Is it worth it (this Cobra)

[Stu351]

G'Day Gents,

I've been a browsing non-member for some time now, but it's time I need to ask some questions about a Cobra I inspected yesterday, pics as follows:

http://au.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/stu...bum?.dir=/3654

It's for sale for AU$10,000, practically as-is.

There are no engineer certificates, build manual or instructions, or any of that technical kind of stuff provided.

It is a DRB body in a Toyota Crown (shortened??) chassis. All suspension and steering is in place and set-up, although shocks and springs aren't fitted nor supplied. Diff looks like a modified Jag style, although discs are at the wheel hub (not near diff centre). No brake calipers or brake lines, but 4 wheel discs- yes. No fuel tank or lines, no interior, wiring, internal/engine/boot panelling. I don't even know if the chassis is complete! No engine mounts, windscreen, roll-bars, etc. As you can see- what you see is what you get. I guess the worst thing is the fact that without the engineer certificates or approvals, I could be buying a dud. Should I scratch deeper on this one (engage an engieer to inspect) , or walk away?

I have mechanical, welding (unqualified), auto electrical and body prep/spraypainting abilities, but never tackled an unfinished Cobra before.

Generally, I am looking for an unfinished project, or (preferably), an older kit car, licensed, but in need of TLC for me to play with, drive and enjoy regularly.

Thanks in advance for all your help guys.
Regards,
Stu

[400TT]

Personally I wouldn't bother.

This is a pretty rare and undesirable option. DRB didn't make many crown-based kits, before changing to their own space frame chassis.

Also a crown based kit, even if you can get it approved/reg'd, will have a lot lower resale than a space frame kit.

The only advantage I can see, is if you can get it registered as a Toyota Crown rebody. That should mean that you only have to comply with ADR's(emissions etc) that were relevent to age of that crown chassis. I really have no idea, but it might be possible.

Best bang for buck will be an older DRB or RMC, partly completed. DRB changed from narrower guard body shape to wider 427 body shape in 1995, so watch out. DRB would be much more common than RMC and cheaper and easier to build...but probably not worth much as same conditon RMC. DRB have a stigma(torana based). I think all of kits have advantages and disadvantages and I personally quite like DRB's. I've built both DRB & Harrison.

Actually an RMC should be more common in WA, that's their home. And also where a lot of windscreens come from.

First thing I would do is contact engineer. Try a few and get one that is enthusiastic about Cobras. Then get current rules and regulations for WA.

Then I would start researching what parts cost etc. Especially body chrome stuff, if they are included with kit, makes it worth much more. For example, windscreen is worth $1450 last I checked. Then look at quality of job, wiring is a real good yardstick to use if it's there. Is neat, did they use lots of colours, does it look like a quality job. It's hard to hide dodgey wiring.

Too much to list here as to what else to look for. I really think you will have to widen your search to include the East Coast. You can always ask for club members to inspect a car for you.

Posting here is a good start.

[ERA 626]

dont walk, run.

[Rebel1]

I agree with CW.

Keep your ten grand and look further. To give you some idea...

I think RMC or G-force charge about $12000.00 for a chassis body kit. Thats with all hinged bits fitted. ( bonnet, doors, boot etc.)

There are a lot of kits sitting under houses in Aussie land that will never be finished...all you got to do is find them.

Ohhhhhh..and whats this " Gents " bit??....first time here and you're already calling us names.


Cheers

[Rebel1]

Here's something that may interest you....

In the November 04 Snaketales magazine, there was an advert with an RMC kit for sale.

Body said to be straightened. ($3500.00 spent on body)
Modified rear guards to include 427 style lip
Single skin bonnet with a more original scoop
Jag diff fitted with brakes etc
Coil over shocks all round
pedal box
wiring
fuel tank with sender
alloy flip up fuel filler
rebel mags with new BFG's

never been registered.....$19000.00

At the right price that would be an excellent purchase. Don't know if its still available..

Cheers

[Aussie Mike]

To quote from the movie "The Castle"

"$200 for Jousting sticks? Tell him he's Dreaming"

That thing is just going to cause you a lot of heartache. Add up what you're getting before going too far. It may look like a lot of stuff there but you will find most of it's useless.

It's a Crown chassis for a start which is a mark against it. There have been some nice cars built on this chassis but as 400TT mentioned this is going to really hurt resale.

The chassis has been chopped around and an IRS added. This may seem like a good thing but it's going to add $$$ to the engineers report. You may have got away with not doing torsion and beaming tests with the factory chassis but now that it's been cut and modified that means a lot more work for the engineer.

I don't think The engine will pass the current emissions regs even on LPG and on the crown chassis. You'd need to speak to an engineer on this one.

For the money your getting a half finished body, a chopped up crown chassis and a set of wheels you probably won't keep anyway.

For around $12-15K you could build a rolling DRB, RMC, Homebush, Harrison or Classic Revival. All of which have engineers reports on the chassis and a lot of the hard work done. And they will sell for significantly more than a Crown based car down the track.

You also get the after sales support to help you get your car finished and on the road.

Remember a bit of variation in the initial outlay on the body chassis isn't much in the scheme of things. Other costs down the track will even that out. A windscreen, interior, badges, electrics, motor and box etc all cost the same regardles of chassis.

Another thing to consider is that to paint a car with a good body and nice fitting panels will cost you less. Body prep is where most of your costs go in painting a car. There's probably $500 worth of paint and materials in most paint jobs the rest is elbow grease.

Cheers

[Mando]

I think the kit comes from Rob at G-Force in WA. Im fairly certain you can still buy a Toyota Crown based kit that he makes. Not my cup of tea.

Regards.

[400TT]

Originally posted by Mando


I think the kit comes from Rob at G-Force in WA. Im fairly certain you can still buy a Toyota Crown based kit that he makes. Not my cup of tea.

Regards.

DRB, a long time ago, used to do Toyota Crown based ones as well. But I thought they only sold a couple and then went space frame. This would have been around 12 years ago, maybe more. Of course DRB don't do them anymore.

All Cobra kits today still suffer stigma of Toyota Crown kits. Listen to public at any car show and you will here someone say, yeah, they are based on Toyota Crown chassis when they point to all the space frame chassis cars. Maybe you can build a nice car with Toyota Crown, but there are a lot of sacrifices.

You can get good value completed cars. You see odd DRB for around $30k, saw one recently in Brisbane that was only 2 years old. Yeah, it ran Torana diff and Torana brakes, but the rest was nicely done. Drop in a 2nd hand 9" from a Torana and some better brakes and it be good on road and good on the track.

[GAV MILDURA]

About the only thing going for it would be the exemption from emmissions laws.
My grand dad could vouch for the ride quality of the crown....
GREAT IF YOUR INTERESTED IN TOWING A CARAVAN!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Stu351]

You guys have been great, and after making my first post, did contact an engineer (which was a bit of fate as I was reading an old Street Machine and a list of engineers was compiled in it!) and I then contacted DRB direct.
By this time I am well and truly sprinting from it, and for what DRB will supply for a smidge over $14K, I get a whole lot more (including Engineer's OK, ADR approvals, build manual, etc) and a whole lot less trouble. Not to mention dealing with a reputable company!
I can also say that the call to the engineer was very beneficial, and in the short amount of time we discussed the project in general, he confirmed a lot of my suspicions and assumptions I had before embarking on the job.
As for now I will keep my eyes open, but will be steering toward an ok'd unfinished project (such as the recommendation above - thanks Rebel1!) or a DRB rolling chassis with one of their option packages. As it is my first Cobra, I'm looking for a nice street car, so I'm not too fussed with expensive suspension, leather interior, etc. All that can come when I earn the coin to buy it!
Once again, thankyou all very much for your knowledge, and hopefully will get a chance to cruise with you'se one day (or just chat at a show). I live in Perth anyway guys incase you were wondering.
Thanks Again!,
Stu.

[Stu351]

But I can get certain leniancy around emissions laws by running LPG if I want to run a 351c right?

DRB advised that I would have to utilise a not-older-than 5 year old motor with their kit. If I can run my 351 though, that would be tops. I'll investigate later..... but it would be nice to use my worked 351, since it's cost enough already!!!

[Stu351]

Hey Rebel1, is there contact details of that one in Rattlesnakes??

Cheers!

[Aussie Mike]

Sorry to say it Stu but I don't think you will get your 351C through even on LPG. I looked at this option since I've got a BB Chev in the shed but the engineer said No-Go. At the time the motor had to be 1992 or later but the laws are even tighter now.

Good luck with it and keep us posted on your progress.

Cheers

[Rebel1]

The contact details for the above advert was:

Mick 0416 287 814 , I think he must be in Queensland because he mentioned his scoop to be the same as the Paul Gillis car.

I wouldn't pay what he is asking, but would be worth chasing up if you're in the market.

Cheers

[BMK]

Stu351

Welcome to the 'Forum"

My choice would be either the Harrison or the Classic Revival

If you go DRB check with the guys to see who their agent is in WA. They may have someone who can walk you through a build.

I have seen a few people on the 'Forum" here from WA. Maybe a"Thread" with... ''WA enthusiast needs advice'... may flush them out??

Cheers

Bernie..

[Tony Cram]

Stu351,

A few of us here in VIC have made the venture to Perth and bought on the road RMC's. Mine is an early RMC which was delivered here to my front door for a little more than $30K. It was a little run down but was built well and had the advantage of being on the road with a carburetted engine. (302C). Cleaned her up put a roll bar on and got a soft top made and she is as good as new. I spent 2 years researching and then decided to buy on the road. I bought mine from All American Autos.

There are a couple of others here in the vic club who bought in WA also, one is around a 96 model and the other I think is 98 model. They paid around the $30k mark also and both are very good cars.

The previous threads have given some very good advice.

Regards


TC

[400TT]

Better look for something else older to put that 351 into, unless Perth rules are very, very relaxed.

You could have gotten away with 351 in QLD probably a couple of years ago. We were still allowing carby cars to be registered.

Lots of good kits out there. If you are building and do most of everything yourself, and want a nice Cobra, it will cost $40k-$50k. DRB will be slightly cheaper to build than say a Harrison or Classic Revival, due to cheaper suspension/rear end etc.

Harrison I built with my brother, we tried every trick in book to build it cheap, shopped around, lived at swap meets, but it still cost $30k as a bare car without paint, nice interior and missing a few nice chrome bits. And we used a $1500 Lexus engine. It's now cost a little more due to fancy ECU and some fun stuff.

So as other guys have said, it's often cheaper to buy complete. And these days it is a nice bonus to not have to go through approval. But you don't have fun of doing it yourself.

[Batman]

G'day Stu351
I'm one of the 'OTHERS' that Tony is talking about. I went westward and cam eback with a running, registered, roadworthy snake that I picked up from Campbellfield and laughed hysterically all the way home.
All the fun with no bad words or bloodied knuckles and all for around $30K.
Get onto Robert (?) at All American in Osborne Park (08) 9242 4888 and see what he has in stock or coming up. He may have some contacts for partially built kits if you still want to go that way.
I saw some of his stuff on a web site but fu%$ed if I can find it now.

Something else to confuse the issue.

Cheers
Batman

[BMK]

Hell we were lucky to get you guys back after you went to the west..

Bernie

[Rebel1]

Originally posted by Bernie Knight


Hell we were lucky to get you guys back after you went to the west..

Bernie

Dunno if I'd call that good luck though Bernie