Starting Problems

genolan · #1 (**permalink**) 05-05-2015, 04:17 PM

This has happened several times over the last two years and doesn't correlate to anything.

After a 45 min run I parked it in the driveway and tried to start it 30 min later no cranking everything else worked. The voltage on the gauge read 12v and dipped .5 and stayed pretty solid when I tried to crank it. I put a jump starter on it and it fired right up. I then turned it off and fired it up with out the jumper no problem. The voltage when running is 14v and the battery is new.

Starter to hot? Any ideas?

Zoom This · #2 (**permalink**) 05-05-2015, 04:34 PM

I had starting trouble early on with my first Cobra. High torque starter solved slow crank speed when engine was hot.

genolan · #3 (**permalink**) 05-05-2015, 05:53 PM

What High Torque starter fits a 351W stroked to 408 matted to a TKO500 transmission?

jhv48 · #4 (**permalink**) 05-05-2015, 06:05 PM

Before you start replacing starters, try insulating it from the heat. There are starter shields that can be installed to protect your starter from engine/header heat. Check out Summit.com. They've got a few different kinds.

Seagull81 · #5 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 12:59 AM

Make sure you have a large ground wire from one of the starter bolts to the frame. I used a battery cable for mine.

genolan · #6 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 05:51 AM

I'm not sure the heat soak is my problem when it happens the starter doesn't crank at all. When I jump it she starts right up and will restart with out a jump. Almost seems like something the starter isn't getting the correct voltage and once the jump is put on all is good. That would lead me to the battery but it happened on my old battery and a brand new one.

Tommy · #7 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 06:30 AM

Jumping the battery also moves the battery cable. Perhaps the battery cable is the problem. ... If its not too hard to do, next time the problem pops up, run jumper cables from the battery to the corresponding contacts near the starter (to augment the existing cables) and see if that solves the problem.

genolan · #8 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 06:54 AM

The battery cables are tight, as mentioned before it has happened about 5 times and once the car was sitting all night so a hot starter can also be ruled out. Next time I'll take the battery negative and jump it to chassis ground and se if that solves the problem.

Dwight · #9 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 06:59 AM

remove your cables, check to see they are clean bare metal. Put a little grease on them before installing them.

Dwight

Texasdoc · #10 (**permalink**) 05-06-2015, 03:26 PM

Doesn't sound like heat if it doesn't work first thing in the morning or if it starts right up again right after the jump. Although, adding jumper cables makes it sound like it is a battery connection issue. Make sure your block is grounded. You can even add a ground strap from the starter mounting bolts to the frame. If you have a faulty ground somewhere, that could make it an intermittent problem.

Sometimes you have a dead spot in the starter coil. Try rolling the car just a bit (1mph) then let out the clutch with it in gear. See if it starts then. Not sure why this works since it doesn't rotate the starter coils, but my buddys does this and it works. Or... you can try banging the starter with a hammer - the vibrations can move the starter coils ever so slightly - enough to create the magnetic field to engage the starter. If this works, you likely need a new starter.

If you have a Ford style starter, make sure the solenoid is getting 12v+ from the battery and a 12v signal from the starter circuit. Then make sure the starter is getting 12v from the solenoid (make sure to disable the ignition so the car doesn't start while you are testing).

If you have a GM style starter (solenoid attached to the starter) it is easier to test as all the parts are in the same location by the starter. Still, the same applies. Make sure you are getting 12v to the battery terminal and 12v to the solenoid terminal when the key is twisted.

With either type, you should hear the click of the solenoid when you turn the key/push the start button. If you hear the click, it is likely the starter or the wiring from the solenoid to the starter (Ford style), or battery supply to the starter (GM style). If no click, the signal from the key to the solenoid is getting interrupted.

CHANMADD · #11 (**permalink**) 05-07-2015, 09:53 AM

This used to be a common problem. There should be a relay installed in the low current....ie the small wire that goes to the solenoid. The resistance gets too much in the wire and not enough current gets to the solenoid to activate it. A relay with a wire takeing current from the battery to the solenoid , through the relay should work..

CHANMADD · #12 (**permalink**) 05-07-2015, 09:55 AM

So the current going to the starter does not go through the ignition switch..

genolan · #13 (**permalink**) 05-07-2015, 10:56 AM

I am not fully following but it sounds like you might be correct. My backdraft is #382 and was built in 2006. I also don't follow your fix, do you have a wiring diagram?

eedeutsch · #14 (**permalink**) 05-07-2015, 11:46 AM

I had starting and running problems with my Backdraft. Question, do you have a Pertronix distributor? If so that might be the problem. When I changed to a MSD pro-billet it made a ton of difference in my car.

genolan · #15 (**permalink**) 05-08-2015, 07:03 AM

The distributor can't be the problem the car doesn't crank.

Gaz64 · #16 (**permalink**) 05-09-2015, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHANMADD

This used to be a common problem. There should be a relay installed in the low current....ie the small wire that goes to the solenoid. The resistance gets too much in the wire and not enough current gets to the solenoid to activate it. A relay with a wire takeing current from the battery to the solenoid , through the relay should work..

Yes agree, this is what you need to do.

All cars should have this.

genolan · #17 (**permalink**) 05-10-2015, 07:25 AM

I don't understand what you are saying, Does the car have a relay that needs replacing or it doesn't have one and needs one. If the latter is the case what is the relay control mechanism?

Tim7139 · #18 (**permalink**) 05-10-2015, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dwight

remove your cables, check to see they are clean bare metal. Put a little grease on them before installing them.

Dwight

Before you do anything, do this. Wire brush terminals and cable ends, particularly ground.
You likely have a sulfated terminal.
You'd be amazed how a little of this kills your connection. Used to happen all the time on the '68-'69 corvettes due to lousey venting in the battery compartment behind the seat.

Gaz64 · #19 (**permalink**) 05-11-2015, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by genolan

I don't understand what you are saying, Does the car have a relay that needs replacing or it doesn't have one and needs one. If the latter is the case what is the relay control mechanism?

It's quite common for starter solenoids to not energise if there is some resistance in the circuit.

Adding a relay makes the solenoid current path direct from the battery to the solenoid.

The ignition switch and neutral start switch form the low current path to activate the relay.

chicagocat · #20 (**permalink**) 12-06-2017, 05:59 AM

Reviving an old thread. My Backdraft (351/427 with Powermaster Master Torque starter) displays the behavior that Texasdoc describes above. That is, once in a great while, it won't start. No solenoid click, nothing. It's not heat soak, the car can be cold when this happens.
When this does happen, the trick of putting it in gear, pushing the car a few inches, then back to neutral and starting ALWAYS works. So I think it's not electrical.
My guess is that there's a bad spot on the flywheel gear with bad teeth and if the car stops on those teeth, it won't start next time. But then I should hear the solenoid click, right?
Thoughts? Thanks.