Importing Kits

[Strw]

Hello All
I dont want to sound stupid (too Late) does anybody import kits and is this cost effective? I am still looking around and havent completely settled on any one kit yet but I came accross the Factory Five webpage http://www.factoryfive.com/rdsterhome.html and they will do you a complete kit for US$20,000.00 minus tyres, engine, transmission and fuel pump. Freight from the US to Australia is about $2,000.00. I know I would have to pay some kind of duty, are there any other hidden costs? Would these pass ADR?

What do people generally think of these ideas?

Scott

[400TT]

This is what you would need to do once you get it here:

Chassis would need to pass beaming & torsional testing.
Need door side intrusion bars fitted to ADR specs.
If in QLD etc you would also need a fibreglass impact test.
Convert it to right-hand drive. Not sure about factory five, but they might offset the engine/tunnel to the right-hand side.
Pretty sure you would have to do your own engine/transmission mounts for LS1 or Boss 5.4.
Find an engineer that is happy to approve something like this.
Got through more drama than most with local transport authority.

Basically you take the risk that you may never be able to get it approved.

QLD guys just recently got to see a Factory Five up close and personal. We now have one in our club. It was a personal import though, approved and registered with side pipes and all the other nice original stuff.

Personally I wouldn't bother with a Factory Five, although a nice car, they are nothing special. We have as good, if not better Cobras and better Cobra shapes here in Aus. The US has some very nice replicas though, some of those could be worth the hassle.

[Tenrocca]

Originally Posted by 400TT

Personally I wouldn't bother with a Factory Five, they are nothing special. We have better Cobras and better Cobra shapes here in Aus.

There is a thread on the all cobra talk page discussing some changes at FF, where they are looking at using a whole new body shape based on Dick Smiths "198" car.

[Beejay]

Scott,

Our kits are pretty good over here, I do not think it is worthwhile to import unless you were thinking of a Kirkham or an AC.

The Factory Five cars have a huge following, but personally I do not like the shape.

Ben

[spookypt]

Craig...QLD CCC Factory Five?? Who owns that one???

SpookyPT

[Tenrocca]

wouldnt it be great if any Oz manufacturer could put together a complete kit, less drivetrain, for under $25k OZ - even with a perky butt.

[sambo]

I reckon the G-Force stage 4 kit is pretty good value at $24,250.

http://www.gforcesportscars.com.au/stage4.html

[Tenrocca]

Originally Posted by sambo

I reckon the G-Force stage 4 kit is pretty good value at $24,250.

http://www.gforcesportscars.com.au/stage4.html

True - but there is a LOT of stuff int he FF complete kit not included in that package - seats, carpets, instruments, wipers, windscreen, lights indicators, roll bars, exhaust, side pipes etc etc. I think we all know how that stuff adds up.

I think the ERA kit at around the same price in the US would be the one Id go for is I was a yank. Better shape, great reputation, not quite as "inclusive" though, but probably better resale. They also do a 289 for about the same price I think and a GT40 kit for around $40k.

[sambo]

Economies of scale my friend! Probably more FF cars sold in the States than all of those ever produced down here.

[Tenrocca]

Absolutely - just a tiny market. Wonder how many ERA kits you could kit in a shipping container

[LoBelly]

I think that if I were to start afresh then I would be looking very seriously at some of the US kits.

Mostly because of the inclusions, that is the amount of stuff you dont have to buy.

It is true that some items like the lenses, seats and belts may not meet the ADR's but overall - even when you have to purchase those items again - the price is very good.

The points mentioned by 400TT are fair enough but practically speaking they would all have to be addressed in any ICV build anyway.

If you line up an engineer in advance s/he will probably be able to guide you on equivalancy of standards so that you'll know what you can and cannot use. You might then be able to do a better price (even marginally) with the supplier on the basis that some parts cannot be used - or the supplier may have an alternative (possibly pricier) part that is ok.

Its the economy of scales thing that kills us on price here. Its the reason Ford Australia won't be doing its 6cyl anymore - the economies of scale have overcome the tyranny of distance. (that and the FTA)

Its great that G-Force publish thier prices and give you the options. They would be a contender in my reconing. An order from FinishLine or other supplier might help close out the parts list.

My kit was old and incomplete when I purchased it, find all the bits was extrordinarily time consuming, even with the good advice available here. I also had to make a number of things.

After all that the idea that you can have practically everything you need arrive for a set price is very attractive and for me would outweigh the possible inconvenience of having to do a RHD conversion. Most of the US kit makers have pretty good photos of their frames and since it will be in bits swapping any brackets etc shouldn't be too difficult.

Last bit of advice - do your sums carefully

I just ordered about half a pallet of goodies and while the price still worked out to be better than available retail here it was nothing like being the super discount that it looked like after applying the conversion rate.

The shipping from the US was $477 ($567AUD @.84c) but it cost me $1319 to get it out of the Customs Clearance agents warehouse after the addition of GST and thier 8 different fees (there was $0 duty on my 1965 race car parts).

[400TT]

Originally Posted by LoBelly

The points mentioned by 400TT are fair enough but practically speaking they would all have to be addressed in any ICV build anyway.

You sure about that. I must not have the courage and conviction required.

I worry about getting a chassis beaming and torsional tested, I expect it's quite possible that a US chassis would not pass our tests, so modifications would need to be made. I've built numerous Oz Cobras and already knew before purchase that the chassis already had torsional testing papers.

Also who has installed anti-intrusion bars. My Cobras have always had these pre-installed and approved.

Also changing from LHD to RHD worries me as I expect it would require anything from minor chassis modifications to major chassis modifications depending if the drivetrain is offset.

Also there are limits to how complete the vehicle can be and how much work can be done by one supplier. From what I know, a rolling chassis is about all an overseas manufacturer can do for you, otherwise it's not considered an ICV.

Plus if it's a vehicle that's eventually going to be registered, it sounds like there are extra registration processes when the chassis is imported.

I've seriously considered getting a US kit approved here, but the process is fraught with problems, hidden expenses and possible lack of registration at the end. It used to be easier, but as we know, nothing is easy these days.

Makes getting a local approved kit registered, a walk in the park, relatively speaking.

[Strw]

Thanks everyone for your advice. This is obviously something that will have to be explored further before any decisions can be made. I was mainly looking in this direction because of price.

400TT - The kit comes complete but not put together everything is in boxes so it may still be called an icv and allowed to import.

Scott

[*Cobber*]

Go for a holiday to the States build one there (RHD) and import it as a personal import?

Probably not that simple but it would be good fun.

Just a thought.

[400TT]

Scott, let us know how you go.

[Plums]

This may be little naeive, but I reckon the LHD to RHD conversion would be pretty straight forward (assuming they run the driveline down the centreline of the car). I think that would be the least of your worries....

[mr bruce]

can you mates elaborate on this torsional/ beaming test. I have an inquiry for a cheetah http://www.imagestation.com/album/pi...95964314&idx=2 and would like to know what the requirements are, thanks

[auscobra]

Originally Posted by sambo

I reckon the G-Force stage 4 kit is pretty good value at $24,250.

http://www.gforcesportscars.com.au/stage4.html

You might also want to ring GForce for the latest prices. The parts page on the same site states it is 2004 prices.

[LoBelly]

400TT:

This is what you would need to do once you get it here:

Chassis would need to pass beaming & torsional testing.
Need door side intrusion bars fitted to ADR specs.
If in QLD etc you would also need a fibreglass impact test.
Convert it to right-hand drive. Not sure about factory five, but they might offset the engine/tunnel to the right-hand side.
Pretty sure you would have to do your own engine/transmission mounts for LS1 or Boss 5.4.
Find an engineer that is happy to approve something like this.
Got through more drama than most with local transport authority

When I wrote that the above items would have to be addressed I was saying that having an imported chassis or a domestic chassis makes no difference to the engineer, the engineer still has to be satisfied - and it may be the case that there is some local overlay/regulation on top of the ADR.

By way of example, I purchased a kit that someone else had given up on - the kit was in Perth. I rang RMC (took some time to find them) and they told me they knew the kit - the guy had been trying to offload it around the place, the chassis was the 'old single rail' not the 'new double rail' chassis and that it would never be legal for registration. So, not such a great start.

A short while later I'm at the engineer's, after looking it over he tells me the chassis is fine and that it will pass. I tell him about the conversation with the kit manufacturer, he tells me the ADR does not specify a torsional/beam number but rather that the chassis has to be (in the opinion of the engineer) suitable for the application.

I think it is the case that the chassis would not have passed in Perth because they have a local requirement for a specific rigidity.

Similarly he sketches out the layout of the side intrusion - tells me what size steel to buy and how its all to be connected. Which bolt are to be what spec etc, etc, etc.

My experience is limited to one car, and ultimately I decided not to go the ICV route anyway, so maybe no-one should take too much notice - however - having been through the ringer of being told my car could never be registered and the hassle of collecting and manufacturing parts for assembly I still feel that the high base that you'll get for a build from an imported US kit makes a compelling argument.

LoBelly

[Plums]

I have heard two completely different stories regarding chassis torsion testing.
The first one is a "nightmare story". Firstly, you must have just a bare chassis, that will be bolted to a concrete slab. You must provide/supply the slab, with anchor points (specific types of Dynabolt apparently). The chassis is "jacked" at certain points to "flex" it. Dial indicators measure the deflection to determine the torsional stiffness. There were some other things mentioned but I kind of tuned out after a while... This is fairly expensive I was told, somewhere around $2000....

The second story seems almost too easy. With a completed car with wheels in the air (suspension at full droop), you simply jack one corner of the car to measure the chassis twist. Simple and cheap...

Which one is right??? Buggered if I know!!!