Bonding Doors

[OZCOBRA]

Originally Posted by Zedn

As i said, i have never spoken to the manufacturer. That came from what i read on a hotrod forum for steeling out a fibreglass body.

.....but i guess most kits come already bonded with doors hung....

Cheers

Wasn't having a go at you Z as you've said on many occasions you haven't spoken to Laurie....it was again a dig at RCM as I'm sure he used Bondo on the doors he supplied me on my 1st car and they failed miserably !!!!!

[stephen low]

Liam

There you go, a personal recommendation not to use filler but I just thought of another important reason to try and do more than glue the steel to the glass.

You could also use a sikaflex as suggested and this will glue the steel to the glass but what you really want is the glass panel to be intrinsic with the steel in the event of a side hit.

By glassing the steel onto the panel you'll increase any impact protection. Just stuck on the separation of steel from panel would be easier than if bonded together.
Admittedly the glass is only a fraction of the steel's impact resistance but that fractional improvement by bonding might make that difference in a side hit.

Just food for thought.

[Z-linkCobra]

Being as how you guys are down under and might be talking about the same stuff Im thinking of i'll throw it out there anyway.

I used some stuff called "Caviseal". It is finely ground fiberglass matt...ground into a real fine powder. Here they use it on boats and what not to bond the hull to the deck and so on. You mix it in the resin before you put the hardener in...for example. you pour out 4oz of resin, mix in your Caviseal and make it to the consistancey you want(thick paste or runny). Then mix in your hardener according to manufacturers specs for the resin(12 drops per oz)

The resin alone will bond the panel but might have tendency to crack under stress. The Caviseal adds some strength and flexability. I would suggest washing the steel with vinager and then drilling some 1/16 or 1/8 holes about every 2"s or 5cm...lol...around the frame. The holes will allow for some really serious bonding.

just my thoughts.

[Z-linkCobra]

Something else I thought of a little while ago. If you get some small counter sunk screws and screw the panel to the frame ( of course with your choice of panel bonder in between). Then when it is bonded and dry you grind the screw head down just below the surface of the panel and cover them up with some filler. They are there forever and will really bond the 2 parts together pretty much for life

[Zedn]

Hi Stephen,

That was my original plan as per my first post.

Im thinking the 3M panel adhesive and then glass around the bars. For the outer to inner skin i will do the same and glass over the ends of the 2 panels. Really the adhesive is only there to hold it until fibreglassing.

I am going to try and get to my local paint supplier where i get my car paints from and see what he recommends to do the initial bond with.

[LMH]

Whatever route you decide to do, can you post some pics of the process?
I'm going to be doing the same thing shortly and maybe I can learn something.
Larry

[Rob. Smith]

Fibreglass over bare steel ? Glassing in the steel frame is a good idea. BUT bare steel will rust, delaminate and rust some more. Un-gelcoated fibreglass likes to absorb moisture or at least wick it in. Do the sika-flex gluing thing but paint the metal with a good sealer first then glass it in. The extra work is good insurance. Silastic products are acidic..avoid them.

[OZCOBRA]

You'll also create more body work if you glass it as it sucks in the door skins.....assuming your talking about outer skin??

[Zedn]

Rob, the steel is galvanized.

Oz, the amount of work this body needs i dont think i will even notice it!

[OZCOBRA]

Originally Posted by Zedn

Oz, the amount of work this body needs i dont think i will even notice it!

.....Keep the sense of humour mate ...it'll be your baby when it's finished.... ENJOY!!!

As you know plenty of help and ideas on here to help with the hard bits ...........and to LAUGH at the BAD BITS..

I thought the doors on my RCM where intake ducts for the rear brakes!!!

[Rob. Smith]

Originally Posted by Zedn

Rob, the steel is galvanized.

Oz, the amount of work this body needs i dont think i will even notice it!

Despite being galvanised I'd paint them as well . The welded bits might be a bit suss.

[Zedn]

I have to have a closer look but i think the welds are cold gal. Im considering giving the frame a coat of por 15 first.

I went to the paint shop today and they recommended sikaflex for the job. I got a tube of sikaflex and a litre of polyester resin the sikaflex is the one they (sika) recommend for installing body kits. With the bars glued and then the whole thing enclosed with fibrglass it will be easily strong enough.

My only concern is the bond strength of the resin / sikaflex to por15, then the por15 to glavanized steel. The local Por 15 man told me i have a 90% chance of it sticking ok to gal when i had a conversation previously with him about Por15 on my gal chassis.

[Rob. Smith]

If you rough up the gal the POR 15 will stick to it ...no problem. Remember to clean the gal with acetone or metal prep after the sanding . The sikaflex is an amazing stuff. it takes a little longer to cure but it's forever. I remember Sikaflex being around in the sixties when my dad was in the auto repair trade.....good stuff then !

[Zedn]

Hi Rob,

I started on it today. Took the side intrusion bars off and gave them a sand with an 80grit flap wheel. The gal was pretty thin so a lot of it actually sanded off. I have drilled some holes in the face to give the sikaflex a key and then painted it with POR15.

Whilst the paint was drying i spent the rest of the day adding fibreglass to parts of the door skins that were too small. Slow drying day for fibreglass with the cool weather. Tomorrow i will be able to trim the outer skin to fit the door jam correctly and then i can glue it on.

Will put up some pics when its done.

[Zedn]

Job done.






Now to glass on the inner skin, install and gap.

[Rob. Smith]

Whilst this topic is running. Does any one know what the intrusion bar in an RMC door looks like ?

[LMH]

Excellent! Thanks for the pics.
Larry