Opinions Please - BDR or Other Builders of BDR

[EM65Cobra]

Short history to explain why I'm here asking:

Cobra V1 - I purchased my first EM Cobra about 2 years ago with a blown motor and tranny. I had a local rod shop put a 347 stroker motor with a large street cam and a Demon carb. It has an AOD trans. Motor and Trans have about 1k miles on them since install. Car looks great and has a tan soft top for it. It's been dressed up a good bit. Per a request from the wife I'm part way through adding AC via the Vintage Air Front Runner System. Engine bay part is done. Just need to install the cabin side. Here's some pics: https://mightytext.net/zFYtS3

It gets tons of attention. I love it but with the solid rear 9" axle and not enough HP it didn't have the performance on the track I was looking for.

Cobra V2 - I ended up picking me up another EM Cobra that I had planned on autocrossing and road tracking. This one I put a new paint job on it but otherwise is pretty much as I got it. It has a 410 stroker motor with a Richmond 5 speed. This one however has the Corvette suspension on both front and rear so it has good power and great handling. Here's some pics of it: https://mightytext.net/zPhP6l

So now that I've owned and driven two very different cobras I've learned what I like and don't like so my plan is to sell both and have a BDR made with the best of both worlds exactly as I want it. I don't want to spend the time or money to make all of the mods I'd want to do to get either of the EM Cobras to be my "perfect" version of the car I'm looking for.

I stopped by BDR in Florida this week (I was getting off a cruise ship and their office was 15 minutes down the road so I had to stop by) and they don't have a roller like I'd like in the color/interior I want so I'm going to have to order it. I'll probably go with a custom color and I have some very specific interior design ideas that I'd like to incorporate (i.e. - not the standard look).

I'm planning on having a car (when it's finished) that's a bit more towards a show car status like V1 but with a more powerful powerplant, better suspension, better transmission. While we love to show the car we also want one that is great for LONG drives (so reliable), comfortable in the cabin (so soft and hard tops), but still has the racing capability to keep me entertained.

So my main question is based on the groups opinions: Should I order 100% through the BDR main office or one of the many Customizer/Resellers that work with BDR to get a roller and then finish it for me? Pros/Cons of each.

Keep in mind, I'm 10 hour drive from BDR in Florida. I'm in the upstate of South Carolina. While I don't have to have a local reseller (because there aren't any that I know of) the further away I get from home the less I want to go because of after the sale support.

So besides the above question, the only other one I'm trying to figure out is which engine and tranny package I should go with:
* I want it to look good
* I want it to be 500+ hp
* I want it to be reliable

The last question is from the guys that have BDRs, what options do you wish you had gotten and/or wish you had not gotten in your cars?

Looking forward to your thoughts,

Thanks

[tpatodd]

[rubs his hands together]... its cold here in Tampa today.

I would suggest you take a little time and go through all the BDR threads here on this site. Your question on "who to use for the build" has been asked A LOT and I think you will see an overwhelming response and direction.

As far as options, etc that is too personal to ask. I wish mine was EFI but as soon as my carb acts up I will make that switch. Just go through the options and ask yourself: Do I want it or need it? Does it help or hurt resale?

Best of luck-- I do love my BDR and all the attention she gets!

[Millsy]

Like tpatodd said read through the BDR Forum and you will find your answer pretty quickly. If you dont feel like reading then the simple answer is Vintage Motorsports. You can contact the owner Jay right here on the forum under the handle Cashburn. I had a list of very specific one offs I needed on my BDR build and Jay and his brother Brian came through on all the promises they made. Your build sounds very specific and that is what Vintage excels at. They have alot of experience with high performance, high end builds. Sitting down with paper and pen and writing down what exactly you want the car for will help you prioritize what options or mods are needed. Jay has built 800 h.p. beasts and thats fine for someone who wants to drag their car but h.p. wasnt a priority for myself who drives my BDR on the street only. If you are going to seriously track the car then you definitely need to do some suspension upgrades without a doubt. H.P is a personal thing and being able to use it is the main goal obviously. I am incredibly anal about my cars and bikes and pretty much everything else in my life. I dont have one bad word to say about Vintage Motorsports, they are men of their word and you dont find that often these days.

[Ozzie Goat]

My car was 'assembled' in FL
Please, call Jay at Vintage

[Blittleton]

get the Backdraft with everything you want. It is a great looking cobra with all the handling that you would want. Street/Track what ever the use, you can't go wrong. I'm tired of the carburetors, so I went fuel injection. cost a little more but worth it to me. Use Backdraft Dealers that can setup your car for what ever your needs are. I'm sure all the dealers can give you a hand, but check out VMS in Connecticut.

[BDR_Boy]

The only three things I would do differently...

1) Go with a big block (I went stroked small block)
2) Go with a chrome over brass windshield frame, not the standard aluminum.
3) Go with VMS for my build.

Beyond that... as others have stated... I love my BDR and the attention it generates.

[spdbrake]

This recent thread might help you possibly decide on where to or where not to purchase a Backdraft.Got delivery yesterday and need some help

While I can't speak 1st hand on a new purchases of a BDR, I can say Jay (aka Cashburn) from VMS and James Yale with Radical Roadsters here in TX is also supportive. Other than that I haven't seen Boo as far as tech support questions from the Boynton Beach Factory folks.

Funny that Jay's shop is not listed on the Backdraft site as a dealer...hmm.

[Mark IV]

Jay is listed as: Revolocity at Vintage Motorsports

[spdbrake]

Originally Posted by Mark IV

Jay is listed as: Revolocity at Vintage Motorsports

Thanks

[lovehamr]

EM65cobra, I've now built 2 BDRs for myself. The first I actually crashed and the second I sold to a great guy in FL who actually paid me more than what I had in it. I'll list a few things that I learned along the way.

#1 At least 5 speeds with not a crazy overdrive.
#2 Fuel injection, the difference is hard to even quantify it's so much better and I'm actually pretty good with carbs.
#3 Power steering as long as it's not over boosted. At speed it doesn't matter, everywhere else it does.
#4 Tonneau cover. On my first one I hardly ever used it and it scuffed the body paint when I did. The second one I installed once just to see if it fit. Then I took it off and never used it again.
#5 Limited slip diff. Get it. I skipped that on the first one and it bit me in the ass - literally. The bimmer open diff is not to bad, will hold the power, and put it down pretty evenly in a straight line but around corners it is quite unpredictable in engagement. Not what you need on a road or autocross course. It is even better on the street.
#6 Solid mounts for the diff, subframe and the engine especially if you're going north of 500hp.
#7 That brings us to the engine. I used an FE in both of mine, stroked and bored with good parts. They made great power 500/500 but were never totally oil tight. My next engine will likely be a Coyote (maybe with a blower) because I'm going to drive the wheels off the thing and want the ease and reliability. Not as pretty or vintage looking under the hood but then I may dress it out with 427SOHC valve covers...
#8 As others have mentioned, talk to Jay! If you need someone else to work on it once you have it, then you'd be better off shipping it north rather than driving 10 hours south. JMHO but backed by many others. Welcome to VINTAGE Motorsports

Steve BTW, I'm in south GA

[SFcobra 222]

Simply put,

Jay and Brian at Vintage. They are as good as it gets.

[1SwtRide]

I echo each of the referrals to Vintage Motorsports (VMS) provided by the folks in this thread. You can search my user name here to get my detailed thoughts, but I can say without hesitation that VMS is the way to go. Good luck and enjoy!

Originally Posted by Millsy

If you dont feel like reading then the simple answer is Vintage Motorsports. You can contact the owner Jay right here on the forum under the handle Cashburn. I dont have one bad word to say about Vintage Motorsports, they are men of their word and you dont find that often these days.

Originally Posted by Ozzie Goat

My car was 'assembled' in FL
Please, call Jay at Vintage

Originally Posted by Blittleton

but check out VMS in Connecticut.

Originally Posted by Mark IV

Jay is listed as: Revolocity at Vintage Motorsports

Originally Posted by SFcobra 222

Simply put,

Jay and Brian at Vintage. They are as good as it gets.

[EM65Cobra]

Thanks a ton for all the great advice guys. I really appreciate it.

I've reached out to VMS via email from their web site last Wednesday but haven't gotten a reply yet. Maybe they are busy from the after Christmas season. Maybe they'll see this thread and PM me or reply to the email I sent.

I like the comment from BDR_Boy about the chrome over brass windshield. Didn't realize they offered two but aluminum doesn't even make sense. Heck, I think I'd go with stainless steel if it was offered.

As far as reliability and power it sounds like a Coyote engine is the best bet, or at least a stroked out small block with fuel injection.

Having both a soft and hard top is for the wife. If she's happy we'll be driving it more. :-) Same with the headrests, twin roll bars, A/C and heat.

In the meantime a few more questions. Again, I really looking for opinions at this point from guys that have pro/con viewpoints of decisions they've made about their cars.

How much HP in reality can the Cobras handle without being almost useless? I'm not going to "professionally" race the car but I do want to do autox and track days so I want as much as it can reasonably handle.

What are the major pros/cons over the Coyote vs a SBF with fuel injection (assuming both are well built from scratch - not donors)?

I realize this is a BDR thread but what are your feelings about the BDR vs. FFR or SPF? Please, no bashing, just your honest comparison if you've got experience with more than just BDR.

Thanks again, Brian

[lovehamr]

When I was looking for my first Cobra I took the family on a little vacation to the London Cobra Show. There I tried on a variety of replicas and found that I was most comfortable in a BDR. The almost unnoticeable difference in wheel base makes a huge difference in the cockpit comfort level for me. It's also where I met Jay.

[jeffnolan]

Keep in mind that with a Coyote there are a lot of systems that come together to make it work. I’m not an expert on the Coyote but did look at the option for my car and in the final equation determined that it wasn’t more or less reliable than any other engine option, but it did increase complexity quite a bit.

I went with a Smeding 427 built on a 351 Dart block. The motor dynos at 571 HP with a nice broad power band. Runs on pump gas and is, most certainly, very reliable.

Insofar as what is the upper limit for power on these cars, given the weight advantage these cars have over production cars I would say that anything over 450 HP is probably under-utilized. Having said that, you can certainly drive it hard with 600 HP and not be well over your ski tips. The front-mid engine configuration makes for a car with good balance, which works really well in high HP applications. My last track day was up at Thunderhill on the 3 mile layout and Corvettes, Mustangs and Vipers were no match. The Porsches were quite a bit faster because they have much better braking due to their unique balance, so they could come in hotter, brake hard, then accelerate at an increasing rate through the turns to slingshot out of the exit. Having said that, it is a good feeling to go around a track with 50 year old technology, updated components but it’s still analog tech, and put the fear into drivers with much more exotic cars.

[mln385]

Originally Posted by EM65Cobra

Thanks a ton for all the great advice guys. I really appreciate it.

I've reached out to VMS via email from their web site last Wednesday but haven't gotten a reply yet. Maybe they are busy from the after Christmas season. Maybe they'll see this thread and PM me or reply to the email I sent.

I like the comment from BDR_Boy about the chrome over brass windshield. Didn't realize they offered two but aluminum doesn't even make sense. Heck, I think I'd go with stainless steel if it was offered.

As far as reliability and power it sounds like a Coyote engine is the best bet, or at least a stroked out small block with fuel injection.

Having both a soft and hard top is for the wife. If she's happy we'll be driving it more. :-) Same with the headrests, twin roll bars, A/C and heat.

In the meantime a few more questions. Again, I really looking for opinions at this point from guys that have pro/con viewpoints of decisions they've made about their cars.

How much HP in reality can the Cobras handle without being almost useless? I'm not going to "professionally" race the car but I do want to do autox and track days so I want as much as it can reasonably handle.

What are the major pros/cons over the Coyote vs a SBF with fuel injection (assuming both are well built from scratch - not donors)?

I realize this is a BDR thread but what are your feelings about the BDR vs. FFR or SPF? Please, no bashing, just your honest comparison if you've got experience with more than just BDR.

Thanks again, Brian

The Aluminum was the only option if you wanted the soft top , don't know if that is still the case on new models.

[EM65Cobra]

Thanks Lovehamr, good advice and one I'll take if I don't find what I want "mostly" pre-built. PS - Love your Avatar, took me forever to read your post because I kept getting distracted :-)

Good point JeffNolan, If I do go with a Coyote I'd have to have it professionally installed because it's way out of my knowledge base. But the scuttle I've heard on the Coyote is it's more like a modern car; oil, plugs, filter but otherwise mostly forget it. Yes, I was thinking the 550 HP range would be a good sweet spot of plenty but not to to much, and still easily achieved.

Mln385, I'll have to find out if that's still the case.

[1SwtRide]

I sent an email to Jay from VMS to let him know you'd reached out and created this thread. I suspect you're correct -post holiday / new year is always busy. Feel free to email him directly at jay@vintagemotorsports.com. Jay will spend as much time as you need to work through any questions you have, including those you've put in this thread.

John

p.s. I went Coyote 5.0 for the ease of use. While more involved at the outset, in the long run it's a modern drivetrain. Fires up in all weather conditions. I wanted the ease of the modern ECM. The exhaust note is down right beastly, so no sacrifice there.

Originally Posted by EM65Cobra

I've reached out to VMS via email from their web site last Wednesday but haven't gotten a reply yet. Maybe they are busy from the after Christmas season. Maybe they'll see this thread and PM me or reply to the email I sent.

[EM65Cobra]

Thanks John, I'll send him a new email also because I've learned a lot since the first email I sent.

I'd love to hear your Coyote. The lack of BBF sound is one of the main reasons why I would go oldschool because others have told me that the Coyote is much quieter and doesn't have quite the classic rumble we come to expect out of a cobra.

Yes, I think the complexity is in the initial install but would pay off in dividends in the long run with better reliability (which is a key goal).

One person who I know who got a new BDR directly from BDR said they screwed up some of the Coyote install and he almost had to take it to VMS to fix but BDR took care of it. Other than that he loves his but said it was quieter which he actually liked. But being quieter is not a plus for me so that had me somewhat concerned.

So if you are real pleased with the sound of yours I'd love to hear it if you've got a FB or YT video you can share?

Brian

[lovehamr]

Brian you may be right there, I don't know if my next build will be able to match the BB sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02LOy4jjLdQ&t=2s