Engine Confusion

[comstock]

Spent a few hours at Hillbank last week. Drove Lance's demo SPF with a 351W (straight 300 hp), and was duly impressed. Now I'm confused!

Originally thought I'd like the big block from Bill Parham. But Lance has a pretty good rap on the Windsor -- can get one stroked to 427 (about 500 hp). I'd be interested to hear opinions from some of you folks who have more expertise (probably ALL of you!) than I do in the engine compartment.

Selling points:

427s may be more valuable in the long run. Old blocks are becoming rarer.

The old blocks (may) make the car easier to register in AZ as a '65.

Small blocks are an easier fit. They weigh about 200lb less.

351 won't leak oil like the 427?

Any other opinions/suggestions?

Thanks,
Steve

Scottsdale, AZ

[Bob In Ct]

Steve:
They still make Windsors and the parts that go on them.

Bob

[Ron61]

Steve,

I think I would stay away from stroking the 351 out to 427. Mine is at 416 and most of them are around the 393 range. The only two that I have actually seen stroked to 427 didn't last long. I have had mine since 1996 and have driven it hard and it has stayed toigether great. As for the horsepower you don't have to go to 427 to make 500 +. Mine puts out about 520-530 and a friend of mine who has his stroked to 410 gets around 540. As for the big block small block thing, that is a no winner as half the people swear by one and the other half by the other. I have one of each and both have their advantages and disadvantages. I personally like the 351 much better for conering and fun driving.

[mikiec]

Steve,

The motor will not make any difference in getting it registered.

Now for the small block vs big block stuff.....

It's entirely up to you. Yes, you can get a small block with as much HP and Torque as a big block. I like the big block sound better.

The FE's are expensive. Bill Parham builds great engines. 460/514 the newer kids on the block are great. Tons of power...

I think one of the main differences in HP and Torque is that the 385 and Fe series do it at a lower RPM range with out much engine modification. A small block to produce the equivalent does it at higher RPM levels. This is neither good or bad, depends on how you drive your car.

Remember these are just my opinion....We do have a Cobra in the club sporting a Winston Cup engine. A small block of 358 cubes putting out around 600 horses. It runs like a scalled dog and sounds so nasty....

The choice is yours.

Mike

[Jeff Frigo]

FE only.

[SSSnake]

If you do stroke the 351 out to 427 cu. go with the new Dart Iron Eagle block.

Glenn

[Fred Douglass]

This is the kind of interesting and informative thread wh/ makes this site so valuable.
Ron 61, you confirm just about every sb afficianado I know, AND you've got a fairly unique perspective, owning both styles of engine.
Steve C., I can tell you of an very interesting insight or perspective. I'd rather leave the gent's name out, but he IS an SPF dealer in New England with LOTS of raacing and fast driving experience. He said (words to the effect): in a Cobra a small block with about 350-390 hp is all the engine you'll ever need if you want to keep it on the street (literally). More than that, and you'll be constantly on the edge. It's better to have a small-block, with sufficient (but not brutal) power (i.e. not "overstressed")---and use it HARD than it is to have a MONSTROUS MILL under the hood---just waiting to fling you into the weeds.
Initially, I was going to go with a Dart poked out to 427 and c. 575 hp---now I'm thinking same engine, but closer to 480 hp/ft.lbs. People have advised me to save the $, buy the Ford SVO 393 stroker, get used to its 430+ hp, then, instead of rebuildinng it 4 years down the road---sell it (to a kid!) and move up to the Dart--once I've learned my (and the car's) limits. Would I put 600 hp in a 2600 lb. car? Nope. Why? I'm 57---want see 58! Just my $.02 Hope it helps you.

Chow

[Lew the taxman]

Fred

Amen! to that.

Lew

[Dwight]

YOU TELL THEM, FRED


YOU SAID IT THE WAY IT IS. WHY DO YALL THINK OUR INSURANCE HAS GONE OUT OF SIGHT! BIG BLOCK AND NO EXPERINCE.

[comstock]

Wow! Didn't think my questions would provoke such a great thread, but thank you all! My feeble brain will try to digest all this great info, and in the end, I'll probably still be confused, heh^heh! Big sounds are great, but so is good steering.

I'm very grateful for all your opinions, and when the time comes (probably in next year or so), I know I'll have a great Cobra based on all the info I get here. I do know that I like the SPF a lot (no time to build in my job). I also had fun getting to know Bill Parham and hearing his views on the FEs. Then Lance's ideas sounded just as good on the Windsor.

Whew! What it all boils down to, I guess, is getting the car I can drive on the street with lots of power, but which I'm less likely to kill myself in, that also will perform better than my 401K did over the last couple of years, ha ha!

Thanks again!
Steve

[chopper]

Ah, yes, the "behemoth 427" argument again.

The engine weights listed on the ERA website:

(http://www.erareplicas.com/engines.htm#fe)

show a '69 351W (4V) weighs in at 515 lb; a 427 (Galaxy, 4V) weighs in at 590 lb; and a '68 428 CobraJet with aluminum intake is 570 lb. This was original weight for the installed engine. IMHO, the difference in weight of 75 lb is well worth the trade for the extra torque. The "behemoth 427" is one of the more enduring urban legends around. Drop an aluminum manifold and a set of aluminum heads on the 427 and it is nearly identical in weight to the 351W; it just has 50% more torque. If you'd like to see one, give me a buzz. I'll give you the point that the 351 is smaller.

And, 427's do not LEAK oil. They're just marking their territory.

[coyled]

Steve, i have a high rpm 358ci motor, 660hp in a hi-tech cobra. Their is also a guy in town, bob broberg(sp) that has a 468ci big block. If you get a chance, ride in both cobras. The big block seems more tractable and has power at a lower rpm range, and the small block is a higher rpm screamer. They are both fun to drive, but feel diferent. I am not saying one is better than the other, thats personal preference. Scott

[Marc Walker]

I have a beautiful Johnex/House of Cobras built 2000 that is for sale in Tucson. It has a stroked 427 Windsor (same engine builder that Hilbank has used) and it has 3900 miles on it without any problems, ever. SPFs have nothing on this car. I believe it would be worth your time to drive down to see it. It's for sale on Cobra Country until Jan 5th. I'm asking $36k

Good luck.......... Marc Walker