Overheating Issues, Perplexed - Page 11

undy · #**201** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 04:07 AM

So El ... the fan ended up being the Taurus 3.8 unit, like mine only OEM?? Where did you get your info that the aftermarket ones don't put out like the OEM unit? I'd read various related threads on different boards and hadn't come across that.

When are you going to start the install? I'm wondering ... should you/I/we start a new thread, "Mariachi's marvelous Taurus cooling fan install"?... or sumpin like that

Keep us posted on the install, I'll be watching carefully.

I did some more measuring yesterday evening and came to the conclusion that there's no way I could stuff that MK VIII fan behind my radiator. There's just not enough top to bottom along and fore to aft clearance. With the air that this Taurus unit moves compared to my old one I see no benifit in the MK VIII fan anyway.

Dave

elmariachi · #**202** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by undy

So El ... the fan ended up being the Taurus 3.8 unit, like mine only OEM?? Where did you get your info that the aftermarket ones don't put out like the OEM unit? Dave

Yes. The numbnuts that sold it to me runs a wrecking yard and to him I guess all these fans are the same. Nonethless, it is the 16" Ford Taurus/Lincoln Continental (not Mark 8) fan. There's a guy in TN on one of the rock crawling forums that said he tried a couple of new aftermarket fans next to an original and they didn't spin as many RPMs. I also exchanged emails with a guy on eBay who had both new and used to sell, but warned me that the aftermarket fans weren't quite as powerful as the originals. But if you already have it, I'd say go with it and see what happens.

Quote:

Originally Posted by undy

When are you going to start the install? I'm wondering ... should you/I/we start a new thread, "Mariachi's marvelous Taurus cooling fan install"?... or sumpin like that

Keep us posted on the install, I'll be watching carefully.

Well if you caught my subtle post about boredom leading to a pan gasket swap and a tranny drop, then you'll know that I have those two jobs and this fan awaiting me. I am picking up my Hollister Road wiring harness from Dave today, so I will probably install the fan and wiring in the coming days and then fire it up as soon as the pan gets back from Armando next week.

I agree we should start a new thread and post pics of our installs so the crowd can begin BBQ'ing us. Feel free to proceed if you are ready to start. As ole' Ben Franklin said "We must all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately."

vettestr · #**203** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 10:42 AM

Guys,
I purchased a fan assembly yesterday @ local wrecking yard and it has the white cap on the connector and is # F2DE 8C607 AB. On the bench it does move a lot of air. A hint for the mental giants like myself would be to check for missiles or any other crap that will be thrown at you off the bench when you connect the hot lead ..... LMAO !

A few years back I spent some time at Ron Davis Manuf. as his shop is local for me. He showed me testing he was doing on several manufacturers fan assemblies. He was testing the actual CFM these fans put out with and without the restriction of the radiator. What a concept to think about how it might work in the real world VS in a lab with no resistance to air flow. Lets just say the measured output when mounted to the same rad was no where close to the advertised ratings, the delta was huge.

El., you mentioned earlier you don't run an oil cooler with concern oil is now only 210ish as a high. Where are you measuring temp? I find an oil cooler really helps a problem child with overall cooling. The internal oil temps are always a little higher than most measure points. Oil will cook off moisture at 210* but wonder if it is not reaching that temp and more on the cylinder walls or the ex. valve guides and so on even if only showing 190* in the oil pan. Also wonder if oil change frequency and vapor extraction from PCV system etc. all combined make the trade offs of running a lower oil temp a fair trade. I think it does and run a oil cooler on my cars. In colder weather I do block off air flow and do run oil T-stats. Food for thought.

DAVID GAGNARD · #**204** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 01:03 PM

Quote:

On the bench it does move a lot of air. A hint for the mental giants like myself would be to check for missiles or any other crap that will be thrown at you off the bench when you connect the hot lead ..... LMAO !

Been there, done that, also!!!!!!!!!! A few years ago I was putting in a fan on my race car and the hot wire looked mighty small to me, so before installing it (Sunday afternoon 6:00pm) I decided to lay it on the radiator support for testing. Had to put it fan blades up and hot wired it directly to a battery, was gonna let it run a few minutes and see how hot the positive wire got. After a minute or two, it began to "walk" and I reached to grab it as it was falling off the car,before it hit the floor...bad idea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Did you know that your right thumb WILL NOT stop an electric fan blade spinning at 2500 rpms???????? Did you know that those plastic blades are acutally very sharp and will in an instant slice your right thumb to the bone????? the doc got by with 12 stiches after I sat bleeding in the emergency room for 3 hours!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Still don't have 100% feeling in that thumb....

From then on, it something is gonna fall on the ground, it's gonna hit the ground, if it breaks, I'll get a new one......I haven't broke a part "yet" that was more than the emergency room bill, it was "only" $765.00!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that comes out to $63.75 per stitch!!!!!!!!!

David

elmariachi · #**205** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vettestr

A hint for the mental giants like myself would be to check for missiles or any other crap that will be thrown at you off the bench when you connect the hot lead ..... LMAO !

I threw the juice to mine last night and I think it has more torque than my old John Deere mower.

Once I get it wired up, I think I will feed my Zirgo fan that's supposed to be 3600 cfm to it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vettestr

El., you mentioned earlier you don't run an oil cooler with concern oil is now only 210ish as a high. Where are you measuring temp? I find an oil cooler really helps a problem child with overall cooling.

I probably should have clarified and I didn't mean to imply that 210 was hot; I do want at least 210-220 oil operating temp for the obvious reasons. My plan is to install an oil cooler once I have had time to see how the oil temps behaves overall and after engine break-in. As for verifying the temps, I have a spare Autometer oil gauge and have run them both and they match. So they are either both right or both wrong. And my IR gun shows consistent temps but a few degrees cooler on the pan, oil filter adapter block and oil filter exterior.

vettestr · #**206** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 02:34 PM

El,
Oil at 210* .... I knew what you meant. I was asking where you are reading that temp at or from where?

When you get to testing on the cooler install I think you will be surprised at how much load the cooler takes off the cooling system. My little piece of Paradise is the Phoenix area of Glendale so I know what warm weather is. I will give you credit for knowing humidity and hotter than hell. Either way when it is 118 + outside that is hot, I think 100 and 50 % humidity is worse but it does keep the snowbirds away. Even the illegals stay in the AC during the day.

elmariachi · #**207** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vettestr

When you get to testing on the cooler install I think you will be surprised at how much load the cooler takes off the cooling system. My little piece of Paradise is the Phoenix area of Glendale so I know what warm weather is. I will give you credit for knowing humidity and hotter than hell. Either way when it is 118 + outside that is hot, I think 100 and 50 % humidity is worse but it does keep the snowbirds away. Even the illegals stay in the AC during the day.

Well in that case, that little project will get bumped up on the to-do list to "next." Is there a better way to measure true oil temp, based on your experience?

As for illegals, I thought everyone became "legit" back in January, no?

vettestr · #**208** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 10:27 PM

Not sure there is a better way or place to measure oil temp. If your sensor is in a remote filter housing it will display a bit lower than if measured in the blocks main oil galley. This is the reason the oil is 210+ and coolant is 180+ as it depends where or what you are monitoring.

Maybe just adding 2 quarts to the system when installing a cooler is that buffer that gets you over the hump but it does help. The same extra volume makes a T-stat a good investment.

elmariachi · #**209** (**permalink**) 06-23-2009, 11:02 PM

My oil sensor is in the front of my Armando pan. The exterior readings there were 5-10 less than the dash gauge. The hottest the oil has ever been was 230 on the gauge, and that's no big deal. That was the afternoon I tried the aluminum shroud and the coolant temp hit 220*F before I could cool it down.

I'll definitley include a t-stat with the cooler. One project at a time.

Garage10 · #**210** (**permalink**) 06-25-2009, 08:12 AM

UNDY
Sorry I took so long getting back to you on this. Th DC site is
http://www.dccontrol.com/0820.htm
Hope this works. Side note. I expect to recieve my DC controller today or tommorow according to usps. Not bad, only two months after I ordered it.

undy · #**211** (**permalink**) 06-25-2009, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garage10

UNDY
Sorry I took so long getting back to you on this. Th DC site is
http://www.dccontrol.com/0820.htm
Hope this works. Side note. I expect to recieve my DC controller today or tommorow according to usps. Not bad, only two months after I ordered it.

Let me know how it works out Brent.. -Dave

Garage10 · #**212** (**permalink**) 06-26-2009, 12:54 AM

Dave
I will let all know as soon as she's in. I hooked up my Taurus fan to power today to compare to my old 16" flexalite and it moves a ton more air. The only problem is it won't fit very well in my fancy aluminum shroud so I am just going to try it the way it came. It won't seal as good but still seamed to pull more air through my thick rad. Praying it comes tommorow.
Brent

undy · #**213** (**permalink**) 06-26-2009, 04:23 AM

Brent, A little creative shroud carving and it should fit just fine. I've no doubt that you will be pleased with the results. The means of fan control is my only unsolved mystery. You'll provide me with the final piece of the puzzle to make that decision.

A trick I used to get my current flexalite fan/shroud combo to fit my radiator was to use some wide and narrow slip-on automotive weather stripping. It allows for a good shroud to radiator seal without hard plastic to aluminum contact (possible leak causers). I cut and slid the weather stripping on the shroud's raw radiator facing edges that had to be cut or trimmed to fill the air gaps. The wide stuff filled the larger gaps while the narrower stripping took care of areas like around the radiator inlet and outlet necks. It actually turned out pretty clean looking and it blends in well with the black plastic look of the shroud. A little yellow gorilla snot (super duty weather strip adhesive) to keep the strips in place and you're done. The stripping lets zero air bypass the radiator core around the shroud's perimeter air gaps. I will duplicate the same effort when I do the Taurus swap.

Dave

Garage10 · #**214** (**permalink**) 06-27-2009, 12:29 AM

Undy
Thanks. I will try and find some auto weather strip and give it a shot. I still didn't recieve controller today. Hopefully Monday cause car is all back together other than rad which I am waiting to install controller in fan shroud like dccontrol does.
Take care
Brent

elmariachi · #**215** (**permalink**) 06-27-2009, 08:12 AM

Amdist these 100+ temps in Houston I am in the process of wiring in the Hollister Road harness this weekend. I'll post pics and info when I am done. I have created a new thread here for this and the Taurus fan installs

Michael C Henry · #**216** (**permalink**) 06-27-2009, 09:06 AM

I also have a pair of soft foam blocks that compress to stop any air flow from escaping through the hood hinge slots and bypassing the radiator.

Mdman352 · #**217** (**permalink**) 06-29-2009, 07:33 PM

What is the cfm of the Taurus fan? I have a Summit racing shroud and fan rated at 3150CFM and I am over heating big time. The fan kicks in at 180 and in traffic the temp just starts climbing. I am using distilled water with water wetter. any help would be appreciated. 427 FE.
David

undy · #**218** (**permalink**) 06-30-2009, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mdman352

What is the cfm of the Taurus fan? I have a Summit racing shroud and fan rated at 3150CFM and I am over heating big time. The fan kicks in at 180 and in traffic the temp just starts climbing. I am using distilled water with water wetter. any help would be appreciated. 427 FE.
David

3500 to 4500 CFM, depending what discussion you subscribe to. I've heard 5000+ for the Mark 8. IMHO, Flexalite and a lot of other aftermarket fan mfrs tend to over rate their fan CFMs. I think you'll find that the Taurus or the MK VIII fan will kick CFM butt, compared to that Summit special.

Dave

DAVID GAGNARD · #**219** (**permalink**) 06-30-2009, 09:25 AM

What Undy said is dead on.........
Distilled water and water wetter is good, but I would also add about one gallon of good anti-freeze, I've found this to help a lot.... On one vehicle I worked on, just the anti-freeze alone was good for almost a 10 degree drop in temp.......Plus it helps lube the water pump and slows down corrosion in the block......

David

Thoroco · #**220** (**permalink**) 06-30-2009, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by undy

3500 to 4500 CFM, depending what discussion you subscribe to. I've heard 5000+ for the Mark 8. IMHO, Flexalite and a lot of other aftermarket fan mfrs tend to over rate their fan CFMs. I think you'll find that the Taurus or the MK VIII fan will kick CFM butt, compared to that Summit special.

Dave

I have to agree. I don't know the true cfm but no aftermarket fan under $300 even comes close to the Taurus or Mark VIII.