The Snake & The Stallion - best Cobra documentary ever - Page 2

jmillington · #21 (**permalink**) 02-25-2009, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sidepipe49

where did you order your vidio from' thanks

I purchased it using the link in the first post.
I received my copy, and it plays fine in the USA, and its a great video, highly recommended!

petrolheadSL · #22 (**permalink**) 02-26-2009, 06:14 AM

Escheiders post says it all, what a moment in motorsports, and what a well made film to tell the story.

Cobra Lite · #23 (**permalink**) 02-26-2009, 09:55 AM

Now that is a good one!

Yes, Shelby is a salesman alright.

And as was mentioned, he was at the right time.

However, he was not the first person to race an AC with an American V8 in it. He was just trying to build a race car and knew a big torque V8 in a small light car had a chance. The video gives the impression that AC was about to go out of business and that he saved them. Uh, huh. Right. They had the design and craftsman who could build the car and were willing to sell the cars without the drivetrain. A great deal for both parties.

I have watched the DVD many times now (while I exercise!) and it is very well made. I recommend it but with reservation because it it so one sided. It is well said that history is written by the victors and this video lives up to that claim.

It is so much a tribute to "The Man" that I would suspect that he financed the program. It is like a biography paid for by the person written about. Nothing at all negative, everything presented in a way that, while true, is not the whole story, and by that leads to incorrect beliefs.

Reminds me of the movies where you see both the "his and her" views of the situation. In each person's mind they were correct, that they were in the right, and the other person was all wrong. Yet the way each of them believe they handled the situation is totally unrelated to reality. That is how the Snake and the Stallion video is.

Funny, I never thought of Dan Gurney and Bob Bondurant as "California Hot Rodders". Nor the the engineers who modified the AC into a competitive car.

I did like that it was accurately shown that Shelby had very little, or really, nothing to do with the coupe design other than putting Pete Brock in charge.

However, the video ends with Shelby "Hanging up his hat". What a crock.

No mention of developing the next years car which was supposed to be quite different than it ended up becoming. I am sure the 390 Cobra with the longer wheelbase would have been a much better car. Also no mention of Shelby taking over the GT40's or that the famous 427 SC Cobra was just a way to sell the leftover unsellable cars after he had moved on to other projects. Nor that he had no interest in the Cobra since it was just a means to an end. Not until many years later when the cars started to increase in value. I do agree with the Dragon Lady that all those involved would feel those were the best of times. The 289 days that is, those days were gone before the 427 ever reached this side of the Atlantic. And long before Shelby started on his infamous course of suing anyone and everyone for anything he thought he could get away with. (like Harley Davidson trying to copyright the "sound" of the V-Twin engine. Like they were the first to build V-Twin engines???) Greed is ugly in any form.

So, buy a copy and enjoy it, but please, do not think it portrays an accurate well rounded picture of the car, the races, or "the man".

I wish there had been more race film footage and less repetitive interviews but so it goes. The cars are beautiful anyway.

A famous person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals and he gets the credit for their success.

But a GREAT person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals, but he credits those working with him with the success.

eric johnson · #24 (**permalink**) 02-26-2009, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobra Lite

Now that is a good one!

Yes, Shelby is a salesman alright.

And as was mentioned, he was at the right time.

However, he was not the first person to race an AC with an American V8 in it. He was just trying to build a race car and knew a big torque V8 in a small light car had a chance. The video gives the impression that AC was about to go out of business and that he saved them. Uh, huh. Right. They had the design and craftsman who could build the car and were willing to sell the cars without the drivetrain. A great deal for both parties.

I have watched the DVD many times now (while I exercise!) and it is very well made. I recommend it but with reservation because it it so one sided. It is well said that history is written by the victors and this video lives up to that claim.

It is so much a tribute to "The Man" that I would suspect that he financed the program. It is like a biography paid for by the person written about. Nothing at all negative, everything presented in a way that, while true, is not the whole story, and by that leads to incorrect beliefs.

Reminds me of the movies where you see both the "his and her" views of the situation. In each person's mind they were correct, that they were in the right, and the other person was all wrong. Yet the way each of them believe they handled the situation is totally unrelated to reality. That is how the Snake and the Stallion video is.

Funny, I never thought of Dan Gurney and Bob Bondurant as "California Hot Rodders". Nor the the engineers who modified the AC into a competitive car.

I did like that it was accurately shown that Shelby had very little, or really, nothing to do with the coupe design other than putting Pete Brock in charge.

However, the video ends with Shelby "Hanging up his hat". What a crock.

No mention of developing the next years car which was supposed to be quite different than it ended up becoming. I am sure the 390 Cobra with the longer wheelbase would have been a much better car. Also no mention of Shelby taking over the GT40's or that the famous 427 SC Cobra was just a way to sell the leftover unsellable cars after he had moved on to other projects. Nor that he had no interest in the Cobra since it was just a means to an end. Not until many years later when the cars started to increase in value. I do agree with the Dragon Lady that all those involved would feel those were the best of times. The 289 days that is, those days were gone before the 427 ever reached this side of the Atlantic. And long before Shelby started on his infamous course of suing anyone and everyone for anything he thought he could get away with. (like Harley Davidson trying to copyright the "sound" of the V-Twin engine. Like they were the first to build V-Twin engines???) Greed is ugly in any form.

So, buy a copy and enjoy it, but please, do not think it portrays an accurate well rounded picture of the car, the races, or "the man".

I wish there had been more race film footage and less repetitive interviews but so it goes. The cars are beautiful anyway.

A famous person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals and he gets the credit for their success.

But a GREAT person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals, but he credits those working with him with the success.

James,

Very well put. You get an A+
It's nice seeing Ol Shel is still living up to the Billy Sol Estes moniker to this day...

Phil Remington for president!

petrolheadSL · #25 (**permalink**) 03-02-2009, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cobra Lite

Now that is a good one!

Yes, Shelby is a salesman alright.

A famous person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals and he gets the credit for their success.

But a GREAT person surrounds himself with hard working and intelligent people to carry out his goals, but he credits those working with him with the success.

The public like a celebrity to focus all the praise and awe onto and Shelby lapped it up on behalf of everyone involved as the public face of cobra, but he genuinely shared the credits of their success where it mattered, as far as I can tell anyway.

twobjshelbys · #26 (**permalink**) 03-03-2009, 10:48 PM

I got my copy tonight and regrettably the disc is damaged. The movie plays through to about the last minute of the film and the credits just go into error recovery, and none of the specials (e.g., the photos and other stuff) will play. I hope they will replace it.

I did get to see Bondurant finish. I got a chance to talk with him and his wife at the Shelby American Collection gathering in December. I took his wife's picture with Carroll and then she went back to get Bob and took another of them together. Carroll asked me to photoshop out the old guy and send him the picture with the babe

I sent a copy of the pictures to Bob and left him a note at the BJ auction. I got a call when I was in a meeting at work from a 602 area code and put it to voice mail. Afterwards I called the number back. "Hello, I just got a call from this number, who is this?" "Ok, who is this", "Tony". "Oh, hi this is Bob Bondurant. I just wanted to let you know we did get the pictures...." and he thanked me for our donation to CSCF and chatted for a while longer. He told me that if brought my Cobra to Phoenix he'd give me a pointer on the track. I now feel I have to go. Just having a picture of him in the car would be a treasure.

Durt · #27 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 01:47 AM

Bought mine a few years back. I'm a video editor and can vouch for the first rate production value and terrific storytelling. A must own DVD without question.

twobjshelbys · #28 (**permalink**) 03-04-2009, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

I hope they will replace it.

And replace it they will. I emailed Spirit Level Film last night and got a personal response from Richard Symons (the producer!). A new copy is on the way. Must be a small shop, and his service is first class!

petrolheadSL · #29 (**permalink**) 03-11-2009, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

And replace it they will. I emailed Spirit Level Film last night and got a personal response from Richard Symons (the producer!). A new copy is on the way. Must be a small shop, and his service is first class!

They're a small outfit that seem to specialise in high quality motorsports films, I bought GT Racer from them as well, and its brilliant

twobjshelbys · #30 (**permalink**) 03-12-2009, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

And replace it they will. I emailed Spirit Level Film last night and got a personal response from Richard Symons (the producer!). A new copy is on the way. Must be a small shop, and his service is first class!

I got my replacement tonight. It's perfect. What a show!

petrolheadSL · #31 (**permalink**) 03-13-2009, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Durt

Bought mine a few years back. I'm a video editor and can vouch for the first rate production value and terrific storytelling. A must own DVD without question.

It really is a wonderfully crafted, if slightly one-sided, masterpiece

twobjshelbys · #32 (**permalink**) 03-13-2009, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrolheadSL

It really is a wonderfully crafted, if slightly one-sided, masterpiece

I agree with this, but it not an agenda, he approached this as a Shelby documentary and that it is.

The feature is some of the best film-making I've seen - the split screen actually needs to be seen on a big-screen TV and not your laptop.

But the best gems are on the second disc. Bondurant and Brock and all the other guys. On the second disc slice #15 is has the sales pitch of the GT350 and the Ford GT (oh yeah, we've got Cobras and Coupes too).

I'm ordering the Rendezvous disc tonight too. I remember seeing this in the late 80's one one of those faded VHS tapes and didn't even know what it was until I saw the preview on disc 1.

petrolheadSL · #33 (**permalink**) 03-16-2009, 03:34 AM

Rendezvous is legendary

petrolheadSL · #34 (**permalink**) 03-17-2009, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

I agree with this, but it not an agenda, he approached this as a Shelby documentary and that it is.

The feature is some of the best film-making I've seen - the split screen actually needs to be seen on a big-screen TV and not your laptop.

But the best gems are on the second disc. Bondurant and Brock and all the other guys. On the second disc slice #15 is has the sales pitch of the GT350 and the Ford GT (oh yeah, we've got Cobras and Coupes too).

I met the filmmaker Richard Symons at Cheltenham races last week, and told him about this thread, he was delighted the film is loved so much by the faithful, and judging by the horse he owns, he's something of a perfectionist, obviously reflected in the quality of the film.

mrmustang · #35 (**permalink**) 03-17-2009, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by petrolheadSL

I met the filmmaker Richard Symons at Cheltenham races last week, and told him about this thread, he was delighted the film is loved so much by the faithful, and judging by the horse he owns, he's something of a perfectionist, obviously reflected in the quality of the film.

Looking at your posting history, and the caliber of your posts, it makes me wonder if you are Richard Symons, or related (business or otherwise) to Richard Symons and that this thread is nothing more than one large "self promotion" of your film/DVD. Especially seeing that you live right around the corner (electronically speaking) from him. If this is the case, why in the world would you post in the third person as "just an interested enthusiast". Do you really think all internet forum members are that gullible?

Bill S.

petrolheadSL · #36 (**permalink**) 03-19-2009, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrmustang

Looking at your posting history, and the caliber of your posts, it makes me wonder if you are Richard Symons, or related (business or otherwise) to Richard Symons and that this thread is nothing more than one large "self promotion" of your film/DVD. Especially seeing that you live right around the corner (electronically speaking) from him. If this is the case, why in the world would you post in the third person as "just an interested enthusiast". Do you really think all internet forum members are that gullible?

Bill S.

I am most definitely not Richard Symons! I am however driving a cobra in this years Gumball 3000, and stumbled upon this film, we are trying for a ferrari/cobra rematch in one of the legs.

TButtrick · #37 (**permalink**) 03-20-2009, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twobjshelbys

But the best gems are on the second disc. Bondurant and Brock and all the other guys. On the second disc slice #15 is has the sales pitch of the GT350 and the Ford GT (oh yeah, we've got Cobras and Coupes too).

Absolutely. Some funny shenanigans going on with those road trips overseas. Great stuff.

petrolheadSL · #38 (**permalink**) 03-31-2009, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TButtrick

Absolutely. Some funny shenanigans going on with those road trips overseas. Great stuff.

The bonus disc is rammed full of goodies

petrolheadSL · #39 (**permalink**) 04-08-2009, 07:16 AM

The offer is still on, you can watch the trailer here: http://www.spiritlevelfilm.com/snakeandstallion/

petrolheadSL · #40 (**permalink**) 06-19-2009, 05:21 AM

I received this from Spirit Level today, if you haven't got either this is a pretty good offer:-

The Snake & The Stallion - Continuing with the Ferrari theme we have a superb offer on 2 classic motorsports films, Steve McQueen's 'Le Mans' and our very own Richard Symons' 'The Snake & The Stallion'.

DVD offer - 50% off retail price! £19.99 instead of £39.98 when they are bought together. Again using a custom coupon code redeemable in the Spirit Level shop we can track all sales generated from the offer to your audience and give you a contradeal of £1 per unit.

Competition - Win a Cobra for the weekend. A cult classic if ever there was, here's a chance to roar round the English countryside in a mighty Cobra! Another summer gem for your audience.

Links: http://www.spiritlevelfilm.com/wincobra/