Need a better designed oil pan

[t walgamuth]

That pan looks perfect!

[Sydney]

(But the pan is still lower than the frame?)

Yes. My frame rails are 5 1/4'', the oil pan is 4 1/4", and the rear cross member is 3 1/4" ground clearance.

It's certainly not ideal, but it's been working.

[Rawkkrawler]

I took an extreme/opposite approach and put some bushings at the motor mounts to lift the motor itself. I also have the Ford Racing 392. I wanted both the 9qt pan as well as a 3" oval filter. With some tweaking I was able to get the bottom of the frame rails level with the pan and also fit the air filter. It's been perfect ever since.

[t walgamuth]

That sounds like it works!

[SBSerpent]

Originally Posted by Rawkkrawler

I took an extreme/opposite approach and put some bushings at the motor mounts to lift the motor itself. I also have the Ford Racing 392. I wanted both the 9qt pan as well as a 3" oval filter. With some tweaking I was able to get the bottom of the frame rails level with the pan and also fit the air filter. It's been perfect ever since.

How big were the bushings? Aside from the air cleaner, how did you handle the headers where they exit the fender cutout?

[Chicagowil]

It is also possible to install a skid plate to protect the pan from being hit directly. Something that is regularly done on off road vehicles.

Thom

[Rawkkrawler]

Originally Posted by SBSerpent

How big were the bushings? Aside from the air cleaner, how did you handle the headers where they exit the fender cutout?

The bushings are about 1" tall, maybe a hair more. And made the headers myself and they angle slightly downwards towards the cutouts so the difference isn't quite the entire bushing thickness. I also had a bit of room in the cutout itself.

[SBSerpent]

Originally Posted by Chicagowil

It is also possible to install a skid plate to protect the pan from being hit directly. Something that is regularly done on off road vehicles.

Thom

Exactly what I did! I describe the details several posts earlier in this chain.

[8litercobra]

I looked at every pan I could find for my new dart aluminum windsor, looking for a shallow pan. Kevco F506 was the best I could find. 7" depth....everything else was 7.5" or more at that time. It's a full depth pan front to back, holds 9 qts.

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by 8litercobra

I looked at every pan I could find for my new dart aluminum windsor, looking for a shallow pan. Kevco F506 was the best I could find. 7" depth....everything else was 7.5" or more at that time. It's a full depth pan front to back, holds 9 qts.

Decent looking pan. Kevko website shows this:

Pan Depth: 7”
Pan Capacity: 10-11 Quarts (9.5-10.4 Liters)
System Capacity: 11-12 Quarts (10.4-11.4Liters)

That's a much different capacity than you indicated - though 9 quarts is still lots.

https://kevkoracing.com/collections/...nt=34324449486

In my case I needed a pan that would reflect the angle the engine was installed. In order to have the bottom of the pan parallel to (and above) the frame rails, it was built with the front of the pan 1 5/8" deeper than the rear. A box pan as shown on the Kevko website wouldn't deal with that.

I paid $520 for the pan, including pickup, so that's not a lot more for a pan custom built to meet my requirements.

[FUNFER2]

I'm surprised that anyone has had problems with their Canton. Some areas of the welding aren't pretty like I weld, but it's not bad enough to leak or separate. I once had a Moroso that sucked. I have all the parts that Canton has for the FE, the working and quality are wonderful.

To the OP, if you drive spirited like I do, have extra oil to cool is nice, but I also have a oil cooler when needed.

[Grubby]

Originally Posted by cycleguy55

Armando's #406 pan is a front sump that's 15" L x 7.5" D x 11.5" W. If that's not shallow enough, you can go with a 3/4 sump that's shallower, but with kick-outs to maintain capacity. Full custom pan built to fit your engine as installed in your car. When I had mine built I took careful measurements to the pan rails and had the pan built to accommodate the angle the engine installation angle. As previously noted, pan bottom is 1/4" above and parallel to bottom of frame rails. Armando's prices include matching pickup and usually a crank scraper tray as well.

This pan is for an FE, but you could have something like that for your 351:

That pan has a lot of sex appeal.

John

[hauss]

Originally Posted by hawretre

Attachment 34916

Don't hate me for having a Gen3 Coyote. I have to look at that butt ugly engine cover.

No hate hear just fix the oil leak by the filter

[hawretre]

Nope! Would really show up on the 911 parked beneath it.

[SBSerpent]

Originally Posted by Sydney

I have the exact Aviad Daytona Coupe pan you mentioned on my 351w. After many years of scraping up my Canton pan, I decided I had to do something a few years ago.

I couldn't be happier with the Aviad pan. I now have over 4" of ground clearance instead of 3". The Aviad pan is a work of art. If I remember right, it did take about 4 months to get after I ordered it, but it was a winter project and it wasn't an issue.

Good luck.

Sydney,
Just sent you a PM

[SBSerpent]

Went to visit the Aviaid shop today. Very impressive shop - where racing oil pans are born!

[Tom Wells]

I'm surprised that anyone has had problems with their Canton.

Put me on that list...

Not so much for ground clearance, but for maintaining oil pressure during spirited cornering. Both my 385 series engines have them and both needed Accusumps installed to prevent loss of oil pressure while cornering. Even on the street a momentary loss of oil pressure can be induced by steering left-right quickly a few times!

This after checking the pickup clearance to be correct according to their recommendation.

BTW guess who makes the Accusump?

I asked the Canton folks once at PRI what data they had to show the pans were effective (their so-called road-race pans) and they said no data, just followed the practice of trap doors, scrapers etc...

When I asked whether they were going to improve them, they responded - no.

I'd do an Aviaid or Armando next time.

My .02,

Tom

[SBSerpent]

So I have decided to go with the Aviaid pan. I loose some oil capacity yet gain a ton of 'piece of mind' and not have to worry about putting holes in my current pan from scraping.

Couple of questions:
1) What type of pan gasket do I use (aside from the steel reinforced rubber one piece)? This particular pan is notched along the rails. I have heard that you use a smooth gasket for notched rails and a ribbed gasket for smooth rails. Inputs? P/N's would also be appreciated.
2) Is there a gasket that goes between the pickup and the pump?
3) RTV ONLY at the corners where the gasket transitions from the rail to the crank?
4) Torque values for the pan bolts and oil pick up bolts?

[cycleguy55]

Originally Posted by SBSerpent

So I have decided to go with the Aviaid pan. I loose some oil capacity yet gain a ton of 'piece of mind' and not have to worry about putting holes in my current pan from scraping.

Couple of questions:
1) What type of pan gasket do I use (aside from the steel reinforced rubber one piece)? This particular pan is notched along the rails. I have heard that you use a smooth gasket for notched rails and a ribbed gasket for smooth rails. Inputs? P/N's would also be appreciated.
2) Is there a gasket that goes between the pickup and the pump?
3) RTV ONLY at the corners where the gasket transitions from the rail to the crank?
4) Torque values for the pan bolts and oil pick up bolts?

If you don't already have them, give serious consideration to installing a set of oil pan reinforcement rails. They'll stop the deformation of the sheet metal on the pan rails that lead to leaks. They're available from a wide variety of sources:



In addition to the reinforcement rails, I also replaced the oil pan bolts with studs and 'flange nuts'. Others may disagree, but IMO the pan is easier to install that way, plus the flange nuts have one way 'teeth' where they meet the pan rails to help prevent loosening.

[hauss]

Originally Posted by Rawkkrawler

I took an extreme/opposite approach and put some bushings at the motor mounts to lift the motor itself. I also have the Ford Racing 392. I wanted both the 9qt pan as well as a 3" oval filter. With some tweaking I was able to get the bottom of the frame rails level with the pan and also fit the air filter. It's been perfect ever since.

What about drive line angels ? Could cause unwanted vibes.