Towing "legally"

[spookypt]

I recently was pulled over by DOT for a random scales check and got talking to the officer about various things.. He was telling me about how many cars towing loaded car trailers aren't legal and they were doing a lot more random pull overs and fines with the scales...

While I was within my tolerances (F250 and enclosed alloy trailer) he mentioned many of the modern cars promoted with towing capacities etc of 3500kgs are towing overweight and illegally and are open to prosecution as there GCM exceeds the vehicle spec.

I was even more surprised that when I mentioned I was going to upgrade to an F350 that he said "make sure you get your license upgraded too!" As it has an GVM over 4500kg so I have to get a light truck license!!!


A light vehicle license in QLD (I think all states) is for over 4500kg GROSS VEHICLE MASS. It does NOT take trailer weight into consideration. Provided the towing vehicle has a GVM of under 4500kg and the trailer is below the maximum tow rating it is legal.

However..

Just because the GVM is 3500kg and the tow rating is 3500kg does not mean the combination can be 7000kg. You MUST ensure the GCM, Gross Combined Mass, is not exceeded. Of course, the more equipment you add, the less it's actual payload is. Remember once you add fuel, tyres, people and tools it more than likely reduces the amount of trailer weight you can legally tow with.

So if your Ford Ranger tow car GVM is 3200t and your GCM is 6000 even though your can tow a braked trailer up to 3500kg, if your at your 3200kg GVM on your tow car the most you can now tow is 2800kg. Not 3500kg.

It really opened my eyes as to how that all works. Driving on the M1 a lot like I do I'd reckon 2 out of 3 car trailers I see being towed would not meet with the above.........

Food for thought.

Spookypt

[stephen low]

Spook

Does that mean I'm screwed towing my light racing yacht down to the club behind my cobra - lol

Don't answer that, it's a rhetorical question, as I know the answer.

But I'm still planning on getting use of all my food groups at once as I do have a tow point set up on the cobra and will do this at least once for fun.

But yes many people are oblivious to towing requirements and as a major safety issue I am glad to see the plod is taking a bit more active role on this issue.

Cheers

Slo

[stiffy]

Spook,

Like most things in life we do not look at issue until they arise.......

I tow my Daytona (1100kg) with my 450kg trailer with my 1600kg Falcon wagon

Which has the 2300kg tow pack, electric brakes and air bag suspension.

But I also take spares, tools, beer, tyres, clothes, fuel and so on. I reckon I am

Adding 500kg's to the weight of the car.

I wanted the best tow car option ( for the 3/4 times per year I race ) with the

Most room. The Falcon certainly ticks all the boxes.

I think towing is so important, we spend thousands on our cars, years building

Them and I would hate to damage it while towing.

Towing for the first time is really scary, not only as you have your pride and joy

On the back but you need to drive like a truck driver (not take drugs and speed)

but with more braking distance than you are use to.

Let this be a lesson to all that tow ( more every year ) make sure you know the

Rules and drive accordingly.

How many times do you see trailers on the highway without wheels..........

It's a bug bear of mine.......

Stiffy

[spookypt]

Stiffy, using a BF 6 cylinder ute as an example....does that mean based on my rough calculations....

Ute GVM 2370kg's

Ute (and braked) trailer GCM 3810kg's

Means what your towing including tools fuel etc needs to be less than 1440kgs???

The part I'm confused about in the case above is the UTE has a kerb weight of 1750kgs.....so how on earth can it tow 2300kgs when without passengers its total GCM is 4050kgs..?????

Does it mean that in reality it could never tow 2300kgs?? (1750kg + driver 100kg + 100kg misc crap) means at best 1860kgs....

Where have I gone wrong?

[spookypt]

Stiffy using your figures...

1100kg car + 450kg trailer + 500kg tools etc + 2 people 180kg = 2230kg less 3810kgs GCM (?) means your 20kg over weight if your car weighs 1600kgs????

(Based on that GCM being correct for your car....)

Is that calculation right or am I getting my figures confused... Easily done in my case????

[dbn04]

I heard about this last summer, watch out if you load up your boat to go camping/ skiing, !
just sayin!

[Rog246]

as a foot note, qld transport are checking trailers and caravans tyres, making sure that they meet the regs as well. The majority of caravans use passenger tyres which meet the spec of an unladen van, but not when loaded up.
They are scaling them on the side of the road and then fining the driver !

So just put on your light truck radials and you'll be fine (so to speak)

Rog

[stiffy]

Spook,

I am not sure, all I know is that towing really wrecks the car/tranny and

stuffs the fuel economy

This is new to me, I was under the impression that I could tow so long

as the combined weight was under 2300kg......

The electric brake module has 3 settings, 1. when trailer is unloaded.

2. when the tow car is heavier than the load. 3 when the towing load is heavier

than the tow vehicle........

Your figures are correct except that I am 75kg's


stiffy

[Jaydee]

Just curious if anybody has a tow bar on their Cobra?
I'm planning to tow my Para motor light weight trailer.
JD

[stephen low]

JD

As I said it will happen on mine but that's because I'm copying a fellow that lived near me and built his second G-Force when I was first assembling mine and had a tow bar on it.

He had put a baby tow bar on both his cobras to tow a small covered box trailer.

This was because his cobra's were essentially his daily commute, he was retired, and the trailer carried his scale radio control model planes down to the airfield where he flew them.

I've also seen a hot rod locally that tows a racing dinghy and that reinforced my plan to give it a try in the cobra.

I'll be towing a mass of less than 200kgs in total and it will only be for local events at best.

Slo

[Treeve]

I'm thinking of xtending the wheelbase on a BA ute to load my clubbie on the tray and still tow a trailer.

Ford stats: http://www.ford.com.au/commercial/ne...s/spec-options

So I'm assuming a tare mass of 1700kg to allow for extra tray and chassis length, the GVM is 2820, so I've still got 1100kg ish on the tray (they're rated to 1200 as standard) so allowing 800kg for my car and tools I'm still in the clear. This would take the ute + clubbie to 2500kg.

The falcon has a listed tow capacity of 2300kg, but a GCM of 4890, so I'm still able to tow to capacity as well; I just need to be careful of what I load up, and where I put it. Heaviest thing I tow is a mates car at about 1400kg (I know it's less, closer to 1200) and his trailer is less than 750.

This plan has some real bonuses: it's cheap to buy the ute, it's cheap to run the ute, and although I can't certify my own work, I can compile the report so certification of the modification to a LWB is cheap too!

It's taken me a while, but I'm starting to see the issues with losing Ford models in Australia. The negatives to losing Holden is the loss of a cheap supply of V8's; since they both stopped putting T5 gearboxes in I'm not too fussed - you can keep your T56's, they're terrible.

Treeve

[spookypt]

The all seems about right Treeve... But geez it's one hell of a load.

[spookypt]

Originally Posted by Jaydee

Just curious if anybody has a tow bar on their Cobra?
I'm planning to tow my Para motor light weight trailer.
JD

Yep, tony stark has a trailer on his Harrison. Was at the nats in 2009 from memory. I'd say Wazza would have a pick somewhere.....

[Towmaster]

I guess it would be appropriate for me to chime in.... ????

This is the main reason that I bought my 2007 RA Rodeo 4X4
And then slotted in the 6.0 litre L98 V8. If you read the post then you will know.

Kerb weight 1750 (It's actually lighter than standard thanks to the alloy engine and no 4x4 system)
GVM 2900kg means I can have 1.15 ton of ****e in the car - fuel, tools, me....
GCM 5900kg means I can have a 3 ton trailer
Towing braked 3000kg

My engineer told me that the Towing rating comes with the Vin, so no matter what engine I put in it retains the 3 ton towing capacity.

The heaviest I tow is about 2850 kg on the back. That is 1350kg for the (enclosed)trailer and about 1500kg of acrylic. Four wheel electric brakes, 50mm square axles and a breakaway ensure it's all pretty safe. The Rodeo will easily sit on 130 with that weight on. I can tell you the diesel wouldn't do that....

Fuel economy is about 12 litres / 100 empty and around 19 litres / 100 loaded.

Towmaster....

[spookypt]

Tow, that set up sounds pretty good.

Its interesting how some people think about things....I was talking to the owners of the F350 I wanted to buy this morning regarding licenses. Most would think that you could drive it on a car license like the F250 but due to the F350s' GVM you can't......and yet they have owned the truck since new and never bothered to upgrade their licenses.

So they were driving the vehicle effectively unlicensed the whole time. Stuff that. Kill someone and the pandoras box opens... And for the sake of a $200 license upgrade and a few hours (if your lucky) at DOT.

Just shows its not just people towing overloaded, its people driving with licenses not suitable to the vehicles they drive....

As he said to me this morning...."we've been pulled over by the police and they've never questioned it."

Gee, if there was a white sheet draped over a mangled car heaven forbid I'd bet its the 1st thing they'd ask for...

Anyway, don't mean to drag the whole topic down... blatant ignorance just $hits me!

Spookypt

[Legless]

If you discover you're over your GVM it'll be a good excuse to enter the new class 1 at the Nationals. Entry and regs are now out.

Quote 'CLASSES AND ELIGIBILITY:

Class 1 – Cobra Class – Cobra driven to Goulburn and the track 15 inch wheels, no trailers, Engine unlimited – no forced induction. Male

[spookypt]

Legless, that sounds a lot like most of the entrants pre-2005.

How times have changed.


Spookypt

[boxhead]

Hmmm, I wonder how mine would go driving over?

[Legless]

I'm sure you'd make it Dave albeit a little weather beaten, but like all of us, its the hassle of getting back home if you break something that's the pain in the A. Spook for for the Nationals I think I'd rather be a 'try hard' and tow it to be safe.

[Rob. Smith]

A local p-nut rolled his van and trailer and complained to the council and media about the poor roads.....He was towing an XC falcon wagon 0n a float with a mazda box Van !!!