Replica Copies

[PCC]

After scanning the latest Snaketales I picked up an article denouncing "hot rod" Cobra's and pushing for the Cobra Club to encourage "originality".

Areas picked on included non Ford engines - what do you have to say to that oh Dark Siders?, strange body features - Scotty, I think he was having a go at your front air dam!, and flashy modern interiors - mine's definitely a candidate there

Such "Cobra's" should be given negative points when judged!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Well - what do you say?

I know what I think - its your car, do as you please

Since when did a Ford Escort or Mini remain as standard without some aftermarket gadget / accessory added to please its owner.

Now we all know that to own a Cobra Replica in Australia you will never have an exact copy of an original. The writer misses the fact that 95% of the cars on the road are fibreglass for example.

I'm sure there are purists amongst us, but let us not forget these are KIT cars, and as such each one will have its own traits - not like a mass produced Magna (sorry Les).

Oh, and finally what is an exotic drivetrain - is that an auto?



Sorry - just had to get on my soapbox

[Aussie Mike]

They can kiss my pimple bespotted hairy white butt.

I've seen a lot of Cobra replicas over the years and a few real ones in the US. Sorry to say it but most of the so called authentic replicas in Australia don't come close.

My answer to them is this: I'm not building a Shelby Cobra Replica, I'm building a Murphy Cobra Original.

Cheers

[vettestr]

I think there is a couple of groups within the group and we all play nice. I build a HOT ROD version or the Cobray-C3 at Cobras N Vettes. We represent this car/kit as a hot rod version and find it well recieved. It is fiberglass, altered wheelbase at 98 not 90 and built on the Vette chassis. We do offer Ford motor and transmission adapters but most are chevy powered.
I do not enter in Ford Show as not there to anger anyone but at Custom or Open shows we do quite well. I respect the purists' and wish I owned a Kirkham myself.
I feel if you treat people right and do what you commit too there is plenty of room for everybody. Pushing to get into a Ford only show with a chevy powered Hot Rod is just not right so would never do that either.
I believe the group of people drawn to this love of their cars are just great people.

[400TT]

I think individuality and creativity really add a dimension to these cars. Just look at variety of Cobras we have in the club.

If you like originality, then go build a more original Cobra. If you don't that's fine as well. Everyone has their own ideas.

I personally consider myself a hot rod builder.

And is this guy even aware of the current approval rules and restrictions???

Sorry I just can't stop laughing.

[Excaliber]

It's tough to build one to exacting standards in the USA. Gotta be a nightmare in the land down under, with the restrictive laws etc. I really admire those that come as close as possible, to much money and time for my blood!

,,,beside that, everyone on the planet knows YOU guys "down under" refuse to be put into ANY automotive mold. Rebels!!

[Aussie Mike]

I just don't like the people who denounce "Hot Rod" Cobras. If they are going to get picky about our cars they want to make sure their own camp is in order first.

How many Aussie replicas have original style round tube frames? Most if not all the Cobras down here are 427 replicas yet how many are even running an FE motor? Almost none I would say. I don't think running an injected ford 302 makes it a whole lot more accurate than an LS1 or a Lexus motor.

I agree with 400TT. The individual touch each of us gives our cars makes them much more interesting. If you want to go to a car show where every car is exactly the same just go for a cruise past the yard at your local Ford or Holden dealer (Boring!!).

I relinqush the soap box.

[400TT]

Actually that's one of the things that stands out in QLD, we just don't have any real big block presence here. Yeah, technically we have big block Cobras up here, but you just never see them.

Wish we had some big bangers around, now that would add an extra dimension to the cars up here.

No chance of getting them approved now, only way of getting one is to import a reg'd one from another state.

[grumpy]

PCC,

While some would agree with the article, one needs to stand off and look at how the US DMV's of the States view the building process along with how they are classed for position by the "show judges classes" (concours/events), and SAAC/Registry classifications for a AC/COBRA.

With the original AC COBRA as a reference point, the only true COBRA, then we tend to position our cars as to the closeness of the original in detailing. Most that have more authentic detailing tend to take offense at MIATA drivers with a COBRA nose at "compaing" that COBRA to their very 90% original detailed COBRA.

How do you feel, isn't the fella in the HOLDEN with the COBRA hood scoop and COBRA decals with a FORD 302 and "COBRA" valve covers just as much a COBRA as yours, and be placed by youat the "cruise ins, car shows, etc.?

By most states (in the US) governing rules would have a Corvette frame/susp, 440 MOPAR engine, Tremec transmissioned, Ford 9" Differential, Fiberglassed 96" wheel base JOE psuedo COBRA body and fiberglass inner panels, classed LEGALLY as a Corvette on the Title and registration process, NOT A COBRA. Other states used the "custom assembled", "specialty built", home built" or similar monikers to title the car with fabricated frames.

I really think it is just a "term" used to "simplify" the type of car it actually is. The point/issue changes when anyone notes that their COBRA is "JUST LIKE THE ORIGINAL", then distinctions are made as to the originality, and therein lies the flap that has insued for years.

Many have attempted to set up a guideline on terms for the application (including SAAC), no one pays attention. I tend to go for ORIGINALITY based on the AC COBRA, as do most, but some buyers are lured into buying a COBRA based on comments by individuals or the seller/manufacturer that is "just like the original" or a "replica" of the original, all the time knowing it only looks like an original AC COBRA. It's the outright misrepresentation made by some that boils most of the Club Cobra members, not comment from a newcomer COBRAphile, and they are taken to task here

That being the case, you take it from there, we all love COBRAs and tend to call them all COBRAs, and tend not calling them kits, replicas, rebodied, mustangs, or whatever actually applies.

Drive em and show them off, whether built in your basement or by AC CARS, Ltd. they are a hoot and a joy to own over any of the 80% of the cars out there!

grumpy

[Ron61]

Well mine is about as far from looking original as you can get and still have it some what resemble a Cobra. When it was built, I didn't want it to be confused with the originals. Also was surprised when a guy asked me if it was a Rambler Convertible. I hadn't planned to get that far from loking like a Cobra.

Most of the Cobras around here have very little resemblance to the originals and nearly all of us have 94 inch wheel bases. However none of us go to Concurs type shows either. And in the smaller shows, all component cars go into a mass class called Special Construction and that means everything not built by one of the major car companies. I even saw a fiberglass bodied, handbuild, 18 Wheeler Tractor at one show. Built to full scale and a darn good job.

Vettestr,
Maybe in one of the all Ford shows if they get picky you may not be well received, but at the last one here when Red Bluff Ford opened their new facility we had several 32 Fords with 350 Chevy engines in them. I never heard anyone at all complain about it.

Ron

[vettestr]

Hey Ron,
These are great toys and bring even greater people together. I have even seen a VW powered Cobra at the AHA at Knotts B., it was parked near the wooden car.. no kidding a wooden car body with matching trailer.
It will never stop and thats OK too, after all its the people and joy these toys bring to the owner. I do not get the same thrill out of a (what ever) that you might and visaversa but lets have a drink and swap stories and tell bigger fibs about HP. I'll buy the first round!

[David Hodgson]

Hi Guys
This topic is like a merry-go-round (carousel) goes 'round in circles and raises its head every so often. Ten years ago the issue of points awarding for originality in the show and shine at the nationals was a point of contention amongst some in the club. I even wrote an article about it for snaketales in about '96. The issue then was not about hot rodding, as there were no Lexus V8's used, the most "exotic" was a turbo RB 30 6cyl Nissan engine, and John Cini was the first I saw to venture outside the square with a modern style plush interior, the main conjecture then was about correct part number tail lights and things like correct style wheels, instruments and instrument layout and general correctness, some guys had a passion for this and like the author of the article PCC refered to, felt they should be rewarded for this.

Without over catagorising, there seems to be 2 groups of Cobra enthusiasts, one being the guys who have had an affliction about these cars since they were boys, and have a passion for how and what the car was in the sixties, the second being the guys who love the concept of a high powered engine in an agile sports car with carisma of the Cobra shape, and allowing them to build their own personalised car, with all the mod. cons. such as the Murphy Original Cobra. I fit the first group but accept that unless I go to great lenghts what I will end up is a good comprimise, capturing the essence of the '60's Cobra. I'm happy. I also appreciate the more modern version's as it sticks it up the noses of MGF and Z3 owners that a guy in his own garage can build something as classy as his showroom effort.

I don't denounce either interpretation, but you do have to admit that a modern interior with woodgrain and chrome trim and plush leather akin to Z3's etc, can look more stunning and may attract more points than a plain black interior with a flat vinyl dash fitted with 6 or seven plain round instruments akin to the '66 427. Is that fair? Who knows.

Do we need a different system of judging at the nationals? I don't think so. We are not and simply can't run a concourse.

Each of these two groups are not wrong or right but these two groups will always have differing opinions about some aspect of the hobby, lets just live with it and get on enjoying our cars and each others company.

Next for the soapbox!

[NASSTY]

The only thing that stays constant is change itself.

With laws and authorities the way they are, I think you’re open to being accused of being short sighted if you are determined to hold on to originality at all costs.

I’m currently building and I would be disappointed if someone were to bag what motor/suspension/emission/exhaust etc etc I was using in order to comply for registration.

I also think using a late model EFI engine and donor parts makes more sense and enjoyment than using 60’s technology. It’s no surprise that most replicas perform better than the originals.

At the end of the day it’s your car and your personality on show.

I think what’s more important is that either the chase for originality or competitiveness to outdo one another by use of more & more HP or more exotic finishes and interiors, does not erode the good spirit of the Nationals. Most car clubs, to some degree suffer from this which is not conducive to developing an open and friendly club for new members. New members will give new blood and future growth. If new members feel that doors are closed to them because their cobras don’t conform to either end of the spectrum, then ultimately the survival of car clubs or meets such as the Nats are at stake.

Cheers

[PCC]

Hmmmmm..............

Definitely a soapbox subject this one

Al, I can vouch for the QLD Cobra Club who are made up of guys and gals who simply enjoy themselves. What brings them together is a passion for Cobra's and GT 40's. Like most clubs they are made up of all sorts - the racers, waxers and the extremists. Just look at Craig's 850HP beast.

What I enjoy is the "young" blood in these clubs who through their enthusiasm ensure that such clubs will always continue for a long time.

Back on the street, 99% of people who look at the car say "Wowwww its a Cobra" and that basically sums it up.

Just the sheer look of the car draws interest and add to that the V8 or whatever big motor just tops it off.

Very few know the finer details of such a car and as such just to own a car that resembles a Cobra is enough for me.

I am proud to own a car that is admired by most and provides such enjoyment to own

[pneall]

I am with you PCC.

I couldnt be happier with what I have got. It looks great and goes like at cut snake. I incorporated things I wanted and never intended to build anything close to an original as the NSW ADR's precluded that from the beginning.

I am just and no one except except the guy with the radar gun can take that away.


Phil

[NASSTY]

Originally posted by PCC


Hmmmmm..............

Definitely a soapbox subject this one

Al, I can vouch for the QLD Cobra Club who are made up of guys and gals who simply enjoy themselves. What brings them together is a passion for Cobra's and GT 40's. Like most clubs they are made up of all sorts - the racers, waxers and the extremists. Just look at Craig's 850HP beast.

Peter,

I totally agree with you re the Qld CC. Pauline and I were on hols in July this year and went along to a Sunday brekky.

We were greeted with very warm welcomes and we felt like honory Qld CC members for the day. It was also great to met fellow CC forum users such as Scott, Cameron, Craig and Les. Craig took me for a spin around the block which was the highlight of the hols.

I've been to 2 cobra nats and both were very enjoyable and I've met new people. I don't think the Nats currently have any issues that I've referred. I'd just hate it if they developed over time.

[Rebel1]

Ohhh..I remember you now Al...you were the fella with Pauline?.

[ledge]

Wwll i have to say that since i first seen a Cobra i have always loved the shape of the car , And i must admit if i was asked some questions about particulars regardind the shape size and location of origonal parts i would most likely get it wrong because to my way of thinking is simmilar to Mikes , Im building my own sports car but there is no better looking open top car in kit form than the Cobra . That being said it would be nice to get it close to the original but i dont think it is worth spending extra money to do it ,Hell they cost enough any way .
As to the show seen let me just ask this question
You go out and buy any car mag ie Street machine or simmilar . And look at any Torana or XW Falcon ,Chev Buick whatever , these cars have had more modificatons than what most of us do to our Cobras and im sure they still enter they respective classes for judging So if you had a spare million and got an origanal Cobra and changed a few things like say wheels and added a couple more guages maybe you blew the gearbox so fitted a 6 speed do you still have an origanal Cobra ,Yes you do and no matter what we do i think we all still have Original Murphys or 400tt's or Ledge,s that look like a Cobra


Paul

[Bathrone]

The original Cobras dont meet my engineering standards anyway. I would not want to own one. The better kits are just simply a better sports car and I think if the Gen III fits well, and is a reasonably built powerplant thats affordable for me then it should go into my project.

I probably cant afford a C12 BMW engine with all the trick gear in it and the GEN III provides a reasonable package that while is backwards in some respects, it has the displacement and reliability with enough technology to make it happen for me.

[decooney]

PCC,
IMO: There are so many copies of the originals now, and that is great. But what also interests me is those with something different and exotic.

I say worry less about what others think and do what makes you happy. But, be prepared to have your standard responses ready when someone is asking why this or why that... because they will ask.

[750hp]

Where do you guys get off on hot-rodding and bastardising the Cobra shape???

Oh, for the perfectly spaced hoodscoop rivets, the correct number of stitches in the seats, the 6 volt Rebats that can no longer hold a charge, the real/original/authentic CSX tag on the footbox. I long for the inaccurate gauges, the flimsy oversize steering wheel, the non-heim jointed, non-adjustable suspension, the lap belts frayed from 40 years in the sun. I dream of wallowing along with the original bias ply tyres, living the dream.....

Seriously though, I can see both sides of the fence. I bought my first Cobra because of the trouble the builder had gone to in trying to make the car look "authentic" as far as the Qld transport laws at the time allowed. When the need for speed took over, I didn't want to hotrod what was already a really nice car.

I built my current car with no regard for the originals of the '60s (some might say no regard for the law or aesthetics either, but that's another story !). It's for me, and other people's opinions, while interesting and sometimes humourous, ultimately don't matter.

Having said all of that, the next Cobra I own will be a Kirkham. Maybe I've gone full circle, but the thought of an alloy Cobra that looks "right" really appeals to me at the moment. That's not to say it will be lacking in the horsepower department. Some things will never change