LS engine tuning

[sambo]

I'm looking at buying the HP Tuner Pro software and a wideband O2 sensor gauge kit with a view to doing my own edits to the ECU, eg, knock out VATS, change fan temps, engine tuning, in addition to monitoring AFRs using an in car gauge and logging to a laptop.

Bobby (Plums) has given me plenty of pointers with regards to choice of software and wideband kit, and I know there will be TONS more reading before this gets off the ground, but just interested to see whether anyone else might be keen to get involved and perhaps share some of the costs?

It looks like roughly $1000 for the tuning software, allowing 4 computers to be edited and the wideband AFR gauge can be shared around and costs about $350 landed here. The full setup allows fine tuning of the engine in real-time on the road using a laptop, similar to what you would achieve with a dyno.

Bobby said if there's enough interest he'll contribute his know-how via this forum - most generous! I should be at next week's Vic club meeting so feel free to approach me about it there - I'll buy you a beer.

Cheers

Sambo

[Gav]

Can the software be shared among multiple users? Are peripheral leads available?
If so I am keen.

[sambo]

Gav, yes it comes licensed for 4 VINs and I don't believe that it 'locks' to one laptop or user. Will defer to Plums for a definite answer there! All leads and software included in the package, ready to go.

[boxhead]

I would be very intersted too.
If you can let me know more regarding is it software that can be shared onto a second laptop?
I would most likely prefer to buy my own wide band AFR gauge (save having to post it half way around Australia and risking damage)

And can you buy multiple leads so everyone has there own set?

Also I will need to buy a laptop for this, it will only be used for tuning the car.
So any puter experts out there can advise what is the specs I would be looking for and where can I get these at the best prices?
New or Second hand?

[sambo]

Boxhead, I know the leads are fairly standard and can be picked up for around $30. Looking at the minimum specs for HP Tuner software, you will get away with just about any spec laptop when buying new (starting at around $700). Second hand I wouldn't bother as you are not likely to get a warranty.

[Plums]

Sorry Sambo, I should have clarrified this earlier.

The Software is "locked" to a dongle which connects the laptop to the ECU via the OBDII port. Yes you can share it around, but because you physically need the dongle/cables to connect to your car, you really need the other people to live in the same vicinity as you. Though if you wanted to, you could just post the dongle/cables backwards and forwards. Each person can have the software loaded onto their own laptop, then they just need the dongle/cables when they want to tune/scan their car.

As I've told a few people now, if anyone buys the software, I will help them tune their own car. I just figured to make it much less time consuming for me, I could provide info/answers/solutions via this forum. This way I won't have to explain the same things to multiple people.

[sideshow]

leads are just usb leads
the unit needs to be with the car to be tuned
so u would have to send the loom and the application key once it is loaded on the pc to that person tuning it

software is not locked to any pc

anyway there is abit involved in getting a perfect tune
but i guess if u want just a slight improvement then this is the go
tuning on the road is dangerous and can get u in trouble
trust me when we used to tune rally cars 15 years ago the road tester guy got sprung afew times
best to try get someone email u a half decent tune but make sur eits from a similar year

and if u have a brand new ecu then u cant just use this software to push a tune in
u need a tech2 scanner and tis2000 software to push a vin into the factory ecu first
then u can suck the tune of with the tuning software then go from there

soooo many backyard tuners/shops can tune a fatory commodore
but when it comes to these crate motors where the ecu is new and is not in a facotry car with all the other electrical components then they have no f ing idea and they then can run into problems like throttle drop outs
the tis software is just as expensive as the hp tuners stuff and a tech2 is 4 to 5 g
this is why it costs alot for a start up flash and tune on a new ecu

the software comes with 8 credits
it doesn tmean 4 vins
to tune a basic car gen 3 or 4 u need 2 vins per car
to go mafless and this means proper mafless not just turning off the maf meter
costs 1 or 2 credits extra
so if u want to tune a gen 4 and to do a proper mafless tune u need 4 credits
plus u need to know what to do in the software

u cannot tune the engine in real time while driving
u need to turn engine off do yr adjustments then save then rewrite the tune to the ecu

[sambo]

Bobby, I suspected something like that. Dongle protection (obvious jokes aside) is nothing new and to be honest I probably wouldn't want to be posting it all over the country side - it's 9/10ths of the value of the package. Sorry boxhead... hope you understand.

Thanks for the info Sideshow. I don't plan on removing the MAF because it's nowhere near as restrictive as the MAF on the LS1. So it's 4 tunes/VINs based on that. As for "real time" tuning I guess I got that wrong... real time logging perhaps, then offline tweaking and around she goes.

So what's the going rate for an E38 with VIN and Commodore base tune?

[sambo]

Links to HP Tuners software and AEM wideband kit:

http://www.hptuners.com/products/vcmsuite.php

http://www.aempower.com/ViewCategory.aspx?CategoryID=67

[Aussie Mike]

I have a wideband O2 you are welcome to use. It's a Tech Edge 2A0 unit with a bosch sensor.

I've been thinking about buying some tuning software to have a fiddle for a while now.

I'll try to remember to bring the Wideband O2 along on Wednesday.

Cheers

[boxhead]

No worries Sambo, I thought that might have been the case and why I was happy to buy my own AFR (same fear as you have).

[stiffy]

SAMBO,


Is you car that close to starting ??????



STIFFY

[sambo]

'fraid not Stiff. Engine/gearbox fitted but not much else. Just working through my options at this stage.

[Plums]

Geez Sideshow, you're really killing the enthusiasm here aren't you!!!

These guys will get more than just a "slight improvement".......

[sambo]

Plums, do you know if there's any way to write a VIN to a blank ECU without requiring an expensive tech 2 scanner as sideshow mentioned?

[Tails]

HP Tuners isn't tied to a VIN per se. Your software is tied to your serial # of your dongle and the make/model/year of your PCM. The credits you buy go towards the year of the car or PCM you have. Take for instance my license file I can edit and 1999, 2000, 2002 FBody PCMs, 04-05 GTO's. Get the picture?

Also take note. I don't know which interface you have. Either the USB or the EIO interface. The older USB interface will no longer be supported by HPTuners come Sept 30th 2009. That means you will no longer be able to purchase licenses for that interface. You will have to upgrade to the EIO interface which uses a "credit" based system. Much easier and efficient when it comes to purchasing licenses IMO..

I've been using HPTuners for about 5 years now to tune my cars along with friends hotrods. Pretty cool. Have fun with it. Read, read, read. And when you get tired read somemore before you dive headfirst into the editor and make changes. The helpfile has grown alot with the latest release. Also make sure visit their forum. Lots of good info there: http://www.hptuners.com/forum/
Most of all have fun and make one change at a time..

Tails

[Plums]

Yes there is a way to program a new PCM without any special equipment.

LS1's can be tuned in real time, but at this stage you can't tune the 6 litre's in real time. As Sideshow mentioned, they have to be done the old fashioned way; switch the car off, flash in the program, then start the process again.

The only difference between a normal MAFless tune and a "proper MAFless tune" (or SD Enhanced option) is the ability to retain the dual spark table functionality.
Personally, I always enable the SD enhanced option on MAFless cars. Is it essential? Definitely not.
Just so everybody knows, there is a lot more to a MAFless tune than just removing the MAF and turning off the MAF DTC. I'll leave it at that.

As Sideshow quite rightly mentioned, you need to know what you are doing with the software. Hopefully, I can help the people who take the plunge and give it a go themselves. I will attempt to write up "how to's" on this forum, and where possible I'll even send programs to people that will get them very close to the final product, with just minor tweaking required. I did this for "Ledge" from this forum, and his car had a fully built motor, large cam and even individual throttle bodies.....

[ledge]

Hi All
Yes Plums has been a great sorce of advice for me and assisted greatly my mate who is tuning my car.
There is massive improvements available for the LSx and having your own software makes it possible to keep it tuned with no matter what you add to your engine.
My standard engine and tune made 190kw at the wheels and with engine and now
exhaust improvements its over 300kw at the wheels . HOLD ON.

If plums has the time to give all of us some advice then my hat is off to him.
Deffinetly worth buying the software especially if you intend to mod your engine on the future.
The software comes with 8 credits, My tune used 6 but my engine is quite extreme.
You could probably tune 3 cars with the 8 credits if you knew what you where doing
regards
Paul

[sambo]

Thanks for the encouragement Paul. Your car is living proof that the Skyline rear end is good for 400HP - nice! What ratio are you running? My 4.11 has to go...

[Plums]

Sambo, don't get rid of the 4.11's, with the 6 speed you can have great acceleration AND good cruising....

Thanks for the kind words Ledge, I'm glad to hear it's running well...