HSS tap die set suggestions

stephen low · #1 (**permalink**) 08-09-2011, 10:18 PM

Guys

Want to chase initially a metric high speed steel tap die set for when I get back to the cobra. Looking at say 3-12mm sizing only.

What brands can anyone recommend? My memories only take me back to P&N!

Noted a Hare and Forbes ad for a Toolmaster brand set in HSS but I assume even as HSS there are good and bad tools. What is the Toolmaster brand like as the H&F price was good I thought.

I had been looking at Snap-On gear but realised these aren't HSS grade.

Any advice would be appreciated so I don't go buying something crap.

Cheers

Steve

eschaider · #2 (**permalink**) 08-09-2011, 11:00 PM

McMaster.com will provide you anything from HHS to carbide with all kinds of surface coatings for rolled or cut threads.

Ed

eschaider · #3 (**permalink**) 08-09-2011, 11:01 PM

Deleted duplicate post

Rog246 · #4 (**permalink**) 08-09-2011, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen low

Guys

Want to chase initially a metric high speed steel tap die set for when I get back to the cobra. Looking at say 3-12mm sizing only.

What brands can anyone recommend? My memories only take me back to P&N!

Noted a Hare and Forbes ad for a Toolmaster brand set in HSS but I assume even as HSS there are good and bad tools. What is the Toolmaster brand like as the H&F price was good I thought.

I had been looking at Snap-On gear but realised these aren't HSS grade.

Any advice would be appreciated so I don't go buying something crap.

Cheers

Steve

Steve I've had a set of Kingchrome for 30yrs and have never had a problem. Just remember what ever set you use get some cutting paste to go with it. It will not only keep the taps/dies sharp but you will get a better thread quality as well.
Rog

DaveW · #5 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 01:31 AM

Steve, i've got a cheapy "Total Tools" set, about 34 Bucks, with a range of intermediate and blind hole taps and dies from 5 to 12mm, as rog says, get some trefolex paste, makes the tools cut clean and easy, the smallest size tub you can get will last a life time. (about 250grams) cost was about 9 bucks,

cheers

Gav · #6 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 01:52 AM

Go to a good tool shop and buy a brand name.
P&N are great as are Sutton. Chinese crap is precisely that, CRAP!

Aussie Mike · #7 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 02:30 AM

There are some good quality Taiwanese sets around, I had 2 big metric and imperial sets that ran from 6mm up to 25 mm and 1/4 up to 1" in both fine and course pitch. They lasted me near 20 years. I bought another Taiwanese set the other day from Radum in Tullamarine. Cost about about $260 and has a good range of sizes in there including some taper taps. This one also has a lead tap and intermediate of each size which is handy.

Cheers

Modena · #8 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eschaider

McMaster.com will provide you anything from HHS to carbide with all kinds of surface coatings for rolled or cut threads.

Ed

McMaster wont ship to Australia

Mrs flatchat · #9 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 04:51 AM

Suttons have what you need --they have boxed sets that include tapping drill , tap and clearence drill --imperial or metric.
Rocol tapping compound is best alround
Cast iron -dry
Aluminium -kero or Rocol
Stainless steel - Gee (unsalted butter) or Rocol
Steels - soluble oil or Rocol

http://www.sutton.com.au/Assets/1420...edtapdrill.pdf
rocol.com.au - RTD Liquid

Rog246 · #10 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrs flatchat

Suttons have what you need --they have boxed sets that include tapping drill , tap and clearence drill --imperial or metric.
Rocol tapping compound is best alround
Cast iron -dry
Aluminium -kero or Rocol
Stainless steel - Gee (unsalted butter) or Rocol
Steels - soluble oil or Rocol

http://www.sutton.com.au/Assets/1420...edtapdrill.pdf
rocol.com.au - RTD Liquid

Aluminium -kero or Rocol or Soap!
Stainless steel - Gee (unsalted butter) or Rocol or soap !
Rog

FWB · #11 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 07:24 AM

i would save the money on the dies........just buy them as needed. you will use them very rarely. the taps, are a different story. be selective don't just go and buy a set. buy the sizes you need.
google your local industrial supply there in AU.......you will find many names of taps. don't get hand taps........get spiral flute gun taps, plug,.. they are stronger. the hand taps are 3 and 4 flute and the webbing is thin they snap off easily. the gun taps have one flute and will take more punishment.
if the supplier has a HSS cobalt get them they will be the strongest. a TIN coat will help with stainless tapping. as far as cutting oil, a dark sulfuric oil is the best.....yeah you can get buy with the soap and the kero and other home brews but after two holes the tools will be dull. get the cutting oil!!!!

regards, fred

Aussie Mike · #12 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 08:21 AM

I must admit that over the years the common sizes that I use heve been replaced wit good quality taps from Goliath threading. I usually buy the set of 3 of those sizes ie lead, intermediate and bottom.

I've also bougt a bunch of one off sizes from them like left hand taps, taper taps and Whitworth.

stephen low · #13 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 06:31 PM

Thanks folks for the extra details.

Gav had forgotten about Suttons cheers.

Mike I wouldn't know a good Taiwanese set from a ****e one to be honest so I'd rather get a brand name. Even the reference to the Hare & Forbes supplied brand of Toolmaster I have seen that brand name before but have no idea if it is good, bad or indifferent.

And thanks for the reminder on cutting oils I'll get a tube too.

Steve

Ralphy · #14 (**permalink**) 08-10-2011, 07:34 PM

I don't understand the physics. However a three fluted tap always seems to cut easier than a four or two flute tap. Four flute break the easiest, even the good ones.

Also spiral fluted will cut a stringer out. Meaning you will not have small chips, but a long string of a chip that spirals out.

Mrs flatchat · #15 (**permalink**) 08-11-2011, 04:24 AM

Production taps:-
Gun taps are the toughest, primarily designed for driving the swarf to the bottom or thru the hole --idealy thru hole.

Spiral taps idealy for blind holes --screws the swarf out of the hole

Roll taps idealy for sheet metal --forms a thread rather than cutting one.

Hand taps --a handy desperate last resort

UNC or NPT taps give the most drama with chipping, galling or breakage -- just a PITA

Pipe threads BSP (or NPT if you must) use "gun" taps straight ( the fitting is tapered for a jam fit) Most Ford stuff is NPT.

BSP and NPT look similar , but -- 1/8" - 3/8" is one pitch / " different, 1/2" - 3/4" same pitch, 1" - 2" half pitch / " difference - not to mention incl.thread angle, BS is 55°, UN is 60° along with metric

Metric taps -- for drilling size, just minus the thread pitch from the nominal O.D. eg M10 x 1.5 -- 10 - 1.5 = 8.5

Dave W --"Trefolex" (green death) is laced with asbestos or other carcinogens is it not ?

Rob. Smith · #16 (**permalink**) 08-12-2011, 06:03 AM

TOOL MASTER is chinese or tiawanese they are reasonably ok if you take care when using them. Don't lend them out and be prepared to replace them as they get blunt.

DaveW · #17 (**permalink**) 08-13-2011, 05:35 AM

Flatchat,
Trefolex is green, but i'm not sure about the carcigens thing, the msds says it contains petroleum gel, talc, vegtable oil and tallow, and that it may cause eye irritation if you stick the tap in your eye, but other than that all good.

Dave

boxhead · #18 (**permalink**) 08-13-2011, 04:10 PM

I just buy quality tas in the size I need, building my car I found M8x1.25, M6x1.0 & M8x1.5 covered just about everything