NJ Fiberglass repair for BDR hood? and some other questions...

Mattnshilp · #1 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 01:34 PM

Hi all,

I finally joined the club!

I had been saving up for a build from Jay at Vintage (which will still happen) but I realized that I truly didn't know what options or engine to chose. I figured the best way to decide is to buy an affordable pre-owned vehicle with a decent engine and just drive the thing.

I found an older BDR (2005) #348 built by Greater Cincinatti Performance with a Mark Howell 351W, 6 speed Tremec TKO 600, Mass Flo fuel injection, Ceramic coated exhaust with just over 4K miles in great shape and local. I have a Dyno which shows 460HP but it indicated Holly Carbs on the paper, so I'm not sure how accurate that is. I was surprised to see a 351W putting out 460HP (even at the crank), but who knows...

The car's interior is a beautiful beige but the exterior color is not my first choice. It's Prism Red, with bronze mist stripes. She's gorgeous, but I just like the blue with white/silver stripe better. Since it's a car I'm learning on and plan on selling, I was OK with the color...

My intention is to drive this for the summer, enjoy it and learn as much as I can about the car and the engine it has. I'll sell her towards the end of the summer (or beginning of next year) and then start building my keeper with Jay when I actually have a fund of knowledge to build a car.

So, here's my questions:

1) The hood has a small 1 inch by 3 inch chip where the hood top hit the garage door track when it was raised on a lift. Is there anyone in central NJ who I can get the car to who can fix this up right?

2) Can I get touch up paint for these cars, and from whom?

3) The car drove well for the first hour of my drive home. But I was underwhelmed by the power the car showed. It never gave me that throw you back experience I was expecting. Even from a smaller V8. I have driven an Audi RS4 (420HP V8) and a Ferrari 360 (400HP V8) and they both gave grunt at whatever gear you where in, whenever you wanted it.

After an hours drive, the car started to choke (meaning that even with the throttle engaged, it lunged and failed repeatedly) and eventually stalled. It felt like the fuel pump wasn't providing enough fuel, or something like that.

It's currently at my local mechanic (who I really trust) and I am sure he will find the problem.

My question is, do you guys think there was a problem all along and the car has way more to give and I just never got her full power? Or was the first hour pretty typical for a 351W and did I learn my first lesson - that I need a bigger engine?

Thanks everyone!

-Matt

Cashburn · #2 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 02:04 PM

I like your long term plan... haha just kidding

That's a great way to find out what you really want and/or need in a car and you bought in at a nice price from what I can tell. The Prism Red is a GM paint code that is posted on this forum somewhere so you can have it mixed and it should be close. That color has a huge following in Mid-America, I think 80% of all Prism Red cars sold were at GCPC.

Your engine was probably originally setup with a holley carb and that's where it dynoed at 460HP. I'd bet if you went back to that you'd have 60 or more HP then you have now the the Mass-Flo. We installed one of those systems and it was a battle and a half. We changed mucho parts and I think a custom tune to get it where we thought it should be.

Granted the Mass-Flo system today could be another animal, but I bet the one you have predates our experience.

Don't be afraid to bring it up. I can have that hood fixed and get you sorted if it does not work out in NJ. Our truck and trailer is down your way all the time and usually empty in one direction or the other.

Mattnshilp · #3 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 02:11 PM

Thanks Jay.

Something told me you would be my first responder... :-)

Is it a big deal to convert back to a Holley Carb? (meaning, how much we talking?)
How long would I be without the car if I sent it your way? I just got her and the summer's half done as is.... :-(

-Matt

wrogers55 · #4 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 02:28 PM

I would get that Mass Flo system worked out before I even considered changing it back to a carb. I have one on a 418 and it is absolutely flawless. Starts every time on one or two cylinder hits, no matter how long it has been sitting and is immediate in throttle response. Dyno'ed at 560+ and gets 18 mpg on the highway with a TKO 600 road race 5th and 3.10 BMW rear. GCPC put mine together as well and the motor is by Howell. I have been inside it to change out a couple of gaskets and found nothing but the best parts in there.

Something is very wrong if your motor, at at least 450+ HP, isn't capable of scaring the crap out of you once in a while. Very wrong. I bet when you get it tuned right it will be a different animal. Call Mass Flo, I have found them to be very helpful.

Mattnshilp · #5 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 02:41 PM

OK. Thanks Wayne. Good to know. Mine took several turn overs to start from the moment I picked her up.

I'm waiting (not so patiently) to get the car back next week. Hopefully he'll find what's up and get her straightened out without significant investment...

I still need to find someone local to fix my hood though...

For now, I'm in a holding pattern.

-Matt

Cashburn · #6 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 03:51 PM

Start with filters and checking the injectors. It's worth getting it on a chassis dyno and tuned once the obvious things are taken care of. Some people love the system, we had a bad experience getting it going and since that time there are multiple other systems on the market that are easier and/or better from a performance standpoint.

One other thing to look at first... the fuel pump kit MF sells with it, the big pump they were using is a pig and prone to fail or fail slowly. I bet a new pump would make an instant difference.

cHarley · #7 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 04:46 PM

I have #358 I am thinking it’s the one Jay is talking about. I changed the fuel pump to #MAA-4261FI form Summit Racing, this is what Mass-Flo suggested.
It runs better but it still doesn’t scare me.
You may want to start with it.

cHarley

1985 CCX · #8 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 05:51 PM

Here's an idea!
Have an aluminum hood made, it will make a great touch on a great car. I am doing it through PanelCraft. See there add on this site........

Mattnshilp · #9 (**permalink**) 07-29-2011, 07:28 PM

I heard an agonal whine from behind me when key is turned before starter is pressed.
An inconsistent whine constantly changing in speed and tone. That's what made me suspect the fuel pump....

dowright · #10 (**permalink**) 07-30-2011, 10:28 AM

I have BDR #953. I recently had fuel system tuning done by Dean Nickerson of Nickerson Performance in Bristol, PA. I could not be more pleased. His website is Nickerson Performance Competition Carburetors, Marine, Automotive, Motorcycle and Personal Watercraft. My motor is a 347 Ford Racing small block with a Quick Fuel HR-650. You might give him a call.

SkipB · #11 (**permalink**) 07-30-2011, 05:46 PM

Matt,

Pretty much any good bodyshop can fix your hood. Ask around about fiberglass experts. Guys that specialize in Corvettes are a good place to start. Also, ask around about top bodyshops and painters. Also check some of their completed jobs. It sounds like matching the color should not be too hard. The hard part is finding a painter who can do blends well.

SkipB

1985 CCX · #12 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 10:13 AM

Matt

Make it special = aluminum hood.........

Mattnshilp · #13 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 06:21 PM

Does anyone know the paint color code for Bronze Mist? My stripes are involved in the repair.

I found the Prism Red code.

saltshaker · #14 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 06:32 PM

He has built carbs for me before....by far the BEST!
Jon

mrmustang · #15 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattnshilp

Does anyone know the paint color code for Bronze Mist? My stripes are involved in the repair.

I found the Prism Red code.

Where in NJ are you located, a location would help in finding you a quality fiberglass friendly body/paint shop in NJ

Bill S.

Mattnshilp · #16 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 08:05 PM

Warren. At the intersection of 287 and 78.

mrmustang · #17 (**permalink**) 07-31-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mattnshilp

Warren. At the intersection of 287 and 78.

I know the area quite well, my brother lives in Warren......Nearest fiberglass friendly who can handle your repair would be Troast Autobody, RT46 west in Rockaway, NJ..........There may be others, but none I personal know that can handle your spot repair.

Bill S.

Mattnshilp · #18 (**permalink**) 08-16-2011, 04:00 PM

Just a follow up.

The air flow sensor to the fuel injection system was broken.

The car now has an entirely and completely brand new Mass-Flo EFI system specifically designed for the engine, which turned out to be larger then the original owner knew...

It has a 351W stroked to a 393 with aluminum heads. The original EFI had nozels spec'd for an un-stroked standard 351W engine.

Runs great!

I have an appointment with a body shop to get that hood fixed up as well. Now she'll be perfect!

Thanks to everyone for the help!