Battery lock out switch and rubber trims

[stephen low]

Back again with a couple more questions.

Had bought a single contact battery cut off switch but my sparking is suggesting a twin contact jobbie so as to fully cut off engine. A very sensible suggestion seeing as a hot rod mate knew of a bloke burnt to death as his pumps kept pouring fuel out after a crash!

So a twin contact is the go but for racing purposes, what is the requirement for access? I know enough that the location is highlighted by the blue triangle, I believe, or am I wrong?

Where does this need to be and where do you guys generally tend to put the key?

Also thinking about trim rubber for doors and boot, know of a couple of places to try but what am I asking for? Is there a certain sized material to suit each purpose?

Cheers

[sideshow]

for racing u need the red key easily accessable

full on track cars have like a choke cable to pull on the red key from outside the car and also u need stickers showing where the switch and battery is

i have the double swithc battery keys but theyre not cheap

new efi engines usually wont turn of with a basic battery key
thats y they invented the double switching type

if the key is in boot then u need to leave the boot unlocked or key in the boot lock when racing

but at end of day depending on what class u race will depend what u need to do eventually if u get too serious in racing your car becomes more a race car and less a road car due to racing rules and regulations and also depending how serious u want to win

[Aussie Mike]

A lot of your modern injections systems let the ECU control the pump. If the ECU detects the engine hasn't fired in 5 seconds they shut the pump off. If the engine stalls it also shuts the pump off. That's how I've got mine set up but it's an LS1, the Ford ECU might work a little differently.

I've got a battery switch made by Flaming River. It's very solid and has a good feel to it. Bernie reckons it looks like a B&D garage door handle but I don't care. Some thieving bugger can't steal the plastic key with this setup. My switch just isolates the battery, I let the ECU take care of the rest.

Flaming river also do one that has double contacts so you can use it to disconnect the alternator output or if your wquipped with a magneto to shut it down. Expensive though at probably well over $100 by the time you get it in from the US.

Cheers

[sideshow]

i have fitted afew of the double switching type

they are a pain sometimes the engine wont turn off if connected to alternator

best spot to turn off power is power tp the coils this will instantly shut the engine down

i try to not put it to any ecu wires

another thing i use is a tachometric relay it works of rpm signals

if there is an rpm signal then it will turn on a relay and i use this for fuel pump

so if the engine stalls the pump then stops these are used on most race cars that run old style sytems

any efi system has a way to control the pump to meet standards

thats if the person has wired it up right

[Aussie Mike]

Originally Posted by sideshow

any efi system has a way to control the pump to meet standards

thats if the person has wired it up right

Mine seems to work fine. When you turn the key on the pump runs for a few seconds then stops. When you crank the motor the ECU detects its turning over and turns the pump on again.

Cheers

[stephen low]

Thanks guys, my fellow is into performance cars and race and performance speedboats so I have faith he's switched on in this regard. He was the one that suggested the dual contact switch in the first place.

In terms of track, at this time, its just Nats, Shelby Fest and general car clubing events I want to run around the tracks in. I recognise there is a serious compromise between set ups for street versus track and mine will be a street car for now.

With this in mind what locations are suggested for the lock out key guys?

Cheers

[400TT]

We've always just used a single cheap plastic one. And that's all I use in my GT40(efi).

Originally Posted by stephen low

I recognise there is a serious compromise between set ups for street versus track and mine will be a street car for now.

What compromise? My brother has driven his Cobra the 2000k+ round trip to Cobra Nationals, raced and won the crown. Actually he has done that more than once. Stephen, I can see you doing that.

[stephen low]

I'll give anything a go with what I have to start with but I've got to get through reg. first Craig. If Mike's grin, on Youtube, was anything to go by at the Fest, I know I'll be having fun too!!

Unless my ECU does provide cut off with a single contact key, I'm not risking safety for the sake of a double contact set up.

However the question still is, where are these keys normally located?

Plums gallery pic show the key beside the battery in the boot, presuming your boot is unlocked for racing is this acceptable during race use? Or does the key have to protrude from an external surface more readily reached by anyone for safety reasons?

Keen to know of both general locations and those more specifically for race applications if there is a difference.

Cheers

[vettestr]

A dual contact (battery kill opens + and - side) switch is the most straight forward approach but a second method is available. The reason each side is opened on a dual contact switch is because the alternator can produce a feedback or enough amperage when running to keep the engine running (with a single side contact switch) or without battery supply voltage. A clue to the reason this happens is the footnote in the installation instructions for MSD ignitions (they supply a diode with their 6AL Ign.. control box) A simple diode installed in the battery supply wire run stops this RUN ON condition. This same diode when installed allows the use of a single sided kill switch. Without this diode a 2 or dual contact kill switch is needed to ensure the alt. does not allow a RUN ON condition. You can read the installation instructions on line from MSD web site to check out what I am saying but a diode is only a couple of bucks to purchase and much cheaper than a 2 sided kill switch. The price of a 2 sided contact switch is pretty small when you think of the big picture and if you just go $$$ crazy you can buy a diode and 2 contact switch.
Just poking fun here but I do like the idea myself about keeping the ground side of the cars electronics grounded or using a single sided switch. We all seem to install newer electronics on our toys and some of them are susceptible to voltage spikes that a continuous ground (not opened by kill switch) absorbs spikes better in my opinion. That is just my 2 cents and welcome thoughts of others about value of keeping things grounded.
Jeff C

[NASSTY]

Originally Posted by Aussie Mike

Mine seems to work fine. When you turn the key on the pump runs for a few seconds then stops. When you crank the motor the ECU detects its turning over and turns the pump on again.

Cheers

EECV's (Ford 'puter) works the same way.

Cheers

[400TT]

Originally Posted by stephen low

However the question still is, where are these keys normally located?

Personally I would locate the cut-off key in the interior. That's what we have done in both of our cars. Most common places I have seen are dash(or just under), just beside the tunnel near dash or on the back wall between the seats. Obviously some placements are better/easier depending on where your battery/cabling actually ends up being run.

[Aussie Mike]

Mines located on the rear bulkhead between the seats. It's in easy reach with your left hand from the drivers seat even with the harness on. You can see it between the seats in this pic:



Cheers

[Mando]

I see what Bernie means .

Regards Mando.

[jess]

Mine still runs on when you turn the battery switch off ,

I tried diodes but didn't seem to work, eventually after a while it switches off

but its really not good enough in case of an accident especially with EFI

pumps, i will try switching the ecc off or cut pwr to ign switch maybe a duel

switch is the way to go.

Cheers
jess

[stephen low]

Mando I agree, that's the automatic roller door opener as Mike pulls into the drive, he's fixed electronics the backside of the handle that are actuated as he turns it. Sorry Mike but it's out of place with all your other good work!!

Seriously though I don't want to emulate the BBQ hotrodder and Jess seems to have struck the same problem but I will feed the diode info to my sparky.

Maybe a dash or off dash location for ease, but i did get the impression from the sparky that he was thinking some king of keyhole entry through the bodywork for the key. This maybe more what he is used to but it didn't take my fancy.

Does a big fat red key sticking somewhere out of the dash tend to attract the idiots looking at the cars, such that they turn the key or worse take off with them?

Cheers

[Aussie Mike]

It'll look fine once I machine up a billet surround to cover the retaining nut. It'll probably hav ON-OFF engraved into it or something like that. The handle itself is polished aluminium and looks OK in my opinion. It's just where it comes through the pannel that looks a bit dodgy.

Cheers

[Philm]

I now have an all metal switch made by Moroso. It is a very positive on and off motion. I had the plastic type but over the years I have worn it out.

I have mounted it on the tunnel so it is in easy reach, I recon if something is going wrong that is the first thing to do.

The "black fur" arround it is the remains of the carpet.

Les, yes that is how I was able to get in postion



Phil

[Mando]

Thats a sorry piece of photographic work there Phil.
Lucky you can drive better than you take photos!

Regards.

[Philm]

Hey Mando,
Yep your right, ****house pic.

Is this better



Phil

[Plums]

Philm, off topic (though it does use power and rubber), where did you get your heater???