I run only 195* in traffic on a 90+* day, promptly cooling back to 185* when moving. On a day in the mid 80s I never see above 190* even in traffic. I run 10* initial advance with another 16* vacuum advance at idle and a 180* thermostat.

In summary, check all the following:
1. distributor timing (do you have vacuum advance?)
2. Number of rows of tubes in the radiator (2=bad, 3=marginal, 4=adequate)
3. CFM rating of your 16" puller fan (2400 cfm needed for big block)
4. Is the radiator "burped"?
5. Air/fuel mix ratio
6. Fuel Octane Rating vs. compression ratio
7. Pulleys (crank and water pump pulleys should be approx. same diameter)

Always remember that when choosing parts for your build that aftermarket parts designated "for race only" should be a clue that they may not perform as desired on street applications. When the factories designed their vehicles, they pretty much figured out what would work and what wouldn't on the street and chose parts to minimize complaints and problems (warranty headaches). So, choose wisely!!!

[kitcarbp]

Brent, I am building my West Coast now and have learned a few things from the wealth of experience on this site, I have yet to fire mine up but the WC cooling system is not optimum and needs some improvements. Here is what I learned building mine. Take a systemic approach
Simply stated, at low idle revs and stationary, you want max water flow through the rad and max air flow possible.

1) Air entrappment, some have added an extra coolant line from rear of intake manifold (drill and tap into coolant passage) and connect it into outlet elbow at the front of intake to ensure no air remains in the rear of the engine heads/block. ByronRace on this site did this on his WC and reports good results. He also made other changes and does not use the chrome tank.

2) If you purchased the nice V-belt March pulley set from WC, take the large underdrive Water Pump Pulley and throw it out! Buy the smaller WP pulley (correct size) that will give you higher water flow at idle, go to the March web site for the part number.

2) Fan Shroud- MUST HAVE! The WC is set up for failure without a COMPLETE fan shroud for the single electric 15" puller fan. I am building my shroud now. Its all about making the set-up efficient to pull air through 100%of the WC radiator core (16" x 24" = 384 sq inches) on the WC 4.25" thick radiator. The 15" flex-a-lite with a small shroud= 256 sq inches pulling through the core or only 66% of the total core area. The fan still has to convince me its adequate wont know until I run mine and do some shake down testing. With a good shroud, the 2800 cfm fan should be adequate. The thicker your radiator core is, the more efficient (max cfms across max surface area) your puller fan and shroud combo needs to be to pull air through the core compared to a thinner core rad. Pusher fan will help without a doubt but does create more restriction at highway speeds but your air velocity over the core fins is higher also at highway speed.

3) Front Shroud- This would be another benefit to duct the air into the 16x24 core instead of letting the air travel around the core, (path of least resistance) we want the air to go through the rad core for max benefit. I cant try this until I install the body ,so I cant comment.

3) Another WC owner went with twin 12 inch SPAL fans pushers (using the thick 4.25" thick core, due to a unique set-up with a blower that didn't allow clearance for an engine side puller fan. ByronRace reported this with great cooling results accordingly.

4) Need to run a thermostat 180-190 F should be fine, and WITH an air bleed hole (STEWART sells one or you can drill your own 3/16" hole, dont use a restrictor for street driving, we dont want to reduce water flow we want to keep it moving.

5) Your target should be to keep the water temp 180-200F with 180 crusing and 200 at idle. My crate motor uses the Alumnum SCJ heads and I want to keep them cool as possible for a lng happy life : ).

6) Changing anti-freeze % below 50% helps but it should not be needed in well designed cooling system since specific heat of pure wate is better than any mixture with antifreeze. Same with using additives that change the specific heat, dont need those either if the system is well designed but folks report improvement using them.

My 2 cents

Bill